No more nasty, personal-attack sarcasm in posts, please - respect others

[Memnoch]

Guys, in future please refrain from using sarcasm or other forms of emotional language when discussing/debating an issue. Sarcasm can sometimes make one person look good at another's expense (even if this was not the intention). This is where seeds of resentment starts, and the other person feels they've lost face and need to "get one back".

We have been accused of a lack of impartiality since this forum opened, especially with respect to Yorick. Yorick and others (from both sides) were reprimanded for their actions on this forum, especially with the Brits thread. Would you like us to publicly lash Yorick? Is a public lynching and humiliation of another poster what people want? I am getting REALLY annoyed at this constant BS about double-standard. I have had ONE PERSON contact me and complain about how this forum has been moderated. I think I'm a pretty fair person, I think Ziroc's a pretty fair person, and all this BS about double-standard is quite insulting to us, to be honest. We have had ONE banning in this forum since its inception and I think as admins we have bent over backwards to accomodate everyone's views.

From now on, please err on the side of caution when debating an issue, to ensure that you don't hurt someone else's feelings. If you think that it emasculates the forum or makes it lose some of its *bite*, then so be it. This is a gaming forum first and foremost, not a forum for intense political activism (from either side). Surely we can be more like Ronn_Bman or Ryanamur (not in views but in attitude and way they treats others here irrespective of their views). I think that the way they carry themselves in this forum is outstanding and they are respected even if their views are disagreed with.

I will be recommending to Ziroc that we evaluate the long-term viability of this forum soon, as we have had more problems with it than with any other forum here at Ironworks. Personally I'd like to see it survive as it gives people an opportunity to debate more serious issues in a spirit of understanding and mutual respect. But whether it survives or not is up to all of you.


EDIT: Okay, I've changed the title of this post as maybe people misunderstood what I meant.

[Ryanamur]

Thanks for the roses Mem [img]smile.gif[/img]

I totally agree with you, people should be more careful when they post on the forum. I've not been around as much as I used too (started working again... I was studying at home before) so I've missed most discussions.

When it comes to the public "spanking" of Yorick, I don't see why it should come to that. Yorick is a very intelligent man and I hope that the warnings will prove sufficient for him to change is style and not get to emotiannally involved when he posts. (no punt intended Yorick, if you feel offended, just PM me).

I, too, would like to see this forum modified so we can discussed issues broader than just terrorism. To that extent, we have already seen a few of those treads popping up (about the UN, Palestine and Genetic engeniering). That's great.

As far as the moderation goes, it's been great since the unfortunate banning of Dio (BTW, I hope that Ziroc and Dio will talk again and that he can eventually return to the forum... but that's really in their respective hands and I will respect the decision of both these individuals without pushing the issue any further). You (the Mods) have been pretty accomodating and tried to resolve disputes in a civil way.

Well, it's time to strole to work. See you guys again later tonight.

Phil

[Neb]

Good points Memnoch, I sometimes wish people would just not post instead of post something that's insulting, and remember, please, even if something is just mildly or not at all insulting to you, it MIGHT be MORE insulting to others, by the way, is Ziroc in a bad mood lately? I seem to be seeing more suspensions than usual.....

[Ronn_Bman]

Putting me in the same company as Ryanamur is quite a compliment (absolutely no sarcasm in this) [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

Ryanamur, I will say that I've never seen you post anything improper! I have found your posts infuriating because you disagree with me and at times make sense doing it, but never improper..lol.

I have gotten mad and posted things that I look back on and think, maybe that was too much". We're all human, but let's try to keep ourselves, not our opinions, in check. We can do it.

Thanks Memnoch!

[Ryanamur]

quote:

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Originally posted by Ronn_Bman:
Putting me in the same company as Ryanamur is quite a compliment (absolutely no sarcasm in this) [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

Ryanamur, I will say that I've never seen you post anything improper! I have found your posts infuriating because you disagree with me and at times make sense doing it, but never improper..lol.

I have gotten mad and posted things that I look back on and think, maybe that was too much". We're all human, but let's try to keep ourselves, not our opinions, in check. We can do it.

Thanks Memnoch!

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No, it's using us as exemple that's a very nice compliment. I must admit that I'm not perfect and that I've gotten into a "few" screaming matches (Yorick can attest [img]smile.gif[/img] ).

