You know you are cheating if...

[robertthebard]

1. you walk through every lvl of the dungeon, and never get a broken finger nail;

2. creatures die, just because you acted like you were going to hit them with your sword;

3. you find yourself alone on lvl 11, and think, cool, i can loot every creature that my weapons and armor killed, because you know your char didn't;

4. No matter what spell is cast at you, you get a little glowy circle around you, indicating immunity;

5. Every God's head, in every pantheon, is hanging on the wall in your den, etc etc.

There is no need to over analyze this. There are items in this dungeon that exceed the lvl 20 cap, made by Z. Most of them, the Mithral of the Corrupt not withstanding, are easily acceptable. The aforementioned armor is cool, though. I craft most of my own equipment, but keep it to lvl 20. An example of unacceptable armor would be one where it takes you five actual minutes to read what it does. The same holds true for weapons, and other accessories. Don't just skim through the threads on this topic, and look for holes, use your head, and craft items that are reasonable, and, lol, believable. Using the toolset, i could make a sword that would allow me to run around the whole of Undermountain, naked, and kill everything in there in one swing. It can be done, i have done it in my own module, to test what is happening, check xp awards, etc. I wouldn't do it in any one elses server. The point is how *believeable* is that?
This is meant to be a sort of humorous thread, so feel free to add anything you may think of to this list. Maybe a friendly moderator will be kind enough to put them all in one big sticky list when it's done, for future reference. hint hint.

[Legolas]

6. Your weapons drip ice-cold, burning acid, and crackle with noisy lightning.
7. You spend more rounds casting spells from your weapons than actually swinging them.
8. The rest of the party are constantly behind, taking different turns than you did.
9. None of the items you find in the Undermountain are even worth picking up.
10. You suddenly find yourself alone in a room with interesting signs on the walls.

[Chuck Gabriel]

This is my first post here, so please be kind.

I just wanted to point out that it is possible to make some fairly uber items while still remaining under the level 20 cap. For instance a +5 keen sword that does 2d6 massive criticals and 1d6 elemental damage has a level requirement of 20, but I get the feeling that some of the members here would feel that using an item of that caliber constitutes cheating.

Now, as someone here already pointed out (I believe), you can create a full set of equipment that by all standards would be completely outrageous while still keeping each individual piece at or below level 20. If I were to walk into the mod with that kind of equipment, I can't help believing I would find myself in that special room I keep hearing about.

I must say, on some of the lower levels, equipment like that would probably be necessary. They are pretty deadly from what I've seen. Even on level one it is almost essential to have immunity to death magic (or at least really good saving throws), because there are so many spell casters who are loaded up with instant death spells.

I'm not sure what my point was with all of this. I guess I just thought I might gemerate some responses that point toward some sort of concensus on what is acceptable and what is not.

Thanks

[Larry_OHF]

Welcome to the forums, Chuck G.! I had to post here after I saw your place of origin. FYI, I usually play with items that are limited to level 20, and that ideal has been approved of. I try to only use those characters in levels 10 and 11, because they always get their butts whooped there, but if I am going to play in the levels 1-9, I tend to use weaker equipment and have even fought with my bare fists instead of weapons just to weaken myself to the levels that everybody else is at. I try to play with the others online, and not "ahead" of them. That seems to everyone and makes me feel fine.

Let's see...to add to the humor of this thread,,,

You know you are ubering if...
1. Everybody else waits outside while you go in and clean the area out of it's resident dragon, so they can come in and loot the goodies, since you said that you did not want them.
2. Others let you go first so you can set of all floor traps and open all trapped chests so that they do not get killed or poisoned.
3. Your Half-Orc Barbarian Fighter happens to be able to ressurrect everybody else in the party while casting Meteor Swarm from his Glowing Red Axe of Vorpal(24).

[ 11-08-2003, 09:41 PM: Message edited by: Larry_OHF ]

[Chuck Gabriel]

Thanks Larry.

I've actually seen you fight with your bare fists before. I was the newbie elf (Narebrion Rastinfer) that you and Nolace (and please forgive me, but I can't remember the Paladin's name) took on the guided tour a few nights ago. Thanks for showing me around. And thanks for the guidance here.

