why do/don't you trust the government?

[AzRaeL StoRmBlaDe]

I know we dabbled in this a little bit with the "what's it like to be an american thread" which mysteriously disappeared, but I was just wondering people's feelings on the government. It seems to me the general concensus over the past few hundred years in this country is that Americans do not trust their government. I was just wondering how people viewed their gov't especially people from other countries than america. I wonder how americans feel about their gov't and how citizens from other countries feel about their country's gov't. If you don't feel confident about your gov't, why is that, and what can we do if anything to change it. for me reading 1984 and taking a few political science and sociology classes made me completely distrust the government, but then again it made want to vote too. I was just wondering what everyone else thought.

[Durwyn]

Quite pointless to ask that, I mean its pretty obvious, goverment can and will hide anything from you whenever and wherever they want. So really, its just a neautral feeling I guess... I personally dont trust the U.S. goverment because they are hiding the true excistance of Aliens from the whole world!!! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[SSJ4Sephiroth]

why dont i trust the government? so many reasons, so little time... well for one, they lie to us constantly. they keep foreign affairs away from our view, and try to trick us (well, i at least, think its a trick) into dying for them. another reason is the biased history and school system. knowledge is supposed to be a completely free from any kind of bias or nationality. a third one is the lack of funds for public education. if they would just refrain from buying ONE stealth bomber, they could finance an entire school's decent teaching staff for at least five years. and lastly, the media. these should be separate, i know, but obviously they arent as the media doesnt report on anything the government doesnt want it to, and some scandal or something always comes up when something else is happening (sorry, no examples as of now).

[Durwyn]

I totally agree with you Sephiroth! (This is quickly becoming the continuation of Criminals and the American post). US Gov doesnt give the school money, just look at many NY schools, heck look at most of NY heh. And I totally agree with you on the media, our media, rap, movies that promote violance like Swordfish, or 15 Minutes, it all needs to be stopped.

And the funny thing is its not being stopped not even being questioned...

[Thoran]

IMO mistrusting the Government is a very healthy behavior. The Gov is run by people, and people are subject to failure. I also think that the way our government is elected draws the exact people we should be keeping FAR AWAY from power.

I read a sci-fi story once where the way their governement was elected was to make a list of all the people who were qualified yet who DIDN'T want to be in government, pick a name from that list for every post, and FORCE those people to server for a term.

IMO - that's the IDEAL method to choose a government. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Wanting to be President should AUTOMATICALLY disallow you from the selection process... because no one in their right mind would EVER want that job.

[Black Dragon]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Durwyn:
I totally agree with you Sephiroth! (This is quickly becoming the continuation of Criminals and the American post). US Gov doesnt give the school money, just look at many NY schools, heck look at most of NY heh. And I totally agree with you on the media, our media, rap, movies that promote violance like Swordfish, or 15 Minutes, it all needs to be stopped.

And the funny thing is its not being stopped not even being questioned...

---

Well, probably because not all people beleive everything they see and only that close minded few do, so they still watch the movies and listen to the rap, and stuff like that just for the entertainment. Other people who beleive in that kind of stuff (as in follow the gasta crap in rap songs) should be put in a mental institute. But don't get me wrong, those people might be nice people just afraid to show it and feel like sissies. Its just not all people are as messed up as movies make us look, but alot are. So you may be right, you may be wrong, my opinion is only, so you can't just rely on mine, ask other people their opinions, and plz, try to think on the other side of the stories. (instead of just insulting the music or movies, just becuase you saw an unlucky few) That ends my argument.

[Durwyn]

Unlucky few? Black Dragon you must be either young or confused my friend. When they show a NYC Homoside cop being murdered and then they show that he is been murdered by immigrants from Russian and Czechoslovakia and then those two criminals submit a tape of the murder to a Media Show on TV and they show it (All that in the movie of course) what kind of impression of Russians and Czech people are they giving? I mean trust me there are a LOT of stupid people out there that would by viewing such a movie, not even talk or think badly of both of those races.

And in Swordfish, wow they show some real twisted stuff, and 50% of that actually happens. And of course the lable is USA USA USA, so a lot of people will have bad impressions. Espesially teens may I point out. In New York every African American person that I've yet to see listen to Rap and is "Gangsta", but the funny thing is just about everyone one of them is an act so to speak...

