Improved (Current Version Tactics) Bodhi (Spoilers)

[Hank Parsons]

I'm not telling you to leave the thread, I'm asking you nicely to stop saying the same criticisms over and over.

You appear to misunderstand Turn Undead, BTW. It is not magic. Why would PfME have anything to do with it?

[Assassin]

Originally posted by Hank Parsons: I'm not telling you to leave the thread, I'm asking you nicely to stop saying the same criticisms over and over. You appear to misunderstand Turn Undead, BTW. It is not magic. Why would PfME have anything to do with it?

PfMW stops Azuredge. Turn Undead is perhaps easier to kill Undead than Azuredge. Why not make all undead immune to that as well?

The criticism that I'm making is that it's wrong to make the game harder just for the sake of making it harder. Your line is that you're willing to make any changes, whether they make sense or not, as long as they make the game harder.

[ 08-25-2004, 06:29 PM: Message edited by: Assassin ]

[Feral]

Dang, I was hoping to make this the 100th post in the thread, but the latest exchange was just too fast. Anyway -

SHE'S DEAD!!! FINALLY!

And, sure, it took: (1) a hasted, enraged, magic shielded (potion of) Korgan wielding Crom and MoD+2 (the latter for permanent NPP) and going through two potions of absorption, all of his healing potions and one charge of the rod of resurrection, and (2) two Dark Planetars, three Mordy's swords (the latter to absorb the cloud of bats), three firestorms (not to mention a Fallen Deva which got toasted so fast that I had to scroll back in the text window just to make sure it even gated in at all). But it’s done.

I actually took a break from SoA for more than a week (because I was frankly discouraged by initial string of failures) and then did a few other quests (gaining a level or two). So, I feel only half-victorious, since I needed the additional levels, not to mention lots of tips, to beat her. In my defense, I installed Tactics when already in ch. 6, so Bodhi was the first Tactics enemy I faced. One of these days, I’ll come back and kill her with a lower level party. For now, I’m off to see Elhan.

Thanks to everyone for their advice on the first two pages of this thread (as well as the spirited debate later).

[ 08-26-2004, 03:05 PM: Message edited by: Feral ]

[chimaera]

But all that they're asking for is that Bodhi *not* be immune to spells and the like that affect everyone else! Take Sunray. It deals damage to everyone. everyone Including the end-of-the-ToB-ending-boss-that's-damn-near-a-god!

Even demiliches?

[Hank Parsons]

Originally posted by Assassin: The criticism that I'm making is that it's wrong to make the game harder just for the sake of making it harder. Your line is that you're willing to make any changes, whether they make sense or not, as long as they make the game harder.

It's "wrong" to do that? I didn't realize this was a question of morality. However, for the sake of discussion, let's grant you that it is wrong to make the game harder for no reason. That wouldn't apply to Tactics either, since Tactics makes it harder for very good reasons. Which have been posted in this thread already.

On your second statement, I would appreciate it if you don't tell me what my line is. I never said that. I have an intelligent limit for what's reasonable in this game, what's justified, and what's story-compatible.

In my opinion it's unreasonable to kill a boss in one hit. There's really nothing wrong with having that preference, is there?

[ 08-26-2004, 03:01 AM: Message edited by: Hank Parsons ]

[Link]

It seems you're ignoring my point as much as I've been ignoring yours apparently (and trust me, I'm going to read your threads and posts thoroughly after I finished posting this one).

I NEVER stated that Tactics was full of shit, on the contrary. In fact, let me say here that I applaud Westley Weimer for his additions and enhancements of the unmodded BG2 (!). Although I find Tactics a fun and decent mod, I do believe (and isn't it my right to state something or believe in something?) that any change to anything should be given a thought or two at the least.

I think everybody here, including Six and me, have stated that they want to mod to be hard, but that we would've done it in a different way. Assassin isn't stating that Bodhi should be her easy-peasy self, he just wants Bodhi to be hard in a legal way. Fights can be made harder just by being more creative. Oh, and wasn't I the one that suggested the multiple fights against Bodhi?

[Link]

Originally posted by Hank Parsons: If you're offering ideas to make it better -- like SixOfSpades -- then more power to you. I may not agree with everything, but I respect anyone's ideas for improving this mod.

For the record; I vividly recall posting ideas to make it better. Maybe they're too general, but they were ideas nonetheless.

[Assassin]

In my opinion it's unreasonable to kill a boss in one hit. There's really nothing wrong with having that preference, is there?

And I'll repeat, for what's probably the third time now...

Why not make her saves so low that it is an impossibility to not make her save versus death?

It's "wrong" to do that? I didn't realize this was a question of morality. However, for the sake of discussion, let's grant you that it is wrong to make the game harder for no reason. That wouldn't apply to Tactics either, since Tactics makes it harder for very good reasons. Which have been posted in this thread already.

Sorry, I forgot the IMO. But I assumed that since it was me posting, then it would naturally have the IMO tagged on it, since my posts are naturally of my opinion. =/ And I'm talking about making all Lichs immune to Azuredge and Bodhi immune to the spells that affect damn near everything else(in reference to my post about it being wrong IMO , to make changes for no reason other than to make it harder.

On your second statement, I would appreciate it if you don't tell me what my line is. I never said that. I have an intelligent limit for what's reasonable in this game, what's justified, and what's story-compatible.

I got that impression from this post:

Yes, that's exactly right Assassin. I believe that a Lich should not die in one hit from an axe.

In other words, the only reason why Lichs should be immune to Azuredge is because they're too easy to kill right now. In other words, IMO , I interpreted it that you were willing to make any changes as long as they made the game harder, with no other reason. What logical, in-game reason would Lichs have to being immune to Azuredge?

Even demiliches?

Okay, you caught me there. It affect everyone except the two Demi-Lichs and Improved Bodhi. Happpy? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

And no, I'm not against Tactics mod. Hell, I'm a fairly vocal supporter of it (just ask SixOfSpades [img]tongue.gif[/img] ). Where it makes sense (there's no way I'm fighting Improved Faldorn, for example). And this is a case where, IMO , it does not make sense. And your proposed additions also, IMO , do not make sense either.

[ 08-26-2004, 09:13 AM: Message edited by: Assassin ]

[chimaera]

But nonsense is so much more fun [img]graemlins/firedevil.gif[/img]

[Hank Parsons]

Assassin specifically requests a reason why Liches should not die in one hit. Assassin has repeatedly claimed that if I want liches to not die in one hit, then I must want that for "no reason." Let me clarify. I want liches to not die in one hit because liches are supposed to be scarey monsters, not wimps. The most powerful, hard-to-kill monsters in the game should be: liches, dragons, demons, and Named enemies. These should all be next-to-impossible to kill, and only killable by the greatest heroes with the smartest tactics. Again, if you prefer wimp-lich, you have nothing to complain about because you have regular BG2.

Link and Assassin... I would prefer to discuss the mod and not just go back and forth with you-said you-said. We've both said our sides in our previous posts. I have read all of your ideas in this thread, and I would choose Tactics v20 over all of your ideas so far. However, SixOfSpades has offered some reasonable suggested changes for Tactics. I don't agree with all of his points, but he is far less bombastic than Link and Assassin.

Your ideas are just that, your ideas. I have no problem with you stating your ideas, but I do not like it when you call someone else's preferences "wrong." I think that is a very poor approach.