Who should decide the legality of abortion?

[The Hunter of Jahanna]

I was talking this over with some friends. My view is that untill men can give birth ,they should butt out of it. I dont think that any guy has a dog in the fight for or against abortion. It isnt our bodie that will have to nourish the developing fetus. Men dont get Post partum depression,stretch marks, morning sickness or new "pregnancy" wardrobes. Physicaly we realy have nothing to do with a pregnancy after conception. It is all going on in the womans bodie and that is why I think only women should be allowed to make abortion decisions. As you can probably guess I am pro choice, but I am pro choice because I dont feel that I have the right to tell another person what to do with their bodie. Get one or dont, it doesnt matter to me, but the option should still be there.

[Bardan the Slayer]

My view is that since we have a 50/50 split with the woman, in terms of the child's genetic structure and the act of conceiving it, that we should have an equal say in the life/death of our unborn child.

[ 02-08-2003, 10:21 PM: Message edited by: Bardan the Slayer ]

[Gabrielles blades]

for me it depends on how far along the kid in there is
but yes, it is the womans decision and she should have the right to since its her body. that said, i would argue with the woman in question if it was my kid in there.

[Bardan the Slayer]

It's the woman's body you are taking the child out of, but it is the child's body you are killing.

[The Hunter of Jahanna]

I dont know about the killing part, Bardan. Most children arent physicaly attached to anything, but your missing the point. Why do you feel you have the right to tell someone what they can or can not do with their own bodie? Untill the fetus comes out is is still part of the mother, kind of like a kidney.

[Bardan the Slayer]

No, it is not a part of her body, liike a kidney. It is a human being with a human brain and human individuality. It is a small being with it's own moods (which is why different unborn babies respond to different voices, music, etc) and feelings. It is a dependant organism that, left to it's own devices, will grow into a sentient, walking, talking self-sufficient human being.

A kidney is none of these things. The comparison is silly.

And what do you mean, you aren't sure about the killing?

From Miriam-Webster :

Main Entry: 1kill
Pronunciation: 'kil
Function: verb
Etymology: Middle English, perhaps from (assumed) Old English cyllan; akin to Old English cwellan to kill -- more at QUELL
Date: 14th century
transitive senses
1 a : to deprive of life

A foetus is alive. If you deprive it of life, you kill it.

Oh, and just before anyone thinks that my arguments are based on religious beliefs - I'm an atheist [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Sir Krustin]

Exactly right, Bardan!

There is ample proof that unborn babies exhibit awareness of their environment, and react to it quite early in pregnancy. Abortion isn't just removing an appendix, it's killing. (Insert obvious references to the film showing the baby reacting to the abortion tool and attempting to flee...)

The question isn't even about the dividing line about when an abortion should be allowed or not, that's just an excuse to drive a wedge in to justify the abortion. The obvious cutoff point is at the time of conception; any other time is just too subject to interpretation or just plain abitrary.

Catholics go even further, you can't officially use contraceptive devices!

edit>Hunter, consider this - though a young child is independant of the mothers body after birth, a child still won't survive without many years care from the parents. (unlike many species of animal). Arguing that the unborn child is dependant on the mothers' body doesn't really prove anything.

[ 02-08-2003, 11:34 PM: Message edited by: Sir Krustin ]

[The Hunter of Jahanna]

I am not argueing for the rights of the unborn, SirK. I am argueing that men have no business telling women what to do with their bodies. So far all I have gotten by way of responses is men telling women what they can and cant do with their bodies. Ironic, isnt it?

[WOLFGIR]

It should IMHO be laws about the time when and if, and if late one would need a to have the case tested.

In the end, the final word is the mothers.

Well since you brought it up..

My political and religious aspects are to this date yet undecided.

[Kaltia]

Personally I agree with Bardan- a 50/50 decision between the father and the mother. I'm not exactly pro-life but I know I ain't pro-choice.