Dual classing

[Lymond]

Much like as in life, I started my most recent IWD game with lofty goals. I didn't think I'd enjoy soloing, so my intent was to make a party of two or three. Because this was my second time playing, I wanted to be more creative with my party and select classes and spells that I avoided the first time around. I wanted to experiment with so many classes that I ended up with five adventurers, as follows:

Paladin
Cleric/Ranger
Bard
Thief/Mage
Fighter

(By the way, inspired by Midget Gems, they are all female)

My intent with the Fighter was to dual class at level six like I've seen you suggest a few times Pritchke. She just reached level six and I was about to dual to the mage when it occurred to me that I might be spreading my points a little too thin. As it is now, because of my multi-classes, I sort of have seven "buckets" to spread the points. If I dual class now, it will be eight and I'm concerned that my party will be too weak at the end of the game and when I do HOW and TOLM.

What do you think?

Lymond

[pritchke]

Not sure what you mean by "Spreading my points a little too thin." What I usually do is try to get 3 in bows, and 2 in another, possibly "long swords". You will lose those as soon as you convert to Mage but you will get to add a new point to slings or something. When you get swords and the bow skill back you will have a decent fighter that can cast stone skins and used in the front line, as an archer, or offensive magic user. She will be a little week at first as soon as you dual but it will be worth it when she gets her skills back. By the time she gets her fighting skills back she should start to have some decent spells. If you feel you have spread your points a little too thin in weapons than there should be no problem in going several more levels as some people do. I just prefer level six, because I like to use magic and I would prefer not to wait. As well you will not end up with the higher level spells as quickly.You will have slightly more hit points, and other benifits of being a fighter longer.

As well I have noticed that you have a Bard, as well as a Thief/Mage, since you have quite a few magic users, it probably would not hurt to build the fighter up another few levels for the extra point.

[ 06-25-2003, 01:31 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

[perlninja]

Having just beaten IWD with my first party, I am in no position to conject, however, what I can say is that I really am enjoying my fighter/mage who dual classed after level 9 fighter; what this has produced is a mage with over 90hp and 4 proficiency points in hammers, 3 in bows. It's neat sending a mage to the front line and he is very effective. So, at this point I consider level 6 too early to dual class. I also would suggest forgoing bow proficiency with a fighter intended to go mage because a dualy mage should use a shield to make up for the lack of heavy armor...as such, missile weapons like slings and darts are better.

[NobleNick]

Lymond,

If it is expo you are worried about, I wouldn't. You should get enough experience by end of IWD to have clvl 13, so should have enough to go to 11 in one class and then to 12 in the second. HoW requires minumum clvl 9; so a dualed clvl 11/12 should be O.K.

If it is proficiency points you are talking about, then keep that fighter around for a while! You won't be sorry, especially if you are going to play HoW and TotLM. I just dualed a fighter lvl 10 over to Druid, and I am very happy with all the PP this guy has stacked up. Of course he can't access them until he hits Druid clvl 11; but... look at all those hitpoints!! (I screwed up: was going to dc him at fighter 9. Oh well, that's a mistake I can live with!!) Oh, and what is really nice is that, for a while, every time a monster looks at him cross-eyed he levels!!

I have two other fighters that I intend to dual over to specialist mage at fighter 9 or maybe even keep one to fighter 13.

Find, below, an old dissertaion I did while researching when to dual over.

**************************************************

Gadzooks!! This information could radically alter the perceived "sweet spots" for dualing over a fighter. Are you sure that you gain a whole extra ApR at grand master, Jim, and not 1/2 at high master? Whew! If so, that is quite a cherry to strive for!

I am trying to put everything I have learned into a comprehensive picture for the fighter; so I know when to dual over. We get extra ApR at 7 and 13; extra PP at 3,6,9,12,...; and extra ApR from stacked PP. Assuming all PP get stacked into one melee weapon and the rest go into bow/missile, and that fighter base ApR (I know I'm going to get this wrong) is 1-1/2. Then the fighter would progress as follows ( +/- stats are "add to level 1 fighter with 1 PP in weapon" for melee weapon):

LVL. . ApR . +d -THAC0
. 1 . . . 2 . . 2 . . 1 (also get 2 PP stacked in bows or missiles)
. 3 . . . 2 . . 3 . . 3
. 6 . . . 2 . . 4 . . 3
. 7 . 2-1/2 . 4 . . 3
. 9 . 3-1/2 . 5 . . 3
.12 . 3-1/2 . 5 . . 3 (get third PP in bows/missile, maxing it out.)
.13 . .. 4 . . 5 . . 3

Wow! Looks like the good break points are levels 3, 7, 9, 12, AND 13, with 9 being really sweet. This is news to me! All of a sudden, the level 13 I have been shooting for does not look all that much better than 12, or even 9!

Party On!

[Lymond]

Sorry for being a little unclear. I was talking about experience points. It was my understanding that if a two character party killed a 1400 point monster, they would each get 700 points. If one was a multi or dual class, then 350 points would go towards each class. I'm worried that my multi and now dual class characters will only be getting enough points to reach level 9 let's say, by the end of the game, so when I get to HOW, I'll be too weak.

That's a good analysis NobleNick. I think I'll dual class at level 7.

Thanks for the help.

Lymond

[Ar-Cunin]

Lymond

Yes, a multiclass character have to stare the XP between the two classes

However a Dualclass 'abandons' (in your case) her first class in favour of the second - so that second class get all the XP. So no problems.

BTW - I dual-class at lvl 7 as well. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Lymond]

Another thought- I'm at level 7 and have decided to dual class. Is specializing the way to go? If so, what specialization?

[NobleNick]

Lymond,
Heh, heh, now you've really opened a can of worms! I say, "Yes! Specialize! But some on this forum whom I highly respect would say, "No! Go general mage. If you search, you can find lengthy discussions on this topic, sponsored by myself and Dundee Slaytern.

The trade-off is that a specialist gets the extra spell per level; but can not learn spells from the opposing school. For me, the extra spell per level far outweighs the inability to learn a small slice of the spells; but others don't like having even that small slice unavailable. Also, I like packing lots of magic along, so have several specialists representing several schools, so all spells are available to at least one mage on my team.

One thing that Dundee and I eventually agreed on was that the choice of school can make a difference in how successful your specialist is: For a party with only one mage the best school to specialize in is probably Illusionist. Evoker (Invoker) is another good school. The worst school (again, for a solo mage) is probably Conjuror.

What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party on!!