Are Girls better than Boys?

[Spelca]

Yea, sorry, I just couldn't let it go. This tortured me all night. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Originally posted by Avatar: I really didn't think this topic would have hit it off... My points are succinct, on the whole: men are more suited to many tasks more so than women. There are female indiviuals, who can do things better than 90% of the men population, but having said that there are MORE male individuals who can do it even better. This is a fact, not fiction. WHETHER, it's because of hundreds of years of oppression, or whatever you care to catergorize. I agree. But currently it's just WRONG to say that girls are academically better than boys. I mean I admit women are better at cleaning and organising stuff. Most mean just aren't! I can NEVER fold my cloths as neatly as a girl does. Probably because I run out of patience after 30 secs. It's been genetically evolved. Centuries of split tasks have tuned our genes. All very well saying: well lets retune them as they should be. But I think we are going about this the wrong way.

It's not hundreds of years of cleaning and cooking, etc., that makes women better at cleaning. It's the fact that a lot of men don't do it until they're on their own! In most families girls help their mothers clean and cook, etc., while, if there's a boy in the house, the boy usually helps with the "male" ( ) stuff like mowing the lawn and fixing things. I'm not implying this is right, it's just the way some families work (since a lot of families are different nowadays).

If I would look at myself the way you look at women, then I'd think I'm some kind of a freak of nature... I'm not very good at cleaning, or cooking, or organising. My mum always made me do just certain things (like folding clothes, putting them our for drying and then picking them up, and cutting vegetables for cooking), while my sister, who is older, did other more "dangerous" things (ironing, cooking). So when I moved out I was really bad at some things... While my boyfriend knew how to do just about anything because he had been living on his own before. So you see, it's ALL about practise... When you'll be living long enough away from home, doing all the house-chores, you will know these things too. And when you will have as much practise as your mother, for example, you will be as good at it as her! If not even better. (I know I've been getting better since my boyfriend's been showing me how. [img]tongue.gif[/img] )

And this is a FACT and NOT FICTION.

Originally posted by Avatar: Just letting women into all fields leaves them under-prepared in my opinion. You are letting in a pre-historic academic gene into a modern science world. It's like letting a modern man do pre-historic hunting when you leave us at home. We can all do it [img]smile.gif[/img] but we are not good at it YET. Just looking at the year 2002-03. Looking at the top 50 Scientific and Engineering breakthroughs, women almost doesn't feature in them. Why? It's not because they are dumb, or because we are sexiest, it's because they are uder the illusion that they've done well in their exams, surely that means success???

You know what, you're right. I mean, we shouldn't let men work as kindergarten teachers, chefs, health insperctors, clothes designers... After all, it's not in their genes and they would be really bad at it, wouldn't they??? But some men, I guess, are just abnormal, aren't they? Look at all the famous male chefs and clothes designers! They must have some weird genes there... [img]graemlins/1disgust.gif[/img]

Originally posted by Avatar: Do not get me wrong, I don't care what sex of our human kind makes science breakthroughs, as long as we do. I love girls in lab coats.. they look great! JOKE! *gets more bricks* No seriously, I don't care.

Riiiiiight....

Originally posted by Avatar: But what annoys me is the fact that it's not reflected in exams. Exams are not showing what qualities are needed to be creative, but rather what qualities are needed to do an exam. And these give a faulse illusion to all the girls out there, that they are actually making progress. Exams are 50% of the story. Wrong, even less of in a science field. I can not speak for the arts, but in science the other 50-60% os about all the little things. Reading geeky magazines, talking to geeks over the net, doing scary lil experiments in your garage, and going into those weird shops most laugh at. It's the practical voyage of invention plus text book hard work that pushes science forward. I am sorry, but I just don't see many girls do that 60%. They work extremely hard on the 40% and get full marks in exams. but when you're at work, it's not an exam. It's hads on decision making and experience. Something carried over the years. Avy

Ah, you see, I knew there would be a but!!!
Don't you think the professors know better than you what should be in exams and what not? And I thought that all studies also have a practical studying where students are tested how well they do in pratice? Don't you?

And how do you know these women aren't reading "geeky" magazines? Have you actually asked them what they do and what they don't do? Or did you just assume they spend their days cleaning and cooking? Or maybe you based your opinion on a couple of individuals... But you know what I think? I think that you're really angry because a girl got a better grade on an exam than you. Is that it? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I will make one remark though - I agree with you on one point. It is CENTURIES, no, not of labour division, but of people like you with this line of thinking that have kept women out of the academic and political world! And there are still people (men and women) who think like that, and because of them some women still think it's inappropriate for them to have a career, or to go to university... and some women who do go, are being judged like you are judging them and that also doesn't keep them there! And it's prejudice like yours that is still keeping men also from certain fields of work!

