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Old 03-10-2004, 01:44 PM   #21
Jerr Conner
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Join Date: January 24, 2002
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Quote:
Originally posted by Illumina Drathiran'ar:
You know, I'm actually siding with Jobn and Bush on this one. ::freezes, hands off keyboard, and looks around, alarmed, for flying pigs or the Four Horsemen:: I think Bush made a good call there ::glances over shoulder:: by not acting rashly ::checks to see if the ground has opened up::
There's four Gibberlings riding Elephants outside my house...
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Old 03-10-2004, 02:10 PM   #22
John D Harris
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Quote:
Originally posted by Illumina Drathiran'ar:
You know, I'm actually siding with Jobn and Bush on this one. ::freezes, hands off keyboard, and looks around, alarmed, for flying pigs or the Four Horsemen:: I think Bush made a good call there ::glances over shoulder:: by not acting rashly ::checks to see if the ground has opened up::
JDH stares wide eyed open mouthed quickly checks pulse, then weather report for the 9 planes

[ 03-10-2004, 03:35 PM: Message edited by: John D Harris ]
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Old 03-10-2004, 04:02 PM   #23
Timber Loftis
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Hilarious program you wrote there, JohnD. ROFLMAO. [img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img]
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Old 03-10-2004, 04:23 PM   #24
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No kidding, JD! It seems CICS has a purpose beyond ancient bank programs after all! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:51 AM   #25
InjaYew
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President Bush: Don't use my husband as your mascot

A 9/11 widow's open letter to Bush about his new ad campaign.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
By A.R. Torres

March 5, 2004 |

Dear President Bush:

My husband, Luis Eduardo Torres, was at his second day of work at Cantor Fitzgerald when he was killed on Sept. 11. He jumped from the 105th floor of the North Tower. Most of his upper body was recovered, identifiable only through dental records. I was seven months pregnant at the time.

It is with him in mind that I'm writing to you, to question your disturbing reelection ad campaign. Yesterday I saw the three ads you're now running all over the country, specifically on cable stations in the "swing states," where you feel you need to come out fighting strong. It was the "Safer, Stronger" ad that shocked me the most. At the commercial's midpoint, the words, "Then ... a day of tragedy" dramatically appear on the somber black screen. And the centerpiece: an image of ground zero, the hulking remains of a tower, alongside a human corpse, carried out by several firefighters. Both the tower and the human are draped in American flags.

The flags were intended to honor ground zero and the remains of the dead, but here they are merely props, used to add a powerful patriotic punch to your message. The tower and the corpse are two hideously broken and disfigured things behind and under the flag, and your image -- with your red tie, white shirt, and blue suit, standing in front of thick strong white columns -- serves as another, symbolic, flag.

That image of ground zero, and the body shrouded with the flag, reminded me of the sulfur from the few pathetic remnants of my husband's last day: his Cantor ID, Debitchek Meal Card and subway Metrocard.

I thought I'd finished dealing with the gruesome aspects of his dead body, but it came back to me during your commercial. I had a thought I'd never had before: Was every corpse draped in an American flag as it emerged from ground zero, or was it just an honor bestowed upon the uniformed workers? What if that was my husband's body, now serving as a "spokesman" for your campaign?

I canceled my toddler's afternoon activities so I could do research. I could hear my voice quake as I called the medical examiner and the mayor's office. Initially, uniformed personnel were the only ones wrapped in the flag, I learned -- but it became standard practice to cover all the dead in that way.

In effect, then, Mr. Bush, you've paraded all our 9/11 dead out as the official mascots of your reelection campaign. You use them to show our nation that you can protect us against what we should all fear the most -- being an anonymous corpse in another attack.

But these sleights of image and crafty juxtapositions are the only true demonstrations of your leadership abilities. After all, on that tragic day you didn't actually lead the nation: according to the work of the "Jersey girls" -- the four 9/11 widows who fought to have an independent commission investigate the tragedy -- your first reaction to the plane hitting the North Tower was to blame the pilot. And you continued your activities -- reading stories to a group of young schoolchildren. And as you try to impress our nation with your role during and after 9/11 in these ads, you refuse to talk meaningfully to the independent commission about the specifics of your role prior to 9/11 and how much you knew about a potential large-scale al-Qaida plot.

