PA's new demands

[Morgeruat]

If anyone thought that Israel’s withdrawal from Gaza would revive prospects for peace, Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas scotched that notion nearly two weeks ago. Full withdrawal to the pre-1967 lines is insufficient, he declared: Israel must also concede additional territory inside these lines. Specifically, Abbas demanded land north and east of the Gaza Strip. This land was indeed on the Arab side of the 1949 armistice lines, but Egypt, which controlled Gaza at the time, traded it to Israel in 1950 in exchange for a larger chunk of land that Israel held in eastern Gaza. This new border was subsequently acknowledged not only by UN Resolution 242, but also by the Oslo accords, which the Palestinians signed. The PA, therefore, has no conceivable claim to this land: not only did Israel “purchase” it by ceding a larger bit of land to Gaza, but the new border was recognized by both the UN and the PA itself. Thus when PA officials first raised this demand in talks with Israel several weeks ago, Israeli officials dismissed it as a negotiating ploy. But what Abbas did nearly two weeks ago is not so easily dismissed: in an interview published in a major Palestinian daily, Al-Quds, on Sept. 3, he told the Palestinian public that “the evacuation of the settlers, the settlements and the army from the Strip are steps in the right direction, but it does not mean the end of the occupation. There are lands in eastern and northern Gaza still under occupation… We need to renegotiate the details and get back to the real border.” This statement manages to undermine every major foundation of the peace process at once.

I just hope that things like this will begin to turn the sympathy of Europe away from the Palestinians, or at least their leaders, and show them that they really did mean what they said in the PA and Hamas charters about not resting until they had driven Israel into the sea.

[Morgeruat]

linkee

The Palestinian Authority's state-run television station broadcast various programs this past week conveying the message that Israel's destruction is attainable. In the days since the IDF began to withdraw completely from Gaza, PA TV broadcast several programs all emphasizing the goal of destroying the Jewish State. Palestinian Media Watch has issued a report on the broadcasts, including translations and video clips. One of the broadcasts was a rerun of a so-called "historical educational" program first aired in 2003. It reiterates the PA teaching that Israel has no right to exist because all of Israel is "Palestine." It featured claims that Israel's continued existence is, by its very nature, a threat to the entire Arab world and displayed a map of all of Israel, marked Palestine under the PLO flag. The narrator, meanwhile, said that if Palestine is not "whole," meaning if Israel continues to exist, it is like a fatal knife thrust into the heart of the Arab nation, which threatens it in its entirety. The following are quotes from the program, aired September 6, 2005 and July 1, 2003, which can be viewed by clicking here: "The countries of our [Arab] homeland also have a heart... "If the heart is whole and healthy, then all the other parts are whole and healthy. The heart of the Arab homeland is Palestine. The homeland remains whole and healthy if Palestine is whole and healthy... "A stab in the heart is a deathblow. "Throughout the generations of history there were those who directed the first stab at the heart of the Arab nation, to Palestine." In a separate broadcast in PA television, an Arab academic expressed similar anticipation of Israel's eventual destruction, describing the joy of the Gaza withdrawal as incomplete until Israel experiences total destruction. "Nothing compares to this joy, the oppressed overcomes the oppressor," said Dr. Ismaeil Al-Fara, a lecturer at Al-Quds University, "but our happiness will be complete only with the return of all of our lands - the [West] Bank, Jerusalem, Tel Aviv, Jaffa, Haifa, Tzfat, and other stolen cities."

[Timber Loftis]

I'm just waiting for them to screw it up, and then see what Israel can do with world sympathy on their side for a change.

[Melcheor]

There will always be people on both sides unwilling to make any sacrifice. These people should be ignored. It is no secret that israel is giving with one hand and taking with another. This never justifies what is being done by palistinian terrorists.

I shudder to think what Israel would do if world sympathy on their side.

[shamrock_uk]

Still, you'd think Mahmoud Abbas would know his history I agree completely with Morguerat - the PA has no rights whatsoever to land previously held by other powers. Pre-67 borders not enough?! Get outta here! Someone needs a smack on the head with the 'reality stick'...

I can't say I'm much surprised by the lack of gratitude but, as Melchior pointed out, what's given here is strengthened elsewhere - I'm waiting to see how a new fully fortified Israel changes the situation.

[ 09-20-2005, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: shamrock_uk ]

[Morgeruat]

Shamrock just for you [img]graemlins/whackya.gif[/img]

And more news that shouldn't surprise anyone.

