D&D Magic system!

[Jorath Calar]

Some time ago there was a thread here about the new 3.5 edition of the D&D game from Wizards of the coast. Anyway, someone was complaining about the magic system (think it was Timber Loftis, not sure) and said it was pretty bad, and well he was right.
How ever yesterday I got a book called Arcana Unearthed by Monte Cook, and WOW [img]graemlins/wow.gif[/img] it introduces a completely diffrent magicsystem and what I've read of it so far is astonishing.

here is a description I found of it, since I havn't read it much so far and my english is not so good... [img]smile.gif[/img]

In short, spells come in three levels of difficulty: simple, complex, and exotic. Most spellcasters only have access to simple spells, unless a class ability or feat is gained that allows access to complex and exotic spells. When casting a spell, the caster has several options. The most basic are using diminished effects or heightened effects (by using a spell slot one level lower or one level higher to power the spell), or the spell can be "laden" by spending two slots of the appropriate level, giving the spell considerably more power. Additional effects can be added to spells by taking feats that allow the caster to apply spell templates. Some examples of spell templates include acid, blessed, corrupted, cold, eldritch, permanent, psionic, unraveling, and wild (there are many more). I haven’t yet had a chance to try out this magic system in a game, but it seems to me that it might actually make the spellcasting classes overly powerful compared to the non-spellcasting classes. However, the class abilities and feats available to the others may very well balance out nicely.

You should definetly check it out... [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 08-29-2003, 06:44 AM: Message edited by: Jorath Calar ]

[Gangrell]

I set up the thread, and I already have the book Monte Cook did a hell of a job on it, combining so many different classes, the mage blade, witches, greenbond, etc. Here's the thing though, I'm not entirely sure if it's set up for this game, FR and Greyhawk I mean. I think it's for his new campaign he's coming out with called the Diamond Throne. Here are some examples.

(For anyone who doesn't want to know, don't read ahead)


No alignments exist in the game.
There are no longer cleric or wizard spells, they're all merged into a singular spell list.
There's no Wish or Limited Wish spells.
You have to have feats to use more powerful spells.
So on...

The only rule of his that me and my uncle applied was the 'no alignment' rule in Faerun and Greyhawk. Mainly because he usually wanted to play an evil character and I played the opposite [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[Haldir]

Originally posted by Jorath Calar: Some time ago there was a thread here about the new 3.5 edition of the D&D game from Wizards of the coast. Anyway, someone was complaining about the magic system (think it was Timber Loftis, not sure) and said it was pretty bad, and well he was right. How ever yesterday I got a book called Arcana Unearthed by Monte Cook, and WOW [img]graemlins/wow.gif[/img] it introduces a completely diffrent magicsystem and what I've read of it so far is astonishing. here is a description I found of it, since I havn't read it much so far and my english is not so good... [img]smile.gif[/img] quote: In short, spells come in three levels of difficulty: simple, complex, and exotic. Most spellcasters only have access to simple spells, unless a class ability or feat is gained that allows access to complex and exotic spells. When casting a spell, the caster has several options. The most basic are using diminished effects or heightened effects (by using a spell slot one level lower or one level higher to power the spell), or the spell can be "laden" by spending two slots of the appropriate level, giving the spell considerably more power. Additional effects can be added to spells by taking feats that allow the caster to apply spell templates. Some examples of spell templates include acid, blessed, corrupted, cold, eldritch, permanent, psionic, unraveling, and wild (there are many more). I haven’t yet had a chance to try out this magic system in a game, but it seems to me that it might actually make the spellcasting classes overly powerful compared to the non-spellcasting classes. However, the class abilities and feats available to the others may very well balance out nicely.

You should definetly check it out... [img]smile.gif[/img] [/QUOTE]What kind of book is that Arcana? Because I have only a few D&D books: Forgotten Realms, Players Handbook, Dungeon Master, Sword and the Fist, Songs and Swords. But what kind of book is this Arcana? Ou yes and which class are you?

[Timber Loftis]

Hmmm.... Not to be confused with the classic 1st Ed. Unearthed Acrana. Looks interesting, I'll probably get the electronic versions today -- maybe not.

I still say scrap the D&D magic system and go with Ars Magica. Nothing has ever made so much sense and its magic system.

Great description of Ars Magica system in these threads.

Ars Magica for D20 Games -- GREAT SITE!

Hmmmm.... I bet these two links just trumped Monte Cook's long hours of work. So Sorry.

[Jorath Calar]

Originally posted by Haldir: What kind of book is that Arcana? Because I have only a few D&D books: Forgotten Realms, Players Handbook, Dungeon Master, Sword and the Fist, Songs and Swords. But what kind of book is this Arcana? Ou yes and which class are you?

This is a source book by Monte cook, he cowrote the Dungeon master guide, it's just a "Varian" rules book, you can adopt most of the rules in it for you game, The mageblade class is very cool, by the way.

My fave class is ranger, my longest lasting characther was a ranger.

Oh and Timber, I'm looking into that arc magica... looks great... [img]smile.gif[/img]

[RevRuby]

give me 2ed or give me death! sorry none of this makes sense....maybe if i cared....lol. it all sounds interesting but it also just sound slike a lot of babble. i think i will be happy to stick with 2ed ad&d.

[The Hunter of Jahanna]

I have to agree with RevRuby. 2nd ed. was short and to the point. for example in 2nd ed. if you want to toss out a fireball, you just state your intention , roll your 10d6 and poof, no more bad guys.

In 3rd ed. you state your intention, figure out witch feats apply, check for range and damage modifiers, then cast the spell. After all that you still have to roll to see if your victim evaded or made his save, or both.

It all seems like a little bit too much work for me, just to play a game. If I wanted to spend all night rolling dice I would play White Wolf games.

[Timber Loftis]

Hunter of J, casting a 3rd Ed fireball still works the exact same way. Rather than get hung up on feats, realize they're very much just an expanded list of non-weapon proficiencies -- such as those found in the complete fighter's guides and arms and armor books in 2d Ed. 3rd ed is intended to be a bit faster in rolling combat dice -- and it is, somewhat. I still like my modified 2nd Ed. rules best, but a fireball is still a fireball.

Now, if your 2d Ed. DM watched you toss a fireball into a 10'X10'X15' room of orcs and didn't stop to think that the dimensions given in the 2d Ed PHB dictate a 33,000 ft3 volume (that gets filled no matter what), then you should count your blessings. In my game, you'd have dealt with a flame column shooting down the tunnel at you.

[ 09-03-2003, 12:24 AM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[RevRuby]

ohhhh...nathan keeps track of these things, and of course it is the reason why i have yet to play a mage, i am so absent minded! we were playing last night and there were times i had absolutely no clue what was going on!

[HolyWarrior]

Originally posted by Gangrell: Here's the thing though, I'm not entirely sure if it's set up for this game, FR and Greyhawk I mean. I think it's for his new campaign he's coming out with called the Diamond Throne. Here are some examples.

Is this based on the David Eddings book?