Syria-US

[Timber Loftis]

US shuts off Iraq-Syria oil pipeline.
Iran threatens to NOT remain neutral if Syria is attacked.
Sharon wants militants out of Damascus and Hizbollah out of Lebanon and US economic and diplomatic pressure asserted on Syria.
Syria wants the Golan Heights back.
Spain reaffirms that Syria is a friend and it will not support US.
MSNBC Site

Note: not on the site but also relevant in the news:
Syria has stated any sanctions will be seen as an act of aggression.

[ 04-15-2003, 03:22 PM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]

[Desdicado]

Aha!, at the behest of Israel again I see.(I might cross reference you here!)

[ 04-15-2003, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Desdicado ]

[Rimjaw]

Article

The pipeline was used for illegal oil shipments in the first place so don't get too excited.

[Timber Loftis]

Today's NY Times take on the issue:

Syria Harbors Iraqis and Grants Transit to Hezbollah, U.S. Asserts
By DON VAN NATTA Jr. and DOUGLAS JEHL

WASHINGTON, April 14 — Syria is allowing some members of Hezbollah, a Shiite Muslim militant group based in Lebanon, to travel from Syrian-controlled southern Lebanon to Iraq, current and former United States intelligence officials said today.

Senior Bush administration officials also continued to accuse Syria of helping members of Saddam Hussein's family and leadership circle to escape to Syria from Iraq.

Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld said the United States government had "intelligence that indicates that some Iraqi people have been allowed into Syria — in some cases to stay and some cases to transit." He did not identify the Iraqis, or indicate whether they were leaders in Saddam Hussein's government. Syrian officials have denied the accusations.

An American intelligence official said that no senior Iraqi had been identified as having crossed into Syria, but suspicions remained strong that some of Mr. Hussein's top aides had fled to Damascus.

"We believe that family members have gone over and it would not surprise us that some of the card people have filtered across the border as well," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity. "But we don't think it's a large number. Statistically, you've got to believe it's happening."

The "card people" are the 52 most-wanted officials in the Hussein government. Their images have been printed on decks of playing cards distributed to American forces in Iraq.

Among Iraqis who have taken refuge in Syria in recent weeks and months are weapons scientists who fled Iraq to avoid questioning by United Nations inspectors and capture by American forces, an American intelligence official said. The official said some scientists and others with links to the Hussein government may have traveled on to third countries, including Libya and Russia.

One of Iraq's top scientists, Jaffar al-Jaffer, the head of its nuclear program, turned himself in and was in American custody, a senior administration official said, though he would not say where.

The allegations about Hezbollah members moving into Iraq implicates Syria because its members cannot enter Iraq without the consent of Syrian government officials, said Matthew Levitt, a former F.B.I. terrorism analyst who is now a senior fellow with the Washington Institute for Near East Policy.

Hezbollah, which has about 2,500 fighters and is armed and supported primarily by Iran, was the main force resisting Israeli occupation of southern Lebanon before Israel's withdrawal in 2000.

The group also kidnapped and held hostage more than a dozen Americans in Lebanon in the 1980's, and a cell within the organization is regarded by American intelligence as a major terrorist threat to American and Israeli interests around the world.

American officials say they have evidence that Hezbollah has plans to attack United States embassies and other American targets.

The officials said Hezbollah's intentions in Iraq are unclear, but expressed concern that its presence there could threaten a new, American-backed government of Iraq.

Hezbollah officials in Beirut have denied that the group's members have traveled to Iraq to carry out operations there. In a statement last week, Sheik Naim Qassem, Hezbollah's deputy leader, said his group's role in the Iraq conflict had been limited to denunciation of what he called "the American aggression."

The reported movement of Hezbollah fighters into Iraq would reflect what experts say has been an effort by Syria's current leader, Bashar al-Assad, to forge closer ties with an organization that his father, Hafez al-Assad, generally kept at arm's length.

Dennis Ross, a former American special envoy to the Middle East, said last June that Syria had shipped Syrian-made rockets directly to Hezbollah in Syrian-controlled parts of southern Lebanon. Until last year, Mr. Ross said, Syria's role in arming Hezbollah was limited mostly to permitting shipments of Iranian-made arms through its territory.

"Hafez Assad was no slouch when it came to threatening Israel," Mr. Ross wrote in an article published last year in The Wall Street Journal. "But he controlled the flow of Iranian arms to Hezbollah, and he never provided Syrian weapons directly. He certainly did not mind Hezbollah keeping the pressure on Israel, but he was not about to let Hezbollah drag him into a war with Israel either.

"But Bashar Assad seems to lack his father's sense of limits," Mr. Ross continued.

