Should I do some in-depth editing guides on my new site?

[Leagle]

Good idea, IEEP does not explain things well.

[Memnoch]

All criticism is welcome as long as it's constructive, but in defense of TL and the other guys who made IEEP possible, without IEEP everyone would be hex editing to make ANY changes - and that is a LOT harder than using IEEP. I thankful that at least someone went to the trouble of creating IEEP, which you can use to create items/spells for BG, BG2 and IWD, and is the simplest option out there.

IEEP can be daunting for people who are afraid to have a go. Don't be! Think of how hard it was to use MS Word or Excel for the first time. You will not always be initially successful at what you're trying to do; don't give up that easily. Trial and error, and looking at how existing items/spells are put together, are the only way to learn how to use it. Like in all things start simple, and then add more complexity to your items as you go.

I personally think this would be a good idea, Vaskez. Maybe you could expand on some of the points that Drizzt raised in his tutorial. The feedback I'm getting is that 90% of people who start editing quit within 1 week because they either can't work out how IEEP works (even though there's a comprehensive help section) or they want a complex item with effects that don't exist in the game, so it's impossible to use a template. I think that once people are past that initial hurdle they will pick the nuances of editing up easily.

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[This message has been edited by Memnoch (edited 06-08-2001).]

[Memnoch]

One additional thing: I think the biggest obstacle to people trying to create items/spells/effects is not knowing what the opcode/resource code for the effect they are trying to complete. Having to continually load other items to find out what the opcodes are can get frustrating (though I think ppl should persevere with this if they really want to learn. ). Maybe if you or someone came up with a full list of structures?

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[Neb]

How much damage is it possible to inflict with IEEP if you don't know what you are doing?

[Memnoch]

Originally posted by Neb: How much damage is it possible to inflict with IEEP if you don't know what you are doing?

The worst damage you could inflict is that your game will freeze when you try to use the weapon/spell you created. Just delete the item from your override, or remove the effect that is causing the problem. (If you were careful and added effects one at a time, testing after each one, this auditing process will be easy). So it's really no big deal, it's just annoying.

Vaskez, your site looks cool. I noticed you're linking to us, too!

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[Maever]

Hi all!

i have completed the game twice and on my 2nd attempt, i was quite bored with the quests as they are the same....so i was tinking how great it was to have yr own game where you write the whole plot yrself!
now that will be cool!!!

as i read about your posts, i was glad that someone came up with a way to change some parts of the game...so my question is

HOW DID YOU PEOPLE DO IT?

I know a bit of programming though but the extensions in the game is so unfamiliar...so i dun really know how to use them....
anyone who can point me in the direction to be a game writer?

[Cavern Sniffer]

Yeah, I must admit that I'd like to change some stuff, particularly the NPC scripts.

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It's bleedin dark down here, slippery too.
Man, that's a pisser.

[Vaskez]

Whoa, just noticed this had been bumped back up after like a week.
The reason I was offering to make a creatures guide is that such a thing doesn't yet exist and EVERYONE starts on items, so I thought EVERYONE knew about items and was bored of making them already...

Memnoch, what do u mean ppl have to search for opcodes? The opcodes (in this case for spell effects) have all been given comprehensive names by Todd (TL) and are listed in alphabetical order in SpellMaker and ItemMaker. How much easier could it get?? Or do u mean someone should make a glossary type thing where a person can say:" I want to make FIRE damage" and it would be under fire and would tell u to use the "fixed/random damage spell effect". Or I want to make my weapon "pulsate with a blue light" and it would be under glowing effects in the glossary, telling u to use the sparkling colours spell effect? Is that what u mean?

Maevar, how it started was with some dedicated people going through all the standarad infinity engine file formats with a hex editor, changing bits and noting down what they did. Reading the .ids and .2da files which are in text format also helps to gain knowledge. These people have a website that lists which hex offsets in the the different file types affect what.

Some other dedicated people, like TeamBG, looked at this website for info. TL wrote SpellMaker in Visual Basic which edits the individual bytes of the files for you, to save you hex-editing and all this with a user-friendly interface. TL also wrote ItemMaker and StoreMaker and Dialog.tlk editor and invented the TBG file format and the IAP file format as well, for automoatically editing string references in the files and adding the strings to the dialog.tlk file for you. He put all this stuff together in what is called IEEP.

Other programs exist written by Ken and Cat who make up the rest of TeamBG.

Hehe if u wanna write the whole plot yourself....that is A LOT of work. Many unofficial MODs are being developed now which have their own storylines, many following on from BG2 after Irenicus' death. It involves editing the areas involved, the scripts and the dialogs of all creatures in the game. Of course these MODs are also gonna include new types of kits and creatures, check out my site for info on one I am involved in.

Bottom line is, I WAS gonna make an in-depth creature editor cos most ppl who are getting into editing can make items. Don't worry this WILL start at beginner level and take you up to intermediate/advanced (ie. the boundary of what we can edit). It will also cover info on how to edit the bits that are not covered by editors at the moment.

But if ppl let me know what they want out of an item tutorial, then I can make one, I just really thought there was no need for one.
I thought no one thought this was a good idea, as I have not got any feedback in the guest book on my site, where I asked for opinions....so I haven't thought about it since I started this thread, as I said, I've only just noticed that this has been bumped....

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And still I see no changes, all I see is racist faces, misplaced hate makes disgraced the races. We under, I wonder what it takes to make this, one better place, let's erase the wastin...
Fortress Vaskéz

[Vaskez]

Originally posted by Memnoch: All criticism is welcome as long as it's constructive, but in defense of TL and the other guys who made IEEP possible, without IEEP everyone would be hex editing to make ANY changes - and that is a LOT harder than using IEEP. I thankful that at least someone went to the trouble of creating IEEP, which you can use to create items/spells for BG, BG2 and IWD, and is the simplest option out there. IEEP can be daunting for people who are afraid to have a go. Don't be! Think of how hard it was to use