Being Politically Correct. Good or Bad?

[Fljotsdale]

Originally posted by ladyzekke: Well, I think maybe if we all looked at things in this perspective, if possible, it would help make things better: K, just say you are in traffic, and some guy cuts you off and almost causes an accident, you slam your brakes on, and are completely pissed at this "idiot". Well, just say this guy was a friend of yours, say you were both driving in separate cars to the same location. If that were the case, things would be different no? Instead of getting pissed, you would think "woah, get a grip friend, shite, you almost bashed me!" feeling more relief that nothing happened rather than seething at said "idiot" as it sometimes may be if it were a stranger. You may even laugh later at the whole incident. Again, not the case if it was a stranger. So being politically correct really depends on who is saying what to whom. I think that getting to know eachother first before entering "debates" would make a big difference in how we all react to eachother's differences. Many of us still do not know eachother very well, and may take statements the wrong way, and reply in a heated fashion, which of course sometimes intensifies bad relations, and the debate unfortunately "escalates" from there in a non-productive manner. Just my Current outlook on things, of course I could be wrong, just tossing my thoughts out.

Very true, Ladyzekke! If we all remembered to treat each other as at least POTENTIAL friends a lot more tolerance would result, and a lot less 'taking offence' and crying 'insult'!
Of course, there is a need, also, to realise that some people are more more sensitive than others, for various reasons, and try to couch our honest thoughts and feelings in as non-threatening a way as we can (whilst remining true to ourselves).

On your point about getting to know someone first - I'm not sure I agree. How can you get to know someone if you don't express your beliefs and opinions?
Two of the many people I like most, in this forum alone, - Diogenes and Nachtrafe - are strongly opinioned people. My first dealing with Dio was a strong disagreement. He is now a friend. My first dealings with Nachtrafe were very friendly, but we now know we disagree about a lot! We are still friends! Ronn-Bman and I hardly ever agree, but I like him a lot. Hm. Now I'm not sure if I'm agreeing or disagreeing with you, lol!
There are other people that I have a lot in common with that I find it harder to deal with, for sole and simple reason that they are, imo, rather oversensitive. I realise that there is usually a very good reason for oversensitivity, and that there is a need for me and others to be more aware of their need - but again, how can we know until we have expressed ourselves honestly, how others will react to us?
*Sigh* - interpersonal relationships can be SO difficult!






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Here be Dragons!
Proud to be Dubbed Queen of the Illuminati by Diogenes.

"If I say something to you and it can be taken two ways, and one of those ways upsets you...I meant the other one."

[Fljotsdale]

Originally posted by Moni: Short and top a point...Political "Correctness" actually offends a lot of people it is intended not to. I think we should be aware of who we are talking to before we expect them to accept such forms of "politeness" since to many, it is considered phony and rude. (I have become an "Anglo-American" since I moved to Texas. I think it is pretty stupid since my heritage includes Native American and Negro. Classifying people by their predominant skin color is as ignorant as making assumptions about them based on the clothes they wear and I am not the only person who has this opinion. I know plenty of people across this nation of differing racial backgrounds who would back me up on this if they knew to post here)

One of the nicest things about 'virtual' communities is that we have no idea of each others' skin colour, race, religion, politics, body shape, ability or disability, gender, etc, unless we choose to reveal it. We can get to know each other as people without any possible prejudice colouring our reactions to each other.
Excellent post, Moni!

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Here be Dragons!
Proud to be Dubbed Queen of the Illuminati by Diogenes.

"If I say something to you and it can be taken two ways, and one of those ways upsets you...I meant the other one."

[Moiraine]

Originally posted by Liliara: Excellent posts all! Thank you for your replies! (Sorry Memnoch, I didn't know where this thread should go really!) Just a question I wanted to put out there. Like I said. I don't mean this to pertain to the board and what happens here, but in real life. Thanks Guys!!!

Liliara, I read that part, what I posted I did thinking about real life as well.


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The world is my oyster !

[Cloudbringer]

Just a thought, F, but perhaps one person's 'OVERsensitivity' is someone else's norm? I think it's rather relative and LadyZ's point is a good one. If I've talked with you about your children, your difficult childhood or your dog and had a 'social' time with you I'm much less likely to use sarcastic/flaming rejoinders the first time we disagree on nuclear disarmament! (just an example off the top of my head!)

