Watchers keep, over rated and too easy ? (slight spoilers inside)

[Fonzie Forum Tyrant of MH]

Ok well after much Hype and waiting for the local game store in this backwater town to get me a copy, I finally installed ToB, got me the patch and all the baldurdash fixes improved bosses ect.

I figured Watchers keep would be the dungeon of all dungeons, I was impressed by how much more satisfying a Dungeon stomp in BG2 was compared to the original.

So with much trepidation I set foot into this dank cesspit of evil, I had started a brand new game of SoA in preperation, and I was in chapter 6 of that.

All my chars were maxed at the 2.75 million Exp cap.

My party

Me (Bezeker, Kothoses, Bad ass dude dual weilding Daystar, or Adjatha along with Crom Fayer.)

Minsc

Keldorn

Jaheria

Imoen

Aeire

Anyway I found after 2 days of playing (for only a couple of hours at a time I was finding it all to easy.

I only had one troubleing fight and that was with the Ytossi and her friends after getting the key from the helmite spirit.

The Demogorgon I killed in under 17 seconds first timne and 15 the second time, Now dont get me wrong I enjoyed Watchers keep it was fun, but even on insane difficulty I found it way too easy.

I just wondered if I was the only one to be underawed by it after all the hype that had gone round.

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Through the Night I hear your voice
Draws me in I have no choice
As I rise through the air, hero conquerer
I see time stand still as, I'm watching the world below
I can hear you calling I can hear you call

Cross the sky into the deep
Dream a dream of love so sweet
I look into the light, were heavan bound
I reach out for your touch, as I'm falling without a sound

[Dundee Slaytern]

? You defeated Improved Demogorgan under 17 secs? How? Took me 2 minutes.

[Debaser]

Welcome to the board.

You actually killed improved Demogorgon under 15-17 seconds? that's just crazy, man...i dare say impossible, but i'm not calling you liar.
i kind of liked Watcher's Keep...it was definitely a major challenge the first time i played through, not knowing what to really expect.
actually, one of the hardest fights in my opinion is the one where you are opening the seals before Demogorgon. that is a ROUGH fight.

[Dundee Slaytern]

I just realised it is kinda impossible to defeat Improved Demogorgan under 18 seconds, save one method.

Seven spike traps = Instant victory

The moment Demogorgan is summoned, he casts Time Stop... Time Stop lasts 18 seconds alone... then he summons a Demon Knight, a Balor, a 6-handed she-demon and 2 Baatus(sp?). Even if you concentrate all your efforts on Demogorgan, you will still need to Breach him first, then Greater Whirlwind like mad.

[Fonzie Forum Tyrant of MH]

NAh it was easy, I lined up my guys me With that badass sword u get from the keep and Crom fayer in off hand, doing the critical strike (Critical multiplyer of 2 gets applied after str bonus so I hit for 48 each time, with 7 attacks every two rounds that helps) Minsc (with warblade/vopral sword) doing greater whirlwinds, Keldorn with Carsomyr +5 ang GW's.

Jaheria with Spear +3 impaler, spear damage +3 +10 pierceing every attack, and GW's

Also had the fire elemental prince, and a Deva helping me.

From the BAck Imoen slapped a ruby ray of reversal and Aiere hitting that breach as soon as he appeared.

He did not hit the time stop on me, so that prolly helped.

But look at how many attacks I made in the first round, (ps all my fighter types had improved haste on them and a load of other spells from before I summoned the Demogorgon.

Factor in the fact that in the first round with that high level ability that gives u all criticals for one round on my dude with crom fayer hitting for 48hp a time, and u suddenley see just how not only is it possable for me to do, but its supriseing Demogorgon lasted that long.

Anyway if you look at the figures

My guy with his obscenely cool Thac0 due to stry bonuses and 5 slots in long sword ect hitting a base of 7 attacks every two rounds (now double that cos of the improved haste) and hitting for 48 a time in the first round, that alone is over 300 hp of damage.

Not to mention 10 attacks each from minsc Keldorn and Jaheria. averageing about 10-15 hp a time the deva and the fire dude hitting too.

So there ya go thats how I killed Demogorgon in such a short space of time.

[frudi_x]

well, if he didn't Time Stop the very moment he appeared, than you don't have the improved version installed.
I found there isn't really much of a difference between the improved and normal versions though, he just uses Time Stop in the beginning and summons a lot more pets. other than that he didn't use any new abilities or strategies, at least not to my knowledge.

try the improved Abazigal. now that was one hell of a fight, made even tougher by the fact I only had Viconia with me (and all she did was hide in a corner and tried not to get permanently killed ).

[Dundee Slaytern]

I am still debating getting the Improved Abigazil patch. I got the Improved patches for the rest though.

PS: Demogorgan's Time Stop is damn near instantanous.

[Jim]

If he didn't cast timestop then it definately is *not* the demogorgon as he was originally supposed to be until he was weakened for balance purposes (to say you can reach him at chapter 2 in SoA). The original demogorgon was not really a challenge for me, but the tougher version is damn hard. Demons are *constantly* summoned and the guy has close on 400HP which is a damn load more than he had. He also continually casts stoneskin everytime you get through to him so you need to breach breach breach. It certainly is no easy affair. I've done the improved Abazigal which still wasn't too hard (finished the lot off with no casualties on the second attempt). I had the most fun with Balthazar as they made him obscenely powerful, and just before you kill him, he regains all his HP and returns to uninjured once again, so you need to assault hard for a second time. The hardest modified battle IMO is Yaga Sura. Damn this was hard. They've given him 99% resistances to all forms of damage (slashing, crushing etc) and also something daft like 400HP so even with 4 fighters using greater wirlwind it takes *ages* to drop him!!

Oh, and watchers keep is the best dungeon in SoA + ToB. I never get bored of doing this. It's been very well planned and deserves maximum credit. Almost all enemies you can think of are encountered here (including dragons, demi-liches, hive mothers etc) and the tresures are absolutely cool

[Istaron]

To easy indeed. Especially if you were prepered for a new Durlags Tower.

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We call him Bobby Corwen

[Prime2U]

I haven't fought Demogorgon simply because I didn't feel it was accurate and because to defet him lets him back into the Abyss to cause trouble again. Even the improved Demo isn't a patch on the real one used for PnP. The actual Demogorgon has 1300 hp for starters, if you want to check out his 3E conversion at least, you can find it at www.creaturecorner.com umm I think that's the site anyway. Memnoch knows Personally I think they should have made him just like he is in D&D because people always have the option of not fighting him, so he isn't critical for balance. He could have been the ultimate challenge. Ahh well.

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"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans." - Lennon