*sigh* All I hope that you'll soon realise what idiotic things you're writing, because it's exactly this line of thinking that some people are using about races...

Edit - typos.

[ 09-26-2003, 03:51 AM: Message edited by: Spelca ]

[Melusine]

Originally posted by Sir Kenyth: I beleive he's very young. The only experience he's had with women is his mother. That would explain a lot.

Um no, sadly. He *is* young, but not as young as you probably (and understandably) have pegged him. Avatar, IIRC, is about 20 and a student at Cambridge. Yes, permission for jaw to drop now... What DO they teach kids over there??? Or was it a "scientific" invention all of his own? [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

Aelia, LOL, I agree with your last post! Only I still have a little nagging suspicion that says he is actually not trying to get a rise out of us but being serious. Like I said, I refer to the "Fat guys hate me" thread for evidence.

Spelca, well said, especially the last paragraph. [img]smile.gif[/img] Though I suspect Avatar won't be convinced. [img]graemlins/idontagreeatall.gif[/img]

[ 09-26-2003, 05:47 AM: Message edited by: Melusine ]

[Melusine]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: quote: Originally posted by Avatar: Why? It's not because they are dumb, or because we are sexiest,

No, I'm the sexiest!!!
[/QUOTE]ROTFL!! I had to read that three times before I understood what he was saying.
No Avatar, Hierophant is right: he is sexiest. You are just sexist. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Melusine: Hierophant is right: he is sexiest. You are just sexist. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

Ah yes, I'm glad you have an appreciation for beauty Mel [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

[Arledrian]

Aw, come on Aelia, you know boys are better than girls... [img]graemlins/agree.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Avatar, I don't think you can get away with such sweeping generalizations on a forum with such a multiplicity of people, because you're always going to offend someone or other. I'm personally quite surprised that you believe in the old 'women should be chained to the sink' garbage. And your poor mother! Does she live to preen in front of the mirror and wash your dirty socks? Obviously I'm not female, so I can't begin to imagine the annoyances of prejudice and ridiculous misconceptions that seem to have haunted them forever, but I can see that it must be truly degrading to have someone tell you that your only skills lie within domestic circles, based on something as irrelevant as gender.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you need to understand that women are just as capable of excelling in whichever field they choose, and that they are just as likely to develop the next scientific/mathematical breakthrough as the next man. Of course women's brains develop faster initially, but they also develop differently - that's not to say the height of their intellectual stimulation and pleasure lies in scrubbing the bath tub. The two genders are more alike than you think.

It's not so much that this issue particularly bothers me, because I'm really not terribly opinionated in general, but again, to keep the peace and maintain mutual respect among everyone, I think it'd be a good idea to think about what you're writing before you hit the post button. As I mentioned earlier, this forum is so diverse, that spewing forth generalizations is inevitably going to land you in hot water. You could pull something like this off at a Male-Chauvenist Forum, but certainly not at Ironworks [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Aelia Jusa]

Originally posted by Arledrian: Aw, come on Aelia, you know boys are better than girls... [img]graemlins/agree.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

*sigh*, yes I know. To be honest, I'm just piddling about at uni trying to find a guy to earn a lot of money and look after me so I can clean for him! I know in my heart that while I'm achieving highly in my science degree, it'll all be worth nothing in the big bad examless world

How are you anyway, Alex? Haven't seen you on msn lately

[Ramon de Ramon y Ramon]

Originally posted by Melusine: quote: Originally posted by The Hierophant: quote: Originally posted by Avatar: Why? It's not because they are dumb, or because we are sexiest,

No, I'm the sexiest!!!
[/QUOTE]ROTFL!! I had to read that three times before I understood what he was saying.
No Avatar, Hierophant is right: he is sexiest. You are just sexist. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img] [/QUOTE]Hmm, three times! I am sorry, Melusinchen, but I think you just proved Avatar's point. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

And, Avatar, thanks for being such a first-class parodist, if deliberately or involuntarily doesn't really matter.

[ 09-30-2003, 05:11 AM: Message edited by: Ramon de Ramon y Ramon ]

[Melusine]

Originally posted by Ramon de Ramon y Ramon: Hmm, three times! I am sorry, Melusinchen, but I think you just proved Avatar's point. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/hehe.gif[/img]

Well, I already knew how you felt about dumb blondes, but thanks for rubbing it in. [img]tongue.gif[/img]