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Old 10-10-2002, 10:10 PM   #41
Yggdrasil
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Join Date: November 26, 2001
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Errr...

I thought this was a solo thread, not the Holy-Spellcasting thread. It's true the game is geared towards spellcasters,
but with some ingenuity a non-mage type can stomp thru this game (assuming no cheats). My record time is with an
Undead Slayer: 47 days, without trying.

Also, items play a HUGE part in this game. A dualled Kensai/Thief (assuming Use Any Item) with Grand Mastery in 2H swords will (assuming HolySword) kick the crap out of anything. Ditto same dualled classes w/Grand Mastery in Staffs w/Staff of Magi...although I favor Carsomyr. Can't beat that equipped 50% MR and Dispel Magic with every hit.

Here's a top 10 solo list, ranked in 'power' order:

Dualled Kensai/Thief
Dualled Kensai/Mage
Multi Mage/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Thief
Undead Hunter - w/Holy Sword
Sorcerer
Multi Fighter/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Druid
Shapeshifter
Swashbuckler
Monk

That's a haphazard list, and to be honest there is plenty of room for ties (that's why I named 11) and arguments (esp depending on race, stats, items, etc). I assume player expertise with each class, like knowing where & when to set traps, or multiple spell contingencies, or knowing about which baddie is around the next corner, etc.

Also (in solo play) there is the maintence factor: Monks are near zero maintenance and moderately powerful. Undead Hunter was very low maintenance and quite powerful. Dualled Kensai/Thief and Kensai/Mage required moderate maintenance and were both extremely powerful, and the Sorcerer was high maintenance and obscenely powerful. A lot of this has to do with individual preferences. I had the most fun soloing with a Shapeshifter; the Assassin, another favorite, didn't even make the list.

Dundee and I have sparred before on the 'Sorcerer is God' topic. There really is no answer to this, but it would be fun to try and take down a fully-charged mage of any class.
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Old 10-11-2002, 02:29 AM   #42
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Here's a top 10 solo list, ranked in 'power' order:

Dualled Kensai/Thief
Dualled Kensai/Mage
Multi Mage/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Thief
Undead Hunter - w/Holy Sword
Sorcerer
Multi Fighter/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Druid
Shapeshifter
Swashbuckler
Monk

How would you rate a Multi Fighter/Mage/Thief? I've just stated soloing one and they are extremely versatile but of course it takes forever to level up. I've done the circus, Mencar, Hendak, a couple of Mae'vars and started on windspear hills and I think I'm only at levels 8/9/10 respectively.
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Old 10-11-2002, 05:23 AM   #43
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Yes, they "attack" you, but if you pay attention, then you see that they do NO damage to you. They will not do any damage to you until you hit them back.

EDIT: As for the "fair" or no fair with PI's and such.. As in one movie a guy said: "Good.. Evil.. Who cares, I am the guy with the gun". Same here. If Bioware did not intend you to have many PI's, then they should have fixed it. Since it's possible, not limited by the game, it means then that it's OK to do. The last thing I would ever CARE about would be whether the "poor mr. Demonknight is OK with the 6 PI's I have" - heck, he's "bad", he has to die, so I don't care what "he feels" or whether it's "fair" heheh. He's bad - he's going down, by whatever means I have at my disposal, no questions asked. If in RL I would be faced with a guy with knife and me with a machine gun - well, too bad for him - I'd be an idiot to throw away my machine gun and pull out my knife. Next time he'll learn to leave the home with proper gear. Just that there's no 'next time' for him

[ 10-11-2002, 05:34 AM: Message edited by: Whailor ]
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Old 10-11-2002, 06:35 AM   #44
Zuvio
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Is there a way to defeat cowled wizards at lvl 12 without cheese? I need high level scrolls right? Or sword spiders ....
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Old 10-11-2002, 08:25 AM   #45
Alson
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Join Date: December 14, 2001
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First of all, thank for mentioning the Spell Reference, guys! [img]smile.gif[/img]

By the way Dundee, what do you think of it? I havn't seen any feedback from you...

Second, where's the cheese in the Endless Spells(TM) strategy?
The Chain is cast before the battle starts, Spell Trap does what it's supposed to do, and x2 Project Images in a Chain is not cheese - there's no in-game mentioning about not having two images at the same time...
If you still think it's cheesy, just pick the "budget version".

And finally, about the heavy cheese in the guide - as i said to SixOfSpades in an other post - there's a cheese icon near every cheesy tactic...
Whether one decides to read it or not - it's his call. [img]smile.gif[/img]
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Old 10-11-2002, 03:08 PM   #46
Zuvio
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Hmm, level 13 now and doing the Unseeying Eye quest. I really could use some help with those beholders. I'm talking about the one beholder and two gauths that you find when you go for the first piece of the rod. After the bridge with the three questions? That one, yeah.

I first killed them by gating in a cacofiend, but that doesnt give any exp so its not worth my time.

Second time i made myself invisible and send in an efreeti (who got slaughtered), a nishruu (who got death-spelled) and some spider-fodder (which was completely useless).

Third time I went in fully protected from everything and invisible for a surprise attack. But no matter what I did, the beholder would cast Anti-Magic Ray and if his death ray didnt kill me, the normal rays would.

Is there a way to defeat beholders in a mage to beholder fight? I got two level 7 slots, is that enough?

NB: i dont mean "cast fireball and run away with haste on" tactix. Not that it would work though.