Anyway, to deal with the topic of being pc- I work for the State and I've learned to deal with it because it is a necessity in my job. Do I like learning a new 'acceptable' term every week or so? Not really, but I do it. I'm not big on labeling people anyway. But I will say this, if a group of people wishes to be called by a specific term, I respect their wishes. As for negotiating discussions using pc-speak, it's a challenge some days, but I'd rather be annoying in an unoffensive way than in an offensive way. If that makes any sense! On a serious note: ONE thing it has taught me is to THINK before I speak most of the time. Trying to find the 'acceptable' means of expressing my thoughts/opinions at the office has made me have to consider the other person or persons I'm communicating with a lot more than I used to. It means I'm paying much more attention and that is never a bad thing, in my opinion.

Cloudy

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Raindancer of the Laughing Hyenas Clan
CloudDragon of the OHF
Storm-Queen
Raven's Cloud
StormCloud of the Black Knight: Heart Mind Soul Forever
"To sleep, perchance to dream..."

[Fljotsdale]

Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Just a thought, F, but perhaps one person's 'OVERsensitivity' is someone else's norm? I think it's rather relative and LadyZ's point is a good one. If I've talked with you about your children, your difficult childhood or your dog and had a 'social' time with you I'm much less likely to use sarcastic/flaming rejoinders the first time we disagree on nuclear disarmament! (just an example off the top of my head!) Anyway, to deal with the topic of being pc- I work for the State and I've learned to deal with it because it is a necessity in my job. Do I like learning a new 'acceptable' term every week or so? Not really, but I do it. I'm not big on labeling people anyway. But I will say this, if a group of people wishes to be called by a specific term, I respect their wishes. As for negotiating discussions using pc-speak, it's a challenge some days, but I'd rather be annoying in an unoffensive way than in an offensive way. If that makes any sense! On a serious note: ONE thing it has taught me is to THINK before I speak most of the time. Trying to find the 'acceptable' means of expressing my thoughts/opinions at the office has made me have to consider the other person or persons I'm communicating with a lot more than I used to. It means I'm paying much more attention and that is never a bad thing, in my opinion. Cloudy

Mm. Good points Cloudy. *sigh* I can see where you are coming from and I largely agree, but....

I guess I am just used to having good no-holds-barred debates with people - even heated debates - and us all staying friends despite holding strongly opposed views. I find walking on eggshells is something I really hate - had to do it all my life with a close relative, lol! I DO appreciate that this is easier if you have established friendly relations first but it is also possible with total strangers - I have done it!

And I understand about using the terms a specific group of people want, and I also do so whenever I can in good conscience - but sometimes it goes so very strongly against the grain! What of the way I (or anyone else) may feel about using a particular term? Does that count for nothing? This is why we need tolerance, of course! (I am guessing you are thinking god, christian? You (and others) find it offensive for people not to capitalise those words, while I have a deep antipathy to using capitals for those words myself, and will only do so if they are the first word in a sentence. So what do we do? I know I am in a minority, but I do not think I should be obliged to follow the majority by doing something I personally find offensive. I don't mind other people using capitals if they want to - and I would like other people to be just as tolerant of me NOT using capitals. The best I can do is to avoid using the words where at all possible.
No offence intended, Cloudy.

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Here be Dragons!
Proud to be Dubbed Queen of the Illuminati by Diogenes.

"If I say something to you and it can be taken two ways, and one of those ways upsets you...I meant the other one."

Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Anyway, to deal with the topic of being pc- I work for the State and I've learned to deal with it because it is a necessity in my job. Do I like learning a new 'acceptable' term every week or so? Not really, but I do it. I'm not big on labeling people anyway. But I will say this, if a group of people wishes to be called by a specific term, I respect their wishes. As for negotiating discussions using pc-speak, it's a challenge some days, but I'd rather be annoying in an unoffensive way than in an offensive way. If that makes any sense! On a serious note: ONE thing it has taught me is to THINK before I speak most of the time. Trying to find the 'acceptable' means of expressing my thoughts/opinions at the office has made me have to consider the other person or persons I'm communicating with a lot more than I used to. It means I'm paying much more attention and that is never a bad thing, in my opinion. Cloudy

Great post, Cloudy.
Have you noticed that PC'ness is a generational thing?
Using "African Americans" as an example...it is today's "young" (below 30) generation that is comfortable with the term whereas their parents are fine with being black and their parents are perfectly OK with Negro.
Most unfortunately, if you are speaking with a group that has all three generations listening, you are doomed to make one of them angry since the eldest hate the term "African American" and the youngest refuse to acknowledge any black person as a Negro. It is the middle aged generation that finds it the most humorous, I think (at least that is what I get from my middle aged black acquaintences and friends )
The same goes for "Native American" and "Indian" as opposed to clarifying which actual tribe you are referring to, something the elders would insist on.
Who knows what the next generation will come up with and what we'll be asked to conform to next!
Here in the southwest, Mexican, Mexican-American and Hispanic are all acceptable terms. I understand the Latino communities of the Eastern and Northern states have differing opinions, depending on where their ancestors originally came from (Cuba vs Mexico, etc.) It must be very trying for people at times, having to sort everyone out that way!



