played demo, considering buying, have these questions first, appreciate help, thanks!

[Merulus]

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So two chars of different classes (uh, I'm guessing here, say a Fighter and a Lord) might have the same exact traits in special abilites (say, chance to hit with a sword) at time T but one will get better with practice and the other won't. Right?

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Not really. Let me put it this way…

Both the Lord and the Fighter have many of the same “profession” skills. Fighting with swords, bows, shields, etc… The Lord, however, has one extra “profession” skill – Divine Magic.

The two classes have different “special” skills (this is the single skill in each class that carries a 25% bonus). For the Fighter, the “special” skill is Close Combat. For the Lord, it would be Dual-Wield. BOTH characters would have these listed as profession skills on their skill sheet, but they would only have a bonus in their own “special” skill.

Finally, each of those classes has different special abilities. The Fighter can berserk and regenerate stamina. The Lord can regenerate health. These are abilities inherent to the individual classes. You can’t put points into them at level-up, and they never change or get better.

So, if a Lord character had trained in Divine Magic, various weapon skills, and whatnot – and then decided to change to a fighter, this is what would happen:

The Lord would keep all of his profession skills (including Divine Magic). However, he would only be able to improve the profession skills of a Fighter. He can continue to improve and put points into sword, shield, etc – but his Divine Magic would be frozen.

The Lord would lose his Dual-Wield bonus. However, as a fighter, he would gain a Close Combat bonus.

Finally, the Lord would lose his health regeneration special ability. However, he would gain the ability to berserk and regenerate stamina.

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Why do almost no people on this board talk of the cat-, dog-, and dragon races? Why do so many talk of all-faerie parties etc.?

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It’s a matter of personal taste. I, for example, hate using faeries. I also don’t care for hobbits or humans. My current party is: Rawulf (dog-person) Lord, Felpurr (cat-person) Rogue, Felpurr Ninja, Human (ick) Bard, Gnome Gadgeteer, and Elf Bishop. I almost always have a couple of Felpurr in my parties. I also frequently use Dracons and Lizard-men. I even have a friend who’s playing will an all-mook party. Whatever floats your boat.

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Is playing a Ninja still fun if you can't sneak around? Is it still useful?

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The appeal of a ninja is that they play almost like an assassin-type character. What I mean is, a ninja can cause a critical hit (an “instakill”) with virtually anything. Swords, flails, staves, knives, darts, shuriken, their bare hands… Whatever they’ve got, they can kill you instantly with.

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How does backstab work if you can't sneak up behind an enemy?

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It’s calculated automatically. The better your stealth skill (and your dexterity/speed/level/etc), the more often you backstab.

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Last question: would I be correct in assessing this game as a really, really good hack-n-slash adventure with many rpg elements?

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Sort of. I would actually compare it to Fallout, for example: The appeal of the game is the tactical nature of the combat, as well as the character creation and management (though I think Wizardry has a much better combat and character system, while Fallout has the better storyline and world).

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I'm curious about the comment that the world isn't large.

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Heh. Well, Mage_77 did quite a good job defending me, so I won’t say much more… However, I think much of the game-length you talk about comes from the frequent combat, not from actual world-size.

It would be quite possible to walk from one end of the world to the other (say, from Arnika to the Rapax Castle) in about half an hour if it weren’t for all of the fights slowing you down along the way.

[onomastikon]

Thank you. Merlus, that was particularly lucid.

Regarding backstab: you seem to say it does not have to be a hit from behind? I can backstab an enemy I am fighting face to face?

Regarding Ninja and Stealth: being stealthy in Wiz 8 seems to be a form of camoflauge. If I have one or more stealthy chars, to I get a chance to reduce the entire party of being spotted? (I mean, would having 1 stealthy char mean I could surprise a group of monsters better than if I had none, 2 stealthy chars better than if I had only 1? OR does it all depend on the noisest char? Also, does having 1+ stealthy char (and the level/skill that char has in stealth) affect your chance of "wandering monsters" spawning near/finding your party?)

Regarding formation: If I have a Ninja, say, or a Ranger in the rear (someone with good Senses), does his chance of spotting critters in the front decrease?`

Searching: I still have only played the demo -- a Ranger was in the party, so I didnt find out much about search mode. What is the drawback of being in search mode?