Syria has a long history of cooperating with and sponsoring Islamic militant groups, including Hezbollah and Hamas, Palestinian Islamic Jihad and other Palestinian organizations. But it has battled others, including Al Qaeda.

Trade ties between Iraq and Syria were solidified only in the late 1990's, after the two countries opened border posts that had been closed for nearly a decade because of rivalries between the two governments. Syria allowed an illicit flow of goods to Iraq while Iraq exported oil through Syrian ports, all in violation of a United Nations trade embargo on Iraq.

Syrian officials have denied possessing biological, chemical or nuclear weapons programs. Today, however, Mr. Rumsfeld declared that Syria had conducted a chemical weapons test within the past 12 to 15 months.

In testimony to Congress last year, Carl W. Ford, Jr., the assistant secretary of state for intelligence and research, said Syria had a stockpile of the nerve agent sarin and may have been trying to develop more advanced nerve agents as well.

[Desdicado]

Everyone is allowed to have allies aren't they?, even Iraqis!. Just because you don't agree with 'em, don't make 'em wrong Mr Bush!.
As for some of the Iraqi leadership, what has made them deserve to be put on cards and advertised to be killed?. Sure some of them deserve it, but Tariq Aziz was just a diplomat doing his job, never killed anyone, he's on a card, the info minister, he sure had balls, "Bullets and Shoes" he's on a card. I really hope those guys escape, if its into Syria good on them both, if only to spite Bush a bit so he sees he doesn't always get his own way.

Originally posted by Desdicado: Everyone is allowed to have allies aren't they?, even Iraqis!. Just because you don't agree with 'em, don't make 'em wrong Mr Bush!. As for some of the Iraqi leadership, what has made them deserve to be put on cards and advertised to be killed?. Sure some of them deserve it, but Tariq Aziz was just a diplomat doing his job, never killed anyone, he's on a card, the info minister, he sure had balls, "Bullets and Shoes" he's on a card. I really hope those guys escape, if its into Syria good on them both, if only to spite Bush a bit so he sees he doesn't always get his own way.

Look again Desdicado, "Baghdad Bob" is not on the cards. Tariq Aziz has been skirting the fine line of legality for as long as I can remember, and is/was an official member of the Ruling Elite class of people who were responsible for the torture and death of many....but then you don't care if peasents are killed.....unless they are unfortunate enough to accidently be killed by americans.

[Desdicado]

Well that's good Magik, thanks for clarifying that, I'm glad he ain't there, As for Tariq aziz, I didn't know taunting the US invoked an automatic death penalty, I'd better watch what I say now hadn't I, it might be me next!.

My main point was that what gives the US the right to say who lives and who dies?. That's what I'm getting at, if they tortured or killed folks, then fine they deserve to be punished, but after trial.

And I don't want any innocent people to be killed by either side.

[ 04-15-2003, 04:04 PM: Message edited by: Desdicado ]

[Djinn Raffo]

Wasn't Baghdad Bob one of the Jokers?

[Sir Taliesin]

Originally posted by Desdicado: Well that's good Magik, thanks for clarifying that, I'm glad he ain't there, As for Tariq aziz, I didn't know taunting the US invoked an automatic death penalty, I'd better watch what I say now hadn't I, it might be me next!. My main point was that what gives the US the right to say who lives and who dies?. That's what I'm getting at, if they tortured or killed folks, then fine they deserve to be punished, but after trial. And I don't want any innocent people to be killed by either side.

The US wants the Card People to brought in FOR trial. We don't want them butchered. It's much better for all concerned that they be tried in a court of law. IMO, an Iraqi Court of Law. After all the Iraqi people are the ones that suffered under the unjust rule of the Baathist Party and Saddam Hussein.

As for Tariq Aziz, he was one of the first and most principle backers of Saddam. He was not some simple bureaucrat just doing his job as you wish to believe. How ridiculous to even suggest that he was anything else! His hands were just as dirty has Saddam. Jeez, I can just imagine what you thought of Herr Goebbels of Nazi Germany fame!

Also, I'd like to add that this little war didn't just involve the US, but you British, as well as Aussies and Poles and by some accounts Canadians as well. So don't just poke figures at us, but your on government as well.

[Desdicado]

Dr Goebbels actually raises a very interesting point, he was a very clever man who pioneered many of the propoganda tools used by Governments today, such as the US during the Iraq conflict.
The British government got us involved, doesn't mean the population agreed.
It caused the biggest demonstrations ever seen in the UK.
Anyway, time for a protein shake and a game of Might and Magic 7

[ 04-15-2003, 06:01 PM: Message edited by: Desdicado ]