I don't have any problem with people attacking me (I can brush it off quite easilly [img]smile.gif[/img] ). However, I cannot stand watching others attacking their on-line friends (let's face it, if you post here it's because you like the people that make IW what it is). If I witness this, I become a "mod" and try to patchs things without the real "mods" getting involved. My philosophy is that since "mods" are not on-line 24/7 this give us the opportunity to clean up our act without them having to get involved.

We're all mature and we can avoid the consequences of a "bad posts" if we all work together! [img]smile.gif[/img]

BTW: Thanks for thinking that it's a compliment to be included in the same category as I... I actually took it as a compliment to be included in the same category as you. (no sarcasm what-so-ever [img]smile.gif[/img] )

[Ronn_Bman]

quote:

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Originally posted by Naked Wild Man:
Sarcasm is not an acceptable form of debate? Jonathan Swift must be rolling in his grave.

Emotion is not part of issues like war? LOL.

Okay, I had thought to participate in this forum, but forget it. I was participating in the thread in question, and Silver Cheetah's sarcastic comment was nothing that should bother anyone except the extremely oversensitive.

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Of course it is, but not when it's personal, and some do take sarcasm personally. There have been problems with personal attacks here before, and that is the cause for concern.

Think twice about participating. I didn't think your posts were sarcastic. I didn't like them, but they weren't sarcastic.

Check your PM's!

[Fljotsdale]

Regarding sarcasm and personal attacks, I think the supreme authority for christians should be god, yes? Well, get a load of this:

from Job chapters 38, 39 (And remember Job was very ill, and down-and-out at the time)

And YHVH (god, Jehovah) proceeded to answer Job out of the windstorm and say:
"Who is this that is obscuring counsel by words without knowledge? Gird up your loins, please, like an able-bodied man, and let me question you and you inform me.
"Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you do know understanding...... (vss 1-4)
"Was it from your days onward that you commanded the morning? Did you cause the dawn to know its place?...... (vs 12)
"Have the gates of death been uncovered to you....? (vs 17)
"Have you intelligently considered the broad spaces of the earth? Tell, if you have come to know it all....... (vs 18)
Have you come to know because at that time you were being born and because in number your day are many? (vs21)
"Have you come to know the statutes of the heavens, or could you put its authority in the earth? (vs 33)
"Can you send forth lightnings so that they may go and say to you 'here we are!'? (vs 35)
"Is it owing to your understanding that the falcon soars up.....? Or is it at your order that an eagle flies upwards.....? (ch 39, vss 26, 27)

I could have quoted lots more, but I think the above makes the point. God himself is berating Job in terms of undiluted and highly effective sarcasm. At the end of it Job said "..I have become of little account.... I put my hand over my mouth..."

Anyway, if you are going to ban all sarcasm, you would be obliged to ban your god as well!

Hm. People might miss this in here. I'm gonna put it in its own thread as well.

[Argus]

Apparently sarcasm isn't only in God's providence:

"Sarcasm I now see to be, in general, the language of the Devil; for which reason I have long since as good renounced it," Thomas Carlyle

[Fljotsdale]

quote:

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Originally posted by Argus:
Apparently sarcasm isn't only in God's providence:

"Sarcasm I now see to be, in general, the language of the Devil; for which reason I have long since as good renounced it," Thomas Carlyle

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Well, if the two major actors in the universe can use sarcasm.....! [img]graemlins/evilhaha.gif[/img]

[Memnoch]

quote:

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Originally posted by Ryanamur:

I, too, would like to see this forum modified so we can discussed issues broader than just terrorism. To that extent, we have already seen a few of those treads popping up (about the UN, Palestine and Genetic engeniering). That's great.

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I'll tell you what - the track record hasn't been good so far.

I appreciate that people have some very strong opinions about serious issues and that's fine. Please realize however that Ironworks is is not really a place for political activism - prowar or otherwise. Ironworks is really a gaming forum. The War forum was opened as a courtesy to GD visitors who were unhappy about the strong opinions and language posts about the war in the GD forum, so we moved it to the War forum. Sadly, the War forum is now starting to cause general resentments and deep-seated hostility between people - this never existed before the war forum was opened.

Personally, I'd like to see the War forum keep going and maybe develop into a Serious Discussion forum eventually - but it will come down to a time-cost-benefit issue at the end of the day. WE are the guys who have to pick up the pieces, try to put them back together, keep everyone happy and do all the work purely for the love of it so that ALL of you can post in a comfortable environment. I'm not interested in moderating a forum where I constantly have to settle the peace between people who can't see eye to eye. This is NOT what I signed up at Ironworks for. I hope you all realize that.