link from the Washington Post By the evening of September 11 the last Israelis had left Gaza -- the final chapter in Israel's "unilateral disengagement" from an area which Jewish settlers had turned from a barren wasteland into a blooming oasis. A few hours later (was the date entirely accidental?), Palestinian vandals torched the synagogues which the departing settlers had left there, hoping that the Palestinians would respect the sanctity of the places of worship. It was not to be: without the Palestinian policemen lifting a finger to stop the arsonists -- according to observers, often egging them on -- the synagogues had turned into ashes. Neither the Palestinian president Mahmoud Abbas nor any other Arab leader uttered a word of censure -- or even of sympathy. The above act of barbarism does not bode well for the future of peace between Palestinians and Israelis; Israel, backed by a majority of public opinion, decided to leave Gaza and to remove the almost 9,000 Jews who lived there, for a variety of reasons -- not the least of which was Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's determination, much criticized, among other things, because of its unilateral aspect, to re-launch the Palestinian-Israeli peace process which had expired as a result of the ill-conceived "Oslo" agreement and after the Clinton-Barak-Arafat summit at Camp David five years ago. This may be the only case in history of a country voluntarily giving up part of its land, telling its people to abandon their homes and livelihood, in order to make peace with an enemy. Unfortunately, the response from the Palestinian side has been less than encouraging. In spite of this, in his recent speech at the United Nations, Mr. Sharon went out of his way to reach out to the Palestinians; he called on them to "end the bloody conflict and embark on the path which leads to peace and understanding," adding that "the right of the Jewish people to the Land of Israel does not mean disregarding the rights of others in the land," thus specifically endorsing Palestinian statehood -- and echoing President Bush's vision of a future democratic, viable Palestinian state living in peace alongside Israel (though some may be reminded of Jonathan Swift's definition of visions: "the art of seeing things invisible"). That said, judging by the general chaos in the Gaza Strip after the Israeli hand-over, one cannot be blamed for harboring serious doubts about whether the Palestinians will in fact be able to establish and run their own viable state. Nor is it certain that such a future Palestinian state will indeed be peaceful and democratic, rather than turning into one more extremist, Islamist state promoting terrorism all around it. Though the Palestinian Authority has officially accepted the "roadmap" for solving the conflict, the very first phase of which should have been fighting the terrorist organizations, handing over illegal arms and altogether dismantling the Palestinian terrorist infrastructure -- nothing of this has happened so far. On the contrary, additional arms have been smuggled into the Gaza area through the wide open border with Egypt, Mr. Abbas himself has declared his uncompromising aims to be identical with those of Yasser Arafat -- i.e. a complete Israeli withdrawal from its historic lands in Judea and Samaria -- making Jerusalem the Palestinian capital, and insisting on the so-called "right of return" of Palestinian refugees -- the latter being the Palestinian formula for destroying the Jewish state from within. Official Palestinian television has encouraged Palestinians to perceive the Israeli disengagement from Gaza as a first step toward Israel's destruction. Even more worrying than Mr. Abbas declamatory fomentations, has been his complete failure to act against Hamas (though Hamas membership is only about 1,200, while the armed security forces of the Palestinian Authority number approximately 40,000 men). Quite the opposite, he granted them political legitimacy, while his prime minister went to Damascus, the home-base of many of the Middle East's terrorist groups, to sign an agreement which allows Hamas to keep its arms. While some Hamas spokesmen, aware of the opposition of the United States to their participating in the planned Palestinian elections, have recently toned down their virulent anti-Israel statements, this shouldn't mislead anyone about the organization's real intentions. To quote Mahmoud Zahar, Gaza's Hamas leader (as reported in the Saudi daily Asharq Al-Awsat, published in London): "We do not and will not recognize a state called Israel. Israel has no right to any inch of Palestinian land. Let Israel die." When asked whether Hamas would resume its terrorist operations in Israeli towns after the withdrawal from Gaza, Mr. Zahar replied: "There are no Israeli towns. These are settlements." Not to be outdone, the Palestinians' "moderate" leader, Mr. Abbas has also said that "we will not rest until they leave from all our land" -- when Palestinian maps show "our land" as all of mandatory Palestine with Israel nowhere to be seen. Some people thus suspect that what Hamas says -- others, including some self-declared "moderates," think -- and more specifically, that legitimizing Hamas was a deliberate act on behalf of Mr. Abbas to preserve the terrorist option for the future. Similar to Yasser Arafat in his day he would then try to convince the world of his continued commitment to peace and diplomacy, blaming the violence on "uncontrollable" others and, of course, on Israel. He should be disabused of the notion that such stratagem can work -- and the sooner the better. Zalman Shoval, former Israeli ambassador to the United States, is a senior adviser to Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon.

[ 09-20-2005, 02:09 PM: Message edited by: Morgeruat ]

[Morgeruat]

"Why Palestinians Still Live in Refugee Camps" http://www.camera.org/index.asp?x_co...&x_article=960 "What is perhaps surprising is that the United Nations also opposed the program, and passed harsh resolutions demanding that Israel remove the Palestinians from their new homes and return them to the squalid camps. For example, UN General Assembly Resolution 31/15 of Nov. 23, 1976: Calls once more upon Israel: (a) To take effective steps immediately for the return of the refugees concerned to the camps from which they were removed in the Gaza Strip and to provide adequate shelters for their accommodation; (b) To desist from further removal of refuges and destruction of their shelters. Similarly, UNGA Resolution 34/52 of November 23, 1979 declared that: measures to resettle Palestinian refugees in the Gaza Strip away from their homes and property from which they were displaced constitute a violation of their inalienable right to return; 1. Calls once more upon Israel to desist from removal and resettlement of Palestinian refugees in the Gaza Strip and from destruction of their shelters; Perhaps thanks to this support from the UN, the PLO began threatening to kill any refugee who would move out of the camps. After a few such attacks, the build-your-own-home program died, and that is why there are still Palestinians refugee camps in Gaza."

[Azred]

I have been saying for years that the day-to-day posturings by both sides are irrelevant. This is going to end up with both sides heading back to war until one side is totally annihilated. Everyone should just stand back and let them have it out once and for all, and to the victor goes the entire region.

[Albromor]

I don't think giving up the land, forcing 9,000 people to abandon their homes and living, and returning to pre-1967 borders is "posturing."

[ 09-21-2005, 09:55 AM: Message edited by: Albromor ]

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by Albromor: I don't think giving up the land, forcing 9,000 people to abandon their homes and living, and returning to pre-1967 borders is "posturing."

Neither do I. It is *actually doing* something, even though you know it will fail, so that you can justify your previous position. Sharon is no dummy. If this fails, it all becomes a "See, we told you" for Israel. Palestine appears more than happy to help dig its grave, too. Typical. They're great at burning temples, but when was the last time these people built anything, created anything, or were anything more than a burden on the world? If you can't answer that, you're not alone.

Now, to be fair, Israel pulled out of Gaza, but did NOT "return to pre 67 borders." There are a few other geographic areas that would need to be addressed to say that.

[ 09-21-2005, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: Timber Loftis ]