High court: Juvenile death penalty unconstitutional

Grojlach · 03-03-2005, 03:06 AM

Not really news anymore, though still an interesting subject to discuss. Again. And again.

High court: Juvenile death penalty unconstitutional

(AP) -- The Supreme Court ruled Tuesday that the Constitution forbids the execution of killers who were under 18 when they committed their crimes, ending a practice used in 19 states.

The 5-4 decision throws out the death sentences of about 70 juvenile murderers and bars states from seeking to execute minors for future crimes.

The executions, the court said, were unconstitutionally cruel.

It was the second major defeat at the high court in three years for supporters of the death penalty. Justices in 2002 banned the execution of the mentally retarded, also citing the Constitution's Eighth Amendment ban on cruel and unusual punishments.

The court had already outlawed executions for those who were 15 and younger when they committed their crimes.

Tuesday's ruling prevents states from making 16- and 17-year-olds eligible for execution.

Justice Anthony Kennedy, writing for the majority, cited the fact that most states don't allow the execution of juvenile killers and those that do use the penalty infrequently. The trend, he noted, was to abolish the practice.

"Our society views juveniles ... as categorically less culpable than the average criminal," Kennedy wrote.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/01/sc....ap/index.html

Azred · 03-03-2005, 03:23 AM

Well, this will effect only those who are currently on death row who committed crimes when they were under 18; such folks might be as old as 30 now. I suppose they'll be rolled back into the prison's general population.

What is going to happen when law enforcement catches their first juvenile serial killer? It's only a matter of time before one emerges, you know....

VulcanRider · 03-03-2005, 09:04 AM

And, in a twist of irony, this was also in the news yesterday...

A 14-year-old boy was charged with shooting a school bus driver to death as she drove her morning route Wednesday.
Read more

IMO, these situations need to be decided on a case-by-case basis. Some teens are mentally more mature than their physical age suggests, and should be treated as such. I admit to having serious hesitation about a penalty like that for a 14-year old, but the option should be available if the judge trying the case deems it appropriate.

VulcanRider · 03-03-2005, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Azred:
What is going to happen when law enforcement catches their first juvenile serial killer? It's only a matter of time before one emerges, you know....

What about Lee Boyd Malvo, the teen who was helping the D.C. sniper? He's serving life for 2 murders, and I read yesterday the Virginia district attorney is holding off on prosecuting him for a 3rd because of this ruling. IMO, he deserved the death penalty.

Illumina Drathiran'ar · 03-03-2005, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VulcanRider:
And, in a twist of irony, this was also in the news yesterday...

A 14-year-old boy was charged with shooting a school bus driver to death as she drove her morning route Wednesday.
Read more

IMO, these situations need to be decided on a case-by-case basis. Some teens are mentally more mature than their physical age suggests, and should be treated as such. I admit to having serious hesitation about a penalty like that for a 14-year old, but the option should be available if the judge trying the case deems it appropriate.

I disagree. I don't care how mature they are. If this boy was really that mature, maybe he wouldn't have shot her.

We can't play the case-by-case card because, for one reason, it's frankly unfair to treat people like children in every regard except when it comes to executing them. People want to make exceptions to the whole "You're a minor" rule when it comes to the death penalty, searching in vain for a way to execute someone who really isn't an adult, all to satiate a thirst for vengeance.

[ 03-03-2005, 12:44 PM: Message edited by: Illumina Drathiran'ar ]

Aragorn1 · 03-03-2005, 01:40 PM

I don't agre witht the death penalty at all as:
1. Mistakes, one innocent man dying is a greater injustice than any number or those that are guilty that go free. I know we're talking about killers here, but juries have been shown to convivt more when they know they are not taking someones life, so reducing such cases and those that are wrongly convicted can be released without too much damage.

2. A life in prison,separted from al those you love, left to contemplate what you have done, is in my opinion a fate worse than death.

Aragorn1 · 03-03-2005, 01:45 PM

3. Is revenge and revenge alone ever the right reason to do anything? A question i find difficult to answer.

Lucern · 03-03-2005, 03:29 PM

I'm glad this will end the phrase "Try X as an adult" in cases that could go for the death penalty. Even for serial killers, it doesn't break my heart for them to spend the next 80 years in prison - even given our awful prison system.