I'll tell you of a true situation of mine... Nepture Ave, Crossing Coney Island... 12:30 AM, Brooklyn NY... I finished my job late at the restaraunt, I walk down a dark ally going to the nearest train station... Then an African American person, I think he was a teen around 19 years old perhaps runs up to me from behind, I'm not sure where he came from but I think from a corner of a building or something, and he puts a gun to my head, so I of course, so I start crying, saying I have a sick mother at home, and I'm hurt and poor and just finished job late please please let me go, basically acting heh, then I quickly get my right hand and grab his while with my left give him a light blow in the stomach, the gun drops, the guy seemed like he is frozen or he couldnt believe what just happend, so I pick up the fallen gun, and point it at him, he starts crying. I said "Who is the gansta now huh?" He breaks down in tears... Man then I notice one very interesting thing, the gun is a Metal BB Gun in model of a Desert Eagle, and its not even loaded... So I throw the gun to him, he takes it fast and runs away, I guess till crying. Since that day a lot of things that I've viewed in a certain way have changed... So go figure... if Rap makes some people go and try and rob someone with a fake gun, then it turns out that those "some people" are little coward with no brain well... I got nothing more to say.

[Black Dragon]

I understand where your coming from, but not all people are as stupid as the group one group, when I go see a movie, its to see a movie, not get an inspiration for life, I see all kinds of movies, listen to all kinds of music, yet I never want to live like a gangster, or even close to living near a crowded city. (for obvious reasons) But I do understand your point, alot of people in the world will beleive you if you tell them that there is a cow chewing on their hair, alot of people are close minded and they actually beleive that what they see in movies should be the way life is. So, maybe your right they should be more careful about what they put in movies and music, but if people where more sain, we would not have any problems with movies.

[AzRaeL StoRmBlaDe]

the real reason I made this thread is to show everyone's distrust of the american political system. Yes politicians lie to us and yes they look out only for their own interests. In 1996 only 54% of americans voted. Now how can we have equal representation when just over 1/2 of the population votes. and look at the percentages by age of people that vote 18-24 year old average a turnout of 28%, where as citizens 65 and up averaged a 67% tunrout. americans 25-64 averaged about a 55% percent turnout. Also its a proven fact that the more education you have the more likely you are to vote. Could this be viewed from the perspective that the more education you have the more likely you are to protect your interests by voting for constituents that support you? This could be backed up by another statistic that the higher your income the more likely you are to vote. Yet another statistic to back this up is the percentages of the unemployed that voted which was 37% The percentage of people presently employed that voted was 55%. what do all these statistics mean? Basically they mean that America promotes voter apathy. People with less care less about politics. In general they feel that next year will be more of the same no matter who is president. voter America alienates its citizens and voters so much so that only about 1/2 of the people registered even bother to vote for the president, and only about 1/3 of registered voters will bother to vote for the senate. Most people don't even know who the senators or governors are in thier state. I will leave you with one final example to help prove my point. there is an old saying about politicians in that "their first duty is to get elected, and their second duty is to get reelected" As a newly elected senator to get reelected you need to make on average $2,300 a day for your entire 6 year term, just to finance your reelection campaign enough to get reelected. granted they dont really have to spend much time themselves raising their money, they do have to sell out for large donators during their current policy term in order to get more money for their reelection campaign. If you donated money to a senator who said he was going to back you and he didn't who would get your donation come reelection time. One way of thinking about it is, he who has the money influences the decisions of the people in power. Its not exactly buying a senators vote, but you can;t tell me the senator doesn't know who his big donators are and isn't going to keep them in mind if an issue pertaining to them comes up. Besides the gov't straight up lying to us about things, you have so many other things to consider why people don't trust the gov't. really there is no reason to trust the gov't or our reps to the gov't (ie politicians). The real thing I am wondering is, is our system like this because of our capitalist economy, or are all gov'ts just like that? Even if you look at our voting system, its a winner take all system which completely discourages new parties. I may be mistaken but in some of Europe, dont they have a proportional representation, where however many votes the party gets, they get that proportion of seats. Now that sounds like the most democratic system to me. I understand our political system isnt perfect and that we do what we can, but these are reasons why people dont trust the gov't. Now I will ask what all we can do to change this? ( sorry for being so long-winded, but I am bored at work)

[Vaskez]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Durwyn:
our media, rap, movies that promote violance like Swordfish, or 15 Minutes, it all needs to be stopped.

---

What are you on about? Rap needs to be stopped? Actually, I happen to like rap. So do I need to be stopped as well now? Been listening to it since age 13 and I don't act like a gangsta at all. It depends how much you let it effect you. Of course it's easy to let the media effect you, but you need some willpower to combat those effects on your character....I don't personally think it should be banned, but I agree that some people take movies and such too seriously and decide to try and act like what they see/hear, this is IMO the parent's fault who didn;t teach their kids to discern between what is real/important and what is not. In fact most character "disorders" in most people is down to parenting and other caring (at school etc.)during growing up, IMO.

[ 01-17-2002: Message edited by: Vaskez ]