Ban on Nazi-symbols?

[Azred]

As I have been saying elsewhere (a different board), no one should care whether or not Harry (or any person) wears a Nazi uniform to a costume party. It was a costume party, not a political rally!

The people who are afraid of, or motivated to anger by, a swastika give it power. If you ignore it or laugh at it you take away its power. Simple.

You can never oulaw human stupidity or human cruelty; those are facts with which we must all live on a daily basis. The evils that were perpretrated years ago are in the past and our choices now are 1) wail about what happened in the past or 2) deal with it and move on.

Nazism, in many variant forms, in not underground here in America. Drive through the Northwest and you can find a dozen places where neo-Nazi/Aryan movements have large compounds.

As a political movement/philosophy, Nazism must not be banned. Remember that the Nazis themselves began banning other groups as soon as they obtained power, so why copy their example if they are so bad?

[johnny]

Erm...to make sure they don't get another shot ?

[Azred]

Then what happens if they reorganize themselves as The Friendly Democratic People's Party?

How can you ban an ideology? Answer--you cannot.

I don't like them either, but just because we don't like them doesn't mean they will ever go away. We can only live with it.

[johnny]

Sorry, too passive for me.

[Tybaltus]

Originally posted by Jaradu: Anyway, regarding the ban, I agree with what everyone else has said - that we would have to rewrite books and erase movies which would takme out a part of history. Can the next generation never learn about Nazis?

Yes, very true here. You know just blocking out a piece of history or an icon does nothing. It wouldnt stop any underground movements that do and think these horrible things. Theyd find another icon to represent them.

And besides, if we've learned from history, which we should always do, we would learn that blocking out things leads to ignorance, and thats not the route to go. Ignorance COULD lead to it happening again, that proven in other points in history that I wont talk about in order to avoid the thread being sidetracked.

I mean, what exactly is accomplished by banning the symbol. I love the quote that was quoted early in this thread, saying that the sign doesnt breed the hate, it is the toughts that do. Well said, indeed.

As for what Id do if I saw someone with a Nazi symbol, Id probably WANT to punch their brains out, but Id probably just push them or frown at them.

[Sigmar]

My problem with the whole Harry-thing was that he is a member of the British Royal Family, he of all people shouldn't have been wearing it, but hey, kids (some more than others) are stupid. (Why do we have a monarchy at all if not to represent our "proud British history"? IMO The monarchy is a financial drain on society, but thats another story).

If someone actually wore the Swatstika in a party I went to, I would definately make my disgust known to him, and if he defends it claiming it is merely a "Fashion Statement", then the guy deserves to be punched in the face anyhow.

There's fashion...

and then there's stupidity and a lack of respect.

Oh, the ban is stupid btw (espcially if it also involves the banning of such images in historical documentaries).

The fact that it's illegal will merely boost the ego's of all the Nazi sad cases out there who think they're "Waging a war against the machine" when in reality the government's just taking minimalistic steps to prevent the miniscule potential threat they present.

Argh, who forgot to add chlorine to the Gene-pool? Freakin' KKK/Nazi dumbasses.

[Dreamer128]

Originally posted by Azred: Then what happens if they reorganize themselves as The Friendly Democratic People's Party? How can you ban an ideology? Answer--you cannot. I don't like them either, but just because we don't like them doesn't mean they will ever go away. We can only live with it.

That has been tried. We once had an anti-immigrant (not fascist) party called the CD. Since no one would rent them space for meetings, they typically disguised themselves as some other organisation (fishing clubs and the likes of that). Anyway, protesters always managed to find them, and the entire place would end up getting demolished.

[johnny]

Originally posted by Tybaltus: quote: Originally posted by Jaradu: Anyway, regarding the ban, I agree with what everyone else has said - that we would have to rewrite books and erase movies which would takme out a part of history. Can the next generation never learn about Nazis?

Yes, very true here. You know just blocking out a piece of history or an icon does nothing. It wouldnt stop any underground movements that do and think these horrible things. Theyd find another icon to represent them.

And besides, if we've learned from history, which we should always do, we would learn that blocking out things leads to ignorance, and thats not the route to go. Ignorance COULD lead to it happening again, that proven in other points in history that I wont talk about in order to avoid the thread being sidetracked.

I mean, what exactly is accomplished by banning the symbol. I love the quote that was quoted early in this thread, saying that the sign doesnt breed the hate, it is the toughts that do. Well said, indeed.

As for what Id do if I saw someone with a Nazi symbol, Id probably WANT to punch their brains out, but Id probably just push them or frown at them. [/QUOTE]Germany banned all nazi symbols, even swastika stickers on small scale model airplanes, just to give one example, and it didn't exactly lead to ignorance overthere. If there's any nation still very much aware of nazism, it's Germany. I don't think they'll ever forget, unlike a lot of other countries.

And what do you mean "it COULD lead to it happening again" ? It IS happening again, or haven't you noticed there's a war going on ? Several even ? That's what humans do, they go to war, because....well...they're humans. We definitely don't learn from history, if we would, we would have stopped waging war say....a couple of thousand years ago. But we didn't, and we never will.

The sign doesn't breed hate ? Wrong, it does very much so. Try wearing one and walk around the block a few times, you'll find out the true meaning of hate. Depending on where you live of course.

[johnny]

Originally posted by Dreamer128: quote: Originally posted by Azred: Then what happens if they reorganize themselves as The Friendly Democratic People's Party? How can you ban an ideology? Answer--you cannot. I don't like them either, but just because we don't like them doesn't mean they will ever go away. We can only live with it.

That has been tried. We once had an anti-immigrant (not fascist) party called the CD. Since no one would rent them space for meetings, they typically disguised themselves as some other organisation (fishing clubs and the likes of that). Anyway, protesters always managed to find them, and the entire place would end up getting demolished. [/QUOTE]Very true, they sure made those idiots "go away".

They may be around somewhere, hiding in the shadows, but they're no longer organised and no longer pose a threat. There's neonazi compounds in the US ? They wouldn't last a day overhere, they would be burned to the ground and chased away, like it should.

[Dreamer128]

Ever the cynic, Johnny. Granted, the League of the Nations and the United Nations didn't (don't) always do the best of jobs. But I think the European Union has, and is, definately working out as a peace project. Compare the number of times the EU states went to war with each other before 1945 to the number of times it happened the founding of the European Community.