Stealth again: Is there something like "party shh" or somethin`g? I mean the chance to make the whole group walk more slowly, maybe using more stamina, but to reduce noise or something? Do fairies and Felpurrs make less noise than humans?

Buying the game: I just saw that Amazon wont deliver the game to Germany. EB Games wants 26$ for postage alone, PLUS customs, plus the game price. Anybody got a tip of where a dope like me could get his hands on this game? (I live in Berlin, Germany.)

Thankee

[Lord Tsarin]

Thought I'd throw in my 2 cents as well since I actually know the answers to some of these... And if I don't I'm sure someone on this board will correct me [img]smile.gif[/img]

>Regarding backstab: you seem to say it does not have to be a hit >from behind? I can backstab an enemy I am fighting face to face?

Exactly. You don't need to do anything special in order to backstab with a Ninja/Rogue in this game. It's an automatic thing that occurs independantly of the graphical engine, it's all stats baybee!!

I've come up with two hypothesis on how this happens. One is that the game doesn't represent the actual combat so the statistical abstraction represents a ninja sneaking around the battlefield and getting himself in good position. However the inablity to do this while in the back rank seems to blow this theory. My other idea is sort of a deadly hug attack where the ninja runs up, hugs the monster and stabs them in the back... (waits while everyone envisions their Faerie Ninja doing this)


>Regarding Ninja and Stealth: being stealthy in Wiz 8 seems to be a >form of camoflauge. If I have one or more stealthy chars, to I get a >chance to reduce the entire party of being spotted? (I mean, would >having 1 stealthy char mean I could surprise a group of monsters >better than if I had none, 2 stealthy chars better than if I had >only 1? OR does it all depend on the noisest char? Also, does having >1+ stealthy char (and the level/skill that char has in stealth) >affect your chance of "wandering monsters" spawning near/finding >your party?)


Actually, being stealthy in Wiz 8 ONLY effects what you do in combat. It's just an AC bonus. What it does is allow you to have a lightly armored rogue/ninja who can still be in the front lines in combat and not get hit. It doesn't effect anything outside of combat. The only things that effect the "wandering monster" rate and encounter rate are spells (chamelion, watchdog, etc.) Think of it as being more of a way of explaining armor class than an actually useful skill. That being said, it's one of the primary things to put points into as your ninja levels as it helps to keep them alive.


>Regarding formation: If I have a Ninja, say, or a Ranger in the rear >(someone with good Senses), does his chance of spotting critters in >the front decrease?`

Nope, The party position only effects the combat engine. It helps to think of the game as having an engine that is in effect when you're not in combat and another when you're in combat. In this case your Ranger in the rear doesn't have any less chance to spot things as anyone else. I try to rationalize this as the ranger/ninja scouting ahead and then running back to the party with news.


>Searching: I still have only played the demo -- a Ranger was in the >party, so I didnt find out much about search mode. What is the >drawback of being in search mode?

More frequent encounters, plain and simple. When you go into search mode, you'll find many more trinkets but you'll also find a lot more monsters. That being said, most of us around here go out of our way to look for more monsters. I sometimes turn on search mode even when I'm not looking for stuff if I want to level up fast.


>Stealth again: Is there something like "party shh" or somethin`g? I >mean the chance to make the whole group walk more slowly, maybe >using more stamina, but to reduce noise or something? Do fairies and >Felpurrs make less noise than humans?

[img]smile.gif[/img] I'd love to see both of those things implemented... Nope, nothing like that. There are a few spells that make it easier to sneak around stuff, but that's not the crux of this game. This game is about god-like characters who don't need to sneak around... [img]smile.gif[/img]

Truth be told, my guys tend to stick to walls and use the run key to get away from nasty encounters. If you're near a wall the enemies can't surround you and if you run fast enough you'll get away. Of course, just as often you'll run right into another group of baddies, AND the ones following you will catch up while you're fighting... [img]smile.gif[/img]

>Buying the game: I just saw that Amazon wont deliver the game to >Germany. EB Games wants 26$ for postage alone, PLUS customs, plus >the game price. Anybody got a tip of where a dope like me could get >his hands on this game? (I live in Berlin, Germany.)

eeek, can't help here. Maybe one of our european folks can give him a hand.