I heard one commentator say that this, along with the finding of executing mentally retarded people unconstitutional, is now a pattern leading away from the death penalty entirely, but with a 5-4 split on arguably the most ethically unsound part of it(I know that's not what the SC rules on), I really don't see it happening any time soon.

03-03-2005, 03:23 AM	#2
Azred Drow Priestess Join Date: March 13, 2001 Location: a hidden sanctorum high above the metroplex Age: 55 Posts: 4,037	Well, this will effect only those who are currently on death row who committed crimes when they were under 18; such folks might be as old as 30 now. I suppose they'll be rolled back into the prison's general population. What is going to happen when law enforcement catches their first juvenile serial killer? It's only a matter of time before one emerges, you know.... __________________ Everything may be explained by a conspiracy theory. All conspiracy theories are true. No matter how thinly you slice it, it's still bologna.

03-03-2005, 09:04 AM	#3
VulcanRider Lord Soth Join Date: July 25, 2002 Location: Melbourne FL Age: 61 Posts: 1,971	And, in a twist of irony, this was also in the news yesterday... A 14-year-old boy was charged with shooting a school bus driver to death as she drove her morning route Wednesday. Read more IMO, these situations need to be decided on a case-by-case basis. Some teens are mentally more mature than their physical age suggests, and should be treated as such. I admit to having serious hesitation about a penalty like that for a 14-year old, but the option should be available if the judge trying the case deems it appropriate. __________________ ----- Help feed animals in shelters with just a mouse click at The Animal Rescue Site !!

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03-03-2005, 03:06 AM	#1
Grojlach Zartan Join Date: May 2, 2001 Location: Ulpia Noviomagus Batavorum Age: 44 Posts: 5,281	Not really news anymore, though still an interesting subject to discuss. Again. And again. High court: Juvenile death penalty unconstitutional (AP) -- The Supreme Court ruled Tuesday that the Constitution forbids the execution of killers who were under 18 when they committed their crimes, ending a practice used in 19 states. The 5-4 decision throws out the death sentences of about 70 juvenile murderers and bars states from seeking to execute minors for future crimes. The executions, the court said, were unconstitutionally cruel. It was the second major defeat at the high court in three years for supporters of the death penalty. Justices in 2002 banned the execution of the mentally retarded, also citing the Constitution's Eighth Amendment ban on cruel and unusual punishments. The court had already outlawed executions for those who were 15 and younger when they committed their crimes. Tuesday's ruling prevents states from making 16- and 17-year-olds eligible for execution. Justice Anthony Kennedy, writing for the majority, cited the fact that most states don't allow the execution of juvenile killers and those that do use the penalty infrequently. The trend, he noted, was to abolish the practice. "Our society views juveniles ... as categorically less culpable than the average criminal," Kennedy wrote. http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/01/sc....ap/index.html

03-03-2005, 01:40 PM	#6
Aragorn1 Symbol of Cyric Join Date: July 3, 2001 Location: Cornwall England Age: 38 Posts: 1,197	I don't agre witht the death penalty at all as: 1. Mistakes, one innocent man dying is a greater injustice than any number or those that are guilty that go free. I know we're talking about killers here, but juries have been shown to convivt more when they know they are not taking someones life, so reducing such cases and those that are wrongly convicted can be released without too much damage. 2. A life in prison,separted from al those you love, left to contemplate what you have done, is in my opinion a fate worse than death.

03-03-2005, 01:45 PM	#7
Aragorn1 Symbol of Cyric Join Date: July 3, 2001 Location: Cornwall England Age: 38 Posts: 1,197	3. Is revenge and revenge alone ever the right reason to do anything? A question i find difficult to answer.

03-03-2005, 03:29 PM	#8
Lucern Quintesson Join Date: August 28, 2004 Location: the middle of Michigan Age: 43 Posts: 1,011	I'm glad this will end the phrase "Try X as an adult" in cases that could go for the death penalty. Even for serial killers, it doesn't break my heart for them to spend the next 80 years in prison - even given our awful prison system. I heard one commentator say that this, along with the finding of executing mentally retarded people unconstitutional, is now a pattern leading away from the death penalty entirely, but with a 5-4 split on arguably the most ethically unsound part of it(I know that's not what the SC rules on), I really don't see it happening any time soon.

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