Agree or disagree with the war, but support the men and women who have to fight it

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by Moiraine: There are a lot more civilians that you mentioned who put their life on the line every day.

Of course.

As I said, policemen and firemen immediately came to mind, but my point was that those who voluntarily risk their lives to serve and/or protect others deserve more respect from those of us who benefit from their sacrifice. Soldiers are included in the list. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Masklinn]

Of course they risk their lives.
But they also take some. On orders.
This is something I find hard to respect. No matter what side, no matter the reasons.

As long as there will be people willing to do that job, you will have wars and dictators.

But I'm too much of a hippie maybe.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by Masklinn: Of course they risk their lives. But they also take some. On orders. This is something I find hard to respect. No matter what side, no matter the reasons. As long as there will be people willing to do that job, you will have wars and dictators. But I'm too much of a hippie maybe.

Police officers occasionally take lives in order to protect their public.

American soldiers don't spend their entire careers killing, and they aren't used to enforce the government's will on the civilian population. I'd say they spend the overwhelming majority of their careers helping the innocent. In America those troops help during natural disasters, and those troops have rendered aid around the world.

What about your own soldiers? Just because they aren't fighting in this conflict doesn't mean that they don't have the same job.

No matter what reason is a bit broad. If you can't respect the soldier, maybe you really are too much of a hippie.

[Nachtrafe]

Originally posted by Ronn_Bman: I'll agree, but only with the fact that everyone deserves respect. Those who risk their lives do deserve a bit more of our respect. Of course, that isn't just soldiers. Firemen and police officers immediately spring to mind. What everyone contributes to society is certainly important, but not everyone has to put their life on the line to do their job. My job is important, but I won't be killed answering a phone or talking on the radio.

[img]graemlins/agree.gif[/img]

Well put, as always, Ronn.

[Masklinn]

What about your own soldiers?

I was talking about all soldiers, french ones included.

I was being a bit utopian too. I know that the world we are currently living in needs soldiers. I wish it didn't.

Of course I respect those people as much as anyone else, because they're human beings before all. And I wish they all will be able to go back home safe.

But I won't respect them more for the reason that they're soldiers and currently doing a war somewhere. As you may have noticed, I'm not a big fan of these kind stuff.

[MarkyMark]

Wise words Masklinn, I'd personally respect them more for refusing to go and fight. I don't want to be all wishy-washy but the people who deserve our respect more are people like charity and volunteer workers.
Sure we should respect the police etc for the job they do too, but others should be equally valued.

[pritchke]

I support the troops as well. I don't agree with the war as it is illegal but now that the damage is done (aggression on a sovereign nation in a first strike scenario, more hatred towards the west, more terrorist created by the declaration of war) I don't want them to come home until the iraqi dictator has been removed. If evil has been done might has well destroy a greater evil in the process.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by Masklinn: But I won't respect them more for the reason that they're soldiers and currently doing a war somewhere. As you may have noticed, I'm not a big fan of these kind stuff.

Who is a big fan of war? Me, because I support this action in Iraq? It's just not true. You agree there is a time and need for soldiers. You and I jsut disagree on whether or not now is that time.

The fact remains they risk their lives to protect and defend. You may not think they deserve anymore respect than someone who bags groceries, but I do. We don't live in a Utopian society, so someone has to risk their life, and I think those who do are deserving of special recognition.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by MarkyMark: Wise words Masklinn, I'd personally respect them more for refusing to go and fight. I don't want to be all wishy-washy but the people who deserve our respect more are people like charity and volunteer workers. Sure we should respect the police etc for the job they do too, but others should be equally valued.

But who allows charity and volunteer workers to do their jobs? Who makes it possible? I wonder how many charity and volunteer organization the Iraqi government allows to aid the Kurds or the Shiites? Oh wait, I forgot they don't have any money to fund charities because they are buying weapons and building palaces.

What about the fireman who goes into a burning home to pull out a child or a mother or a father or brother or a sister? He's helping someone long before the charities arrive to help the families who've lost their homes to fire. The fireman risks his own life to help others, and while charity workers devote themselves to helping others by giving time and money, they aren't risking their lives.

It doesn't mean that what they do isn't important, but just as they deserve a higher level of respect that someone who doesn't give a rip about helping people in need, so do those who risk their lives deserve more respect than all others. They know their job could cost their own life, but they do it anyway. It's different even if you can't see it.

BTW Marky, what was your user name the last time you were here?

[ 03-24-2003, 01:31 PM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

[Moiraine]

Originally posted by Ronn_Bman: The fact remains they (soldiers) risk their lives to protect and defend. You may not think they deserve anymore respect than someone who bags groceries, but I do. We don't live in a Utopian society, so someone has to risk their life, and I think those who do are deserving of special recognition.

OK, let's see if I understand it right.

Any one of the Iraqi soldiers deserve more respect than Mother Teresa - she gave her life to others, but apparently it is not the point.

Any soldier deserves more respect than Jenner and Pasteur and all the doctors and scientists whose work save billions of lives - but again that's not the point, they were just saving lives, not "freedom".

Any Nazi officer deserved more respect than the French men and women who struggled to protect Jewish children - but they were not officially fighting, were they ?

Weirdly, some soldiers seem more equal than others - since posts like "the French not wanting war because they are afraid to lose because they haven't won a war since 1812" don't seem to bother many people.

Allright.