NNB: even spook for panicing the beholder or minor spell turning are useless!

[ 10-11-2002, 03:42 PM: Message edited by: Zuvio ]
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Old 10-11-2002, 04:56 PM   #47
SixOfSpades
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zuvio:
Is there a way to defeat beholders in a mage to beholder fight? I got two level 7 slots, is that enough?
Think to yourself: What are they casting at you that kills you? Figure out ways to be immune to it.

Yeah, that Anti-Magic ray is a major pain in the butt. No matter WHAT spell or combat protections you have up, one shot from an Anti-Magic Ray takes them ALL down--unless the effect is from an item. That's (one of the reasons) why the Cloak and the Shield are so valued against Beholderkin.

And what do NB: and NBB: stand for, anyway?
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Old 10-11-2002, 05:28 PM   #48
Zuvio
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Quote:
And what do NB: and NBB: stand for, anyway?
those are dutch abbreviations. PS would be more appropiate.

what cloak do mean?

BTW, used two mordankainen's to kill'em and got the exp. total bummer.
actually a follow-up on that one: I use wizardeyes to scout for beholders and gauths, use at least two spiders to take away the death spell/ray from the beholders and then send in more spiders and a mordenkainen or two. odd is they dont should rays at the spiders and swords. whats up with that?

[ 10-11-2002, 05:43 PM: Message edited by: Zuvio ]
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Old 10-11-2002, 09:48 PM   #49
Dundee Slaytern
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Join Date: June 10, 2001
Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore
Age: 42
Posts: 11,063
Quote:
Originally posted by Yggdrasil:
Errr...
I thought this was a solo thread, not the Holy-Spellcasting thread. It's true the game is geared towards spellcasters,
but with some ingenuity a non-mage type can stomp thru this game (assuming no cheats). My record time is with an
Undead Slayer: 47 days, without trying.
Also, items play a HUGE part in this game. A dualled Kensai/Thief (assuming Use Any Item) with Grand Mastery in 2H swords will (assuming HolySword) kick the crap out of anything. Ditto same dualled classes w/Grand Mastery in Staffs w/Staff of Magi...although I favor Carsomyr. Can't beat that equipped 50% MR and Dispel Magic with every hit.
Here's a top 10 solo list, ranked in 'power' order:
Dualled Kensai/Thief
Dualled Kensai/Mage
Multi Mage/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Thief
Undead Hunter - w/Holy Sword
Sorcerer
Multi Fighter/Thief
Dualled Fighter/Druid
Shapeshifter
Swashbuckler
Monk
That's a haphazard list, and to be honest there is plenty of room for ties (that's why I named 11) and arguments (esp depending on race, stats, items, etc). I assume player expertise with each class, like knowing where & when to set traps, or multiple spell contingencies, or knowing about which baddie is around the next corner, etc.
Also (in solo play) there is the maintence factor: Monks are near zero maintenance and moderately powerful. Undead Hunter was very low maintenance and quite powerful. Dualled Kensai/Thief and Kensai/Mage required moderate maintenance and were both extremely powerful, and the Sorcerer was high maintenance and obscenely powerful. A lot of this has to do with individual preferences. I had the most fun soloing with a Shapeshifter; the Assassin, another favorite, didn't even make the list.
Dundee and I have sparred before on the 'Sorcerer is God' topic. There really is no answer to this, but it would be fun to try and take down a fully-charged mage of any class.
Dundee will debate that the Cavalier is a superior choice to the Undead Hunter too.

Undead Hunter:
+3 to hit and damage versus Undead
Immunity to Hold
Immunity to Level Drain

No Lay on Hands

Cavalier:
+3 to hit and damage versus all Demonic and Dragonic creatures
May cast Remove Fear 1 time per day per level
Immunity to Fear and Morale Failure
Immunity to Poison
Immunity to Charm( with ToB installed)
20% Resistance to Fire/Acid

No missile weapons( except Throwing Axes and their ilk)

Whatever the Undead Hunter has, the Cavalier can emulate with equipment or obtain from a spell. The Amulet of Power grants permanent Level Drain immunity as well, in addition to 5% Magic Resistance and Vocalise( for spellcasting).

Undead creatures are for the most part, weak in comparison to Demons and Dragons, so the bonuses benefit more for the Cavalier. Hold is easily countered with the Level 4 Clerical spell, Free Action, which lasts for a very long duration too( not to mention the Ring of Free Action).

Personally, this is how I see the list, although I realise different people will have different views. The top three are virtually universal throughout the veterans though. This list assumes that you know how to bring out the full potential of the class and that you have ToB installed.
  • Kensai->Mage
  • Berserker->Mage
  • Sorcerer
  • Kensai->Thief
  • Barbarian
  • Cleric/Ranger
  • Berserker->Cleric
  • General Mage
  • Conjurer
  • Necromancer
  • Cavalier

[ 10-11-2002, 09:50 PM: Message edited by: Dundee Slaytern ]
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Old 10-11-2002, 09:54 PM   #50
Dundee Slaytern
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Join Date: June 10, 2001
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Quote:
Originally posted by Whailor:
Yes, they "attack" you, but if you pay attention, then you see that they do NO damage to you. They will not do any damage to you until you hit them back.
One little detail left out. No damage, but they still interrupt your spellcasting. Hence the need for Stoneskins and Mirror Image.
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