>Thankee

Hope I was of help.

[Oberon]

Think of backstab as a frontstab, kind of a semi-critical. you deal double damage for hitting less protected and softer areas, but not nessasarily instant death sort of areas.

When you hit an enemy from behind, you do extra damage, regardless of what character class you are. But this is hard to do, since the enemys will always be facing your party unless you have some NPC help (or an elementa)

-Oberon

[Merulus]

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Thank you. Merlus, that was particularly lucid.

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Hmm… I must not be feeling well, then. I so rarely enjoy moments of sanity. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Well, Lord Tsarin took care of most of those quite well (Thanks m’lord ), let me just add a couple of things…

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Searching: I still have only played the demo -- a Ranger was in the party, so I didnt find out much about search mode. What is the drawback of being in search mode?

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I’m not sure if searching causes more creatures to spawn or not. I do know, however, that being in search mode means you are much less likely to detect camouflaged creatures. Also, creatures are much more likely to surprise you (if you’re “surprised” you lose all of your actions for the first round of combat – very painful if you’re up against magic-users). Detect Secrets is a mage/psionic spell which works allows you to search (much like a ranger) without actually entering search mode. Gadgeteers can also build a Searchlight, which does the same thing. Both have a very short duration, however.

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Stealth again: Is there something like "party shh" or something? I mean the chance to make the whole group walk more slowly, maybe using more stamina, but to reduce noise or something? Do fairies and Felpurrs make less noise than humans?

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There’s an alchemist/psionic spell (ninja, rangers, and monks can learn this), Chameleon, which helps to conceal your party. It’s somewhat limited in usefulness, however. I mostly use it in order to get close to magic-users before initiating combat.

[ice3]

To buy the game for a good price with "normal" shipment fee for internatioanl destination use "Dragon.ca" (http://www.dragon.ca). EB and many other are only good if you are in the US or Canada, they don't realy focus on internatioanl business.

As for stealth see my oher post.

[krayzkrok]

I haven't figured out how to quote text yet, but I justed wanted to make a comment on world size. I've never played Everquest or any online world game. In fact, I haven't really played that many RPGs in the last few years, so I'm comparing Wiz8 with some considerably older software I remember! [img]smile.gif[/img] However, I never noticed the "small" size of the world mainly for the reason you stated - combat is quite extensive. But if after playing for a couple of months there are still new areas and challenges that I'm discovering, then surely it's irrelevant whether this was achieved through physical size of the map or the challenge necessary to get there.

In other words, from a technical standpoint the game world may not be that large, but from a gameplay standpoint it's pretty enormous. That's what's important to most people I think.

krok

[Mage_77]

I meant the world explanation the same as Merulus. You can get from A - B if it want for all the fights. From my example Everquest is easier to avoid fights & it doesnt usually come in the form of 13+ enemies and the combat system is pretty different to Wiz8, but running from point A - B can take several Real-Life hours. There's spells in everquest to cut this down but even still it takes alot longer to get from A - B in EQ. There's more content in EQ over Wiz8 though but thats due to the larger world size too.

[Merulus]

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But if after playing for a couple of months there are still new areas and challenges that I'm discovering, then surely it's irrelevant whether this was achieved through physical size of the map or the challenge necessary to get there.

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Well… This is where our opinions differ. [img]smile.gif[/img] While I can understand that to you, and even possibly to most people, the actual size of the gameworld is irrelevant, that’s not true for everyone. I, for example, am one of those people who consistently scores in the 80 – 90 range on the Bartle test. Exploration is very important to me. One of the things I enjoy most in RPGs (both standard CRPGs and MUDs) is the chance to explore a new world. I actually enjoy just taking long rambling trips through the wilderness looking for superfluous dungeons and special encounters.

Wizardry, I found, was sorely lacking in that department. While I appreciate that it might not be important to everyone, if someone asks me what I did and did not like about the game I’ll answer honestly. Wizardry is a great game (as I said, I’ve almost finished it for the second time), but I felt it really lacked a deep storyline or large, engaging world. I’m fairly certain I’m not alone in that feeling.

Oh, and these boards use standard UBB code for quoting text and whatnot. Just hit the link marked “UBB Code is enabled” or “What is UBB Code?” on the reply page.