Backstabbing

It DOES occur but only once, with your main hand attack. Your second attack will do normal damage. I think the logic for this is that you don't attack with both hands together (though you could) and so the element of surprise is lost after your first blade sinks into the victim's back.

[mir_ror]

Regarding backstabbing with a multi/dual-classed character, is it possible to get in 2 (is >2 possible??) backstabs in a single backstab when dual-wielding?

From a fanatical backstabber...

I asked the same question earlier yesterday and got no response.

I appears that backstab damage does not occur when you have 2 weapons equiped

And I don't think having two weapons equiped will allow you multiple backstabs.... only one. But since it seems that if you have two weapons equiped you can't backstab period.

Correct me if I'm wrong anyone...........

So you are saying that even with two weapons... backstab will occur?

Why do I see in some battles an enemy thief will backstab and a X4 (or whatever the multiplyer is) will display in the text. I am in chapter 3 and have been using two handed style for the whole game so far.... and have not seen my character inflict any backstab damage (yes I'm hiding in shadows).

I tested this for fun. I made a 23rd level thief and went around stealing and backstabbing for fun (my rep was 1 almost immediately).

He was dual wield. I scored the damage multiplier if I hit with EITHER hand the first hit. After one BS, the second hand did not get this damage.

Example:
+1 longsword in main hand
+2 dagger in off hand

X5 damage

Hide in shadows successful.
Attack with main hand misses.
Attack with off hand misses.
Attack with main hand hits, 7 points of damage X5 = 35 points of damage.
Attack with off hand hits, 4 points of damage.
ect - all attacks from here do normal damage.


Next....

Hide in shadows successful.
Attack with main hand misses.
Attack with off hand hits, 4 points of damage X5 = 20 points of damage.
Attack with main hand hits, 7 points of damage.
Attack with off hand hits, 4 points of damage.
ect - all attacks from here do normal damage.

So it is only the first hit that gets the damage, and it can be either hand. Obviously since the thief can only get one prof in dual wield, this is usually the main hand, but this tell u something important - to avoid the negative "to hit" modifiers for dual wield, you should ALWAYS SINGLE WIELD FOR BACKSTABS so that you increase your chance of hitting with whatever weapon is better for damage. If they are both similar, it doesn't matter, but if you want to score a better hit with a particular weapon, go with that weapon.

Now, it seems confusing that you are "leaving shadows" when you attack, you would think that this nullifies the BS damage, but this only happens if they are hostile. If they are not yet hostile, you may attack until you hit. If they are hostile, they may or may not see you thus nullifiying your BS damage. I need to do more testing with this.

Can you only backstab with a shortsword?
czo my stalker couldn't backstab with his battle axe or at least he didn't
nor does my assasin come to think off it

what is requered to backstab??/
(and yes i am in the shadows)

Practice against some friendlies in town. You'll see a diff between them and monsters. Plus, u can test the types of weapons that work. I know a long sword also works, as has every weapon that I have tried.

Great advice/data. Thanks Half-Orc!

I didn't realize that u can backstab with either hand. Interesting. My stalker was backstabbing up to x4 towards the end of the game but I always thought it was his main hand attack because at that level he hardly missed. I think you can only backstab with weapons like swords, daggers, scimitars etc. which a thief can use. So if you are a fighter-thief and use a mace or a battle axe I don't think you get the backstab multiplier. Same goes for the two handed sword because thieves can't use it. But if you are wielding a long sword two handed you should theoretically still get the multiplier. I might check it out.

I am suprised to see in Glorick's example of backstabing that the suprise attack still applied after he missed twice because in the AD&D rules it quite clearly states that if your first attempt to backstab fails then you loose all suprise and no more attempts can be made on that creature or any other creature in visual range.

I don't mean to be a boar but if you are going to use a set of rules then you should stick to them. I think that you would all agree that you would notice if someone was trying to use your back as a chopping board and kept missing.

Besides any serious adventurer would have "stone skin" protecting them from just such a nasty thing happening, which is why my old AD&D fighter/theif had a "+3 dagger of stone skin negating" which in turn led to the spell "iron skin", ETC ETC