Bush aims for defence budget rise as he seeks social cuts

[True_Moose]

Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by True_Moose: The collapse of the Whig party in the 1850s, combined with the rise of the Republican party, was one of the key factors in igniting the US Civil War.

Interesting; I've not heard this hypothesis before. Where did you hear or read this? [/QUOTE]HTST 359, American History to 1877.

This is, simplified, what happened. The Democrats were strongly southern based, and unapologetically in favor of slavery. The Whigs, the other main party at the time, could not come up with a united policy, they would preach the abolition of slavery when in the north and its promotion while in the south. Problem is, there were newspapers so the inconsistencies were exposed, and their inability to come to terms with the single overriding issue in America at the time caused an implosion, and a slide into irrelevance in the 1850s. Interesting side note - the Republicans were not abolitionists, they were Free-Soilers, who believed in keeping territories free from the competition of slaveholders for white farmers.

When the Republican party came into being, since the Democrats were so dominant in the south, but unable to gain momentum in the north, the Republicans didn't even try to make themselves appealing to Southerners - they barely ran legitimate candidates in the South. When Abraham Lincoln (a Republican) was elected, none of his electoral votes came from (later) Confederate states. The southerners, who had a long history of feelings of vulnerability to their slaveholding, read Lincoln's election as a precursor to abolition, and seceded.

Trying to explain the Civil War on an online forum is basically impossible. There were so many other factors, like anti-Catholic sentiment, the Mexican War, the antebellum movement, etc, that to pin the thing on one event would be naive. But the collapse of the Whig party, which gave rise to the regionalism of the two parties, certainly broadened the divide.

[ 02-07-2006, 01:56 AM: Message edited by: True_Moose ]

[Chewbacca]

You can tell which Party is owned, bought and paid for, by the old military industrial complex. I'll never trust anyone who depends on war to prosper.

But hey the good news I read is they are going to retire %10 of the U.S. nuclear missle arsenal. That's progress and it saves some dough.

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by True_Moose: Timber, you may be interested in some of Alexander Hamilton's work as the Secretary of Finance. He argues that keeping a moderate level of debt is good for the country.

Yes. It does. Just as keeping a moderate level of debt is good for an individual. The notion of a "credit rating" isn't just about credit cards, it's a historical fact based on the way people behave economically, including nations.

But, I wasn't speaking to then, to Hamilton. I was speaking to now. If we get back down to anything near or approaching a "moderate" level of debt, then we may have this discussion -- but for now it's academic.

[Azred]

Originally posted by True_Moose: This is, simplified, what happened. The Democrats were strongly southern based, and unapologetically in favor of slavery. The Whigs, the other main party at the time, could not come up with a united policy, they would preach the abolition of slavery when in the north and its promotion while in the south. Problem is, there were newspapers so the inconsistencies were exposed, and their inability to come to terms with the single overriding issue in America at the time caused an implosion, and a slide into irrelevance in the 1850s. Interesting side note - the Republicans were not abolitionists, they were Free-Soilers, who believed in keeping territories free from the competition of slaveholders for white farmers. When the Republican party came into being, since the Democrats were so dominant in the south, but unable to gain momentum in the north, the Republicans didn't even try to make themselves appealing to Southerners - they barely ran legitimate candidates in the South. When Abraham Lincoln (a Republican) was elected, none of his electoral votes came from (later) Confederate states. The southerners, who had a long history of feelings of vulnerability to their slaveholding, read Lincoln's election as a precursor to abolition, and seceded. Trying to explain the Civil War on an online forum is basically impossible. There were so many other factors, like anti-Catholic sentiment, the Mexican War, the antebellum movement, etc, that to pin the thing on one event would be naive. But the collapse of the Whig party, which gave rise to the regionalism of the two parties, certainly broadened the divide.

Thank you for the refresher. I keep a lot of information stored in memory, but I can't keep everything stored there. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img]

[Felix The Assassin]

This is just wonderful (wunderbar)!
This year my HMO for life is reasonable, next year it will go up 75%, and by 09 it will be thrice of what I pay this year! My Dental for life is already the single most health care issue I pay, and it will double over the next three years.
My Vocational training has been shortened by 12 months. As it is, already on a reduced time line, it will now only take me through 30 months.

In review, I served 23 years, 3 months 16 days. Contributed $100 a month for my entire first term enlistment, and now I must finish my vocational program NLT 1 Nov 08, or finish under my own funding.
I must pay for treatment, even at the military treatment facility, or at the VA for non-disability rated issues.
My prescriptions, (the single best benefit) will increase by 1/3 through FY 09.
My retirement is already taxed, but now the disability supplement is coming into the sight picture as well. Wonder what else might be moving into the sight picture?

TL, For the record; As a DA Contractor, I receive a very adequate salary. However, as compared to the lawmakers themselves, I still only compare to the string, of the bag, that holds the gold!

“With malice toward none, with charity for all,
with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right,
let us strive on to finish the work we are in,
to bind up the nation’s wounds,
to care for him who shall have borne the battle
and for his widow, and his orphan,
to do all which may achieve and cherish
a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.”

President Lincoln’s second inaugural address, 4 Mar 1865.