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The best thing about karma is that you create your own.

Pets Need Love Too

Originally posted by Fljotsdale: And I understand about using the terms a specific group of people want, and I also do so whenever I can in good conscience - but sometimes it goes so very strongly against the grain! What of the way I (or anyone else) may feel about using a particular term? Does that count for nothing? This is why we need tolerance, of course! (I am guessing you are thinking god, christian? You (and others) find it offensive for people not to capitalise those words, while I have a deep antipathy to using capitals for those words myself, and will only do so if they are the first word in a sentence. So what do we do? I know I am in a minority, but I do not think I should be obliged to follow the majority by doing something I personally find offensive. I don't mind other people using capitals if they want to - and I would like other people to be just as tolerant of me NOT using capitals. The best I can do is to avoid using the words where at all possible.

Well, Fljotsdale, I am not offended by you not capitalizing God or Christian.
I think any true Christian would show you tolerance on that point in respect to your beliefs. I would say that the nit-pickers need to hone their spirituality but then, some nit-picker could come and get me banned for insulting them!
You can only ask for respect and receive it or not. If someone isn't willing to offer you respect in that regard, they won't in other areas where you also deserve it and your relationship with them will be doomed unless they can learn to accept individuals for what they are and keep their spiritual chastisements to themselves. We all have a purpose with or without a god or gods and I seriously doubt that the Christian God is a nit-picker when it comes to spelling.





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The best thing about karma is that you create your own.

Pets Need Love Too

[Ronn_Bman]

Tough subject! I think this is like most things, good and bad.

People have always done similar things out of respect for others, but suddenly in the past few years people, people have begun to say the expected thing not out of respect, but because they feel they have to.

The best thing about political correctness is that it allows people who say improper, and sometimes hurtful, things without meaning to offend, an idea of what's expected. I think everyone has an uncle like this, you know, you see him a couple of times at year family gatherings. Nice guy, but on congratulating his pregnant neice he says, "so you finally got 'knocked up'. Do you know who the dad is?" If it can be used as a guide by people who wish to be considerate, it's great.

The worst thing, is when people intend to offend others. They say it "wrong" first and then say, "oh, I'm sorry I should have said * whatever*."

The news media absolutely kills me trying to be PC. They're so afraid that they'll offend someone that sometimes I think they make up their own PC terms because they think they'll sound better.

Overall, being politically correct is just an extension of being courteous. There have always been people who are thoughtful of the feelings of others, and these people say the right things for the right reasons. They follow the "Golden Rule". It's the "mutation" of political correctness and those who use it to further their own agenda that leaves such a bad taste in people's mouths.

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"Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins."

[Elif Godson]

it all boils down to one simple thing. RESPECT. If someone
has a differnt opinion from you, that is fine. Dont try to bully
them into submission of your ideas. With greater strength comes
greater responsibilty. Be wise in how you yeild it. A wise person
never bites there own nose just to spite there face

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The Ruby Rouge of the ALSB
Official Slayer of Pest's in Cloudy's Kitchen
Blessed is the Warlock
Advisor to the Lady Lioness for Kitchen raid's and such...

[Lord of Alcohol]

I hate political correctness! I can be rude and have bad manners when angry (err as some of you know, and if mom knew I'd be yelled at)but politcal correctness goes beyond good manners and into stupidity. It seems every little group now takes offense to every little thing that I think the government needs to put out a pamphlet every 3 months to tell us who is or isnt currently offended.
As kind of an example for awhile here (in Charlotte) years ago on the news the politically correct anchor teams of the news would describe robbery suspects- mid- 6' tall, twenties, wearing a white striped with blue shirt and jeans. I mean they would say everything BUT race in an effort to be "politically correct". They did quit this ridiculous policy, but when you describe someone I think its ok to say white guy, balck guy, oriental guy, etc. Whats wrong with that?
Ok now I will rant about the local news "teams". All have the two-anchor male/female pairings, and what kills me is when they take turns talking on the same story. Male- "Theres trouble in the Charlotte schools" Female-"The school board is worried about test scores", male-"but teachers say the system is flawed", female"blah blah blah" You get the picture. I say pick ONE anchor to give us the damn news! I dont care if they are male or female just LET ONE PERSON SPEAK ON THE SAME SUBJECT! Jockeying back and forth just makes them look stupid, yet they do it. Ok I guess I'm done with this equally stupid post