I didn't think that co-opting 9/11 with such disregard for those of us who have been affected by this tragedy would anger me so much. I hope that John Kerry doesn't use 9/11 to strengthen his own candidacy . But so many 9/11 families are sick at your use of our sadness ... I can't imagine it being any worse than where you have already led us.
~~~~~~~~~~~

This widow doesn't sound as if she thinks the ad is a bit tasteful or well done. [img]tongue.gif[/img]
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:53 AM   #26
InjaYew
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PS~ This came from www.salon.com of which I am not a member. A friend sent it to me.
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:35 AM   #27
John D Harris
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Quote:
Originally posted by InjaYew:
PS~ This came from www.salon.com of which I am not a member. A friend sent it to me.
Interesting, I guess you were talking about the first book listed. If President Bush alowed any AlQueda members to leave then that was a serious mistake. If on the other hand he alowed family memebers who just happened to be related to UBL to leave the country nothing wrong there, unless somebody is saying that being related to a terrorist/criminal then they are to be held and concidered guilty due to a genetic link, instead of their actions. I wonder is the innoceint until proven guilty position only being applied to criminals, but the procecution is wrong for treating people that way?
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Crustiest of the OLD COOTS "Donating mirrors for years to help the Liberal/Socialist find their collective rear-ends, because both hands doesn't seem to be working.
Veitnam 61-65:KIA 1864
66:KIA 5008
67:KIA 9378
68:KIA 14594
69:KIA 9414
70:KIA 4221
71:KIA 1380
72:KIA 300

Afghanistan2001-2008 KIA 585
2009-2012 KIA 1465 and counting

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Old 03-11-2004, 12:50 PM   #28
InjaYew
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John~

I'm reading this quickly at work, but right at this moment, I have no idea what you're talking about. That letter is from a 9-11 widow. I'm not talking about any books...
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Old 03-11-2004, 01:06 PM   #29
Timber Loftis
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I read the letter, Inja.

Look, you people, politicians are expected to run on their performance in office. One strong point Bush has is that he is generally regarding as handling the aftermath of 9/11 rather well. Actions in Afghanistan were largely supported, and the hunt for terrorists worldwide has been overall a huge success. Up until Iraq, approval ratings showed we generally thought he was doing a great job.

Now, he can't use that as part of his platform? Is he only allowed to talk about his failures? The commercial did not focus on 9/11 very long at all, and the image was brief. I understand this ladies' concerns, but I thought it was a subdued presentation in the ad campaign. Even the reference was soft -- "And, then, a day of tragedy." It appeared to me that it was represented as a difficult time for the country that occurred during his presidency. In other words, he suffered through it with us, as our leader.

That would be a true representation, wouldn't it?

Anyway, people will always gripe, no matter what. Whine away, but Bush is going to be re-elected.
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Old 03-11-2004, 01:44 PM   #30
Pikachu_PM
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Timber--

I think the problem with the ad isn't som much what it's trying to say than they way its trying to say it. There nothing wrong with Bush telling Americans that he handled the crisis well...the problem is that the ad runs off almost like a trailer to a move. The music, the drama, the wanna be "Braveheart" speech segment...it's taken a very real, very tragic event, and turned it into a prop for a movie trailer designed to get Bush re-elected.

My intincts tell me that the Bush campaign was hoping to re-spark the patriotism after 9/11, and it's backfiring because it comes off no better than cheesy 'WWII type' propoganda segments. I swear, visions of those tacky 'commericals' from Starship Troopers keep coming to mind evrytime I see it.

What he did/is doing certainly isn't/wasn't illegal, but it was/is in bad taste.

Finally, to whoever it was that posted earlier that they 'lost sypathy' for the 9/11 widows because of 'squabling over the insurance payouts' SHAME ON YOU!!

The actions of a few should in no way infrindge on the tragedy of the event, or the severe emotional stress felt by the victims. More to the point--I'm fairly certain it was the lawyers doing all the hemming and hawing. How dare you attempt to chastize these people and suggest that now they deserve what they get. If my body is ever traped along on ANY politiians campaign ad, they'd better be damn sure they stay out of my way in the after-life, cause I'd voluntarily set myself ablaze to be the eternal hell-fire under their ***.

Oh, and as for Vietnam vets speaking of their war merits in campaigns...yeah, they were there, they saw the blood and carnage THEY were the ones getting shot at (and the 'images' show in the past aren't anywhere close to the patronizing patriotism displayed in this fiasco) Kerry/McCain/'insert your guy here' didn't fly to Viatnam, do some speeches over a bombed out bunker full of dead bodies, and then throw the video on the air implying their own heriocs during the battle.
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