[robertthebard]

Welcome Chuck, it's a pleasure to see you here as well as in the dungeons. I would probably just edit my other post, but this is one that needs to stand alone.
You know you are cheating if: Your weapon does, are you sitting down, 15,000 points of physical dmg, before all the other types of dmg are added in. some of the scores i saw on this guys weapons were right around 15,485 points, per hit. I don't care where you are playing, that is cheating.

[Elnik]

Hehe well I die alot and it don't matter which 3 of my chars I play.

But haveing said that I have no clue how to make wepons in the tool set.

Everything I have is from other mods which I have downloaded or found in UM.

I did get a nice Simitar from someone in the game for my druid. But I still
die lol.

But since you respawn right there dieing is no big deal either. Other then becomming broke so I tend to loot alot to keep my gold up .

Elnik

BTW welcome chuck G

[quietman1920]

Q: If your sword can do 100 points of damage at a swipe, but the sand people still kill you in 3 hits, is it cheating? (ok, 75 respawns later I see your point) How about if you craft your character and have a very good (and even entertaining) explanation of what you have?

"Ok, the Druid with the Elf sense of humor just told a joke. Roll for damage..."

[Micah Foehammer]

LOL

If the 100 points is on a crit, and you can still die in three hits from the Desert Archers, I can't see how that would be considered cheating. If on the other hand, you can walk in reading War and Peace and wait until Napoleon enters Moscow BEFORE you start retaliating and then kill an entire group of mixed rakshasa and archers with single hits to each and do so without taking ANY damage - well THEN you are probably over the edge. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Ehrys]

Hmmm... cheating vs non-cheating... good question. Would a character made using the NWN toolset to be able to "play effectively" in EfU (which might constitute a character with blade weapon spec + keen edged blade = most hits are crits, or massive spell casting abilities, or rogue abilities to 100% hide or avoid all traps), should we consider that cheating or "playing effectively" to survive the mod levels? For me, the important question to ask is: why am I playing EfU? Is it to play test? Is it to role play? Or do I want to relieve stress and do a bodycount?

For me, I try to mix all 3 cases (at least make an attempt at it anyways and the bodycount... well, EfU has so many opponents to fight), so that I can have fun with the other folks playing online... which was what I thought was the point of playing "Multiplayer" on the internet. Admittedly, it does disappoint me when I start playing and someone runs ahead and single-handedly destroys enemies meant to be vanquished by a "party" of chars in a few strokes of the blade.

Anyhow, what do you folks think of this? I kind of try to apply these rules whenever I make a character for EfU:
1) The item levels should be equal to or less than the Char level
2) Play mod levels where the Char level fits the mod level being played, such that it is a challenge. By challenge, I mean that there is always a good chance of being killed when overwelmed or going toe to toe with some of the opponents, causing me to sometimes run away and heal myself. (I don't really get challenged if I'm walking through level 1 to 6 with a 20th level char meant for mod level 10 or higher)
3) No resistances, immunities or damage soaking (if applicable) is 100% (or close such that the probability of taking any damage is minimal)
4) AC does not go higher than 50 (I just figured out how to make it higher than 40... always wondered how other people did that)... if you can't be hit, where's the challenge?
5) None of my weapons do more than 30 points of damage without crits
6) None of my items have an unlimited spell casting ability
7) Items are role playable (if I have a +5 Holy Avenger greatsword, why is that? Did the church I follow loan me that to help destroy evil on a particular mission or did I just steal that from the Paladin who was sleeping in the Inn?)
8) None of my chars have innate abilities beyond legal char building through the NWN toolset

My recent character is a 20th level Elven Paladin-Cleric (I think some of you know him) who has some pretty good stuff and can dish out as much as take what gets thrown at him in EfU... but I still can't get through entirely on my own on the lower levels without dying several times... thus a good idea to always travel as part of a group (some probably find my char "preachy")

Apologies for the long winded rant... I'm gonna go play now.