Government & Corporate Power versus Environment poll

[Fljotsdale]

The 2000 IUCN Red List of Threatened Species tells us that over 11,000 species of plants and animals are at risk of extinction. The Chairman of the World Conservation Union’s species survival commission, David Brackett, said: “The globe will not survive with all our biodiversity just in zoos.” The Globe & Mail of Canada adds that “we are jeopardizing our own chance of survival.”

Considering the way governments bow to Corporate Power for the sake of money, it seems that nothing will stop us destroying our own life support system. And each individual who is prepared to ignore the issue for the sake of the ‘immediate buck in the pocket’ and the ‘need for speed’ is actually supporting the greed of the Corporate and the boot-licking of Government.
Such ‘short-termism’ is utter folly, yet we all sit back in comfort and say “I can’t do anything about it”
But we CAN!!!
All we need is the WILL!

So, the question I ask is this: WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO TO HELP THE ENVIRONMENT AND TO ENSURE A FUTURE FOR YOUR CHILDREN AND GRANDCHILDREN?

Let the controversy begin


------------------
Smile! Life is too short for bitching!

Fljotsdale

[RudeDawg]

Great Poll!

This is why I play a Ranger.

Too many peeps feel that it isn't a problem. In the USA, Earth Day was celebrated on Apr 22, 2001. But one day ISN'T enough.

Plant a tree, folks. Walk in the park. Teach your children to take care of the earth, or it won't be around forever.

------------------

The RudeDawg
Known in these Forgotten Realms as Perin LightEyes
and my girlfriends, Pamila and Phil

[SSJ4Sephiroth]

yes, i believe it is time to stop burning the rainforest and shit like that. we may be creating more habitable land for humans, but there arent gonna be any humans to live on it if it continues much longer. gotta do it in moderation, or not at all. just my very importiant gold-minted 2 cents

[Row Firecam]

Teach your children that greed is a deadly sin, that money isn't everything, to take care of the planet, respect nature, make love not War.

But thats just my opinion, I could be wrong

------------------
:knightsmile:

Keldorn's Younger brother

[Tancred]

I'm going to pioneer the first underwater colony. There's lots of space down there, you can drill into the crust of the earth and tap geothermal energy, you can utilise hydroponics technology to feed the world using textured and flavoured algae... Hell, if we can build a space station, why not Atlantis?

Tancred

Yes, it'd be wet. But... well... what do you EXPECT? It's the SEA!

[Lord of Alcohol]

Recycle

[Sazerac]

Write your congressmen and your senators. Get others to do it. Let them know that the people will not stand by and watch their environment be ruined by corporate waste and irresponsibility. I know this argument is as old as the hills, but evil flourishes while apathy reigns.

And do your part as well to help clean things up. I went to a festival last week in a park, where the last band that played exhorted people to help clean up the park afterward. We all pitched in (well, not everyone, but enough of us did) and the park looked great afterward..and it only took about 20 minutes with all of us working. Now that's real team and community effort!

[Mouse]

This may not be the "pc" viewpoint, but is nobody in anyway troubled by the artificial distinction betwen "mankind" and the rest of the natural world. I could argue that everything that the human race has done is just another facet of the evolutionary process.... but dammit, I am very inebriated and need to sleep !!

------------------
Regards



Mouse

[John D Harris]

I'll be the Orgre. I'm staunchly "anti-eviromentalist",not anti-enviroment. It started in Mrs. Paige's 3rd grade class, 1969, Ellensburg,Wa. I remember being told that the world would be dead from polution by 1984! I believe this earth is tougher than we ever will be, it was created by a God that knows how stupud we are.
I don't think it is corp. vs. enviroment, it's what is vs. what if. Here in the US in the late 80's & early 90's one of the big enviromentalist issues was disposable daipers in the landfills. Until the first and only study done on landfills, was done for National Geographic. The issue came out in the summer of of 1991 ( june issue [may or april issue not june I have that one still, edit but left mistake in] I believe, I gave it to a friend to read, because he had started to fall for the line). In the study it was discovered that daipers make up less than .1%, not the 5%-10% the enviromentalist where saying. The bulk of the landfill was made up of biodegradable paper!( over 50% I want to say 65% but I can't recall for sure) The reason that the paper would not biodegrade was that the laws inacted, pushed by the enviromentalists, prevented the natural process. All landfills must be lined with so many feet of clay to prevent sipage. Then the landfills must layer the garbage with layers of clay.
That stops oxegen from getting to the garbage, no oxegen, no bactirea (sp?), no bactera(I'll try it again ), no decay. The only landfill in the entire country that worked and did biodegrade the matter put into it was in New Jersey.
The enviromentalists were trying to shut it down, because it was built years ago over a creek. The scientist discovered that the creek water carried oxegen through the land fill, it is the only landfill where for every ton of fresh garbage ( how's that for an oxymoron ) a ton was biodegraded! and washed away the bactera ate it. There were high levels of bactera, but not high levels of so called polutants in the creek. If anyone has the cd from national geo. check it out I may be wrong alittle on some of the percents( in favor of enviromentalists) ,but not on the gist of the story.
Now on to deforrestion, while living in Vermont (yes, Grey Mage we lived amoung the yankees ) I discovered that the state of Vermont had been virtualy deforrested (95%+) in the 1800's along with vast areas of eastern New York and Conneticut (man am I gonna get in trouble for mispelling a state). If you went there now you'd never believe it. More trees than you shake a stick at, pun indended. Now try to cut down those trees, They're not old growth so you should be able to cut them down, and see what kind of Hayel (southern for "Hell", where Gen. Sherman went for what he did to Atlanta) you'd get from the enviromentalists. On a personal note, while in Vermont saw several envro rallies. I noticed that lots, not all, of the people were going to the rallies in old beat up smoking cars and not carpooling.(Nit-picky I know but not off subject, I'll get to in a moment)
When Mt. St. Helens erupted, the enviros( I got tired of typing enviromentalists) freaked about all the damage to the enviroment. Several months later I saw news story about the enviromental damage, and noticed in the background a small green plant growing. How could that be? I thought to myself, with all this damage brought about by mother nature herself, and the enviros screaming. Well duh, it was nature, one of the ways this tough old bird we call "earth" takes care of itself.
El nino, for years we were told that El nino was proof of global warming. Well when studies have been made El nino has been going on for aslong as we can go back. Tree-ring studies, Ice core studies, its nature El nino & La nina are what are suppose to happen. When they stop, let me know cause we're fixx'n to be in a world of hurt, no pun intended. I could go, Pre-Cabrian (sp?) extiction,
Rainforrests, and ozone hole. I think the enviros have an agenda, just like the corps. but, I know the corps. agenda, too make money. I can fight that if I wish too stop buying their products or complain to the company, nicely, not rant and rave. It works I and thousands like me, quietly wrote, e-mailed , or politely called K-mart about Rosie O'donnel's comments about guns, informing K-mart they had lost our business. I can still buy a gun at K-mart, and Roise is not their spokeswoman anymore, whom won (I read the post about "whom", thunked I throw whom in there ). In 1972, there was a commercail for 7-up,if I remember correctly (a subject of no small debate) with Savador Dali painting a woman it started out looking like Salavdor had stabed her with the paint brush. One letter to the company stoped a million dallor ad campaign. An instructor at art school was the Art Director for the campaign.
I fairness Fljotsdale, the other night on the history channel I saw a show on the 1952 death fog in London, scarey stuff, but changes did take place. More changes may need to be taken, I don't know I don't live in the UK. I do know that I'm not going to buy what the enviros are selling. IMHO if they get their way how can we produce electricity? Coal plants, nuke plants, hydro plants, "Hayel" you wait till enough birds get fried flying over solar plants and they'll be bad too. I can get by without elect., see my tread on camping and fishing (yes a shameless selfinterest plug ) Basicly what I'm saying move slowly be very sure of the science. Always remember how many health studies come out and contrdict a previous study. Those studies are about our indidual health and death, and the science guys can't get all their facts straight.



------------------


[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 05-06-2001).]
Typo edits Ladyzekke
[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 05-06-2001).]
Typo edits Ladyzekke

[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 05-06-2001).]
Typo edits Ladyzekke
[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 05-06-2001).]
Typo edits Ladyzekke
edit below was factuial edit May or April issue of nat.geo. not June , sorry john

[This message has been edited by John D Harris (edited 05-06-2001).]

[Sir Taliesin]

Hmmm... I am really divided on this issue. On the one hand I believe in Global
warming. I believe we see it more and more each year. On the other hand the
Environmentalists are so WWWAAAAYYYYY out there on most things, that I can't
really bring myself to support them either. I am stuck in the middle. I get really tired of the Corporate greed that goes on (especially the oil industry.
I'd really love to see someone stick it to them sometime!). I grow up in the sixties and seventies and I too also remember the gloom and doom prophesies of
the Environmentalists. Had to learn it in school. However I feel that I'm a realist and I don't don't think technologically we can take a step back. We have created our monster and we will have to deal with it on a technological
basis. I think in the next twenty or so years we will have to come up with some
sort of alternate fuel source for all our cars, trucks and power plants. Maybe
some sort of alcohol based fuel. We could help the farmers with that, at the same time.


As far as the rain forests go. Another tough question. I'm not sure how we
deal with it. It's hard for the rich and prosperous countries such
as the US and the European Union to tell these poorer and under developed countries that they can't develope their on land. I don't think they would understand it. We have so much and they have only a little. They want what we already have. I can't fault them for that.


Well, I probably didn't really answer this poll except to say that I'm split. Sorry for the rambling.

One other thing. No matter what kind of government you have, whether it is
democratic, socialist, communist, theologic, totalarian (sp) or whatever. the
rich and the powerful will always control it. Most of the time the rich and
powerful are usually the smartest and/or the most aggressive. If you have a
revolution and the old rich and powerful are thrown out, they will be replaced
by the same sort of people. It may not happen immediately, but it will happen
eventually!


------------------
Sir Taliesin

Meddle not in the affairs of dragons
if you are crunchy and good with ketchup!

[This message has been edited by Sir Taliesin (edited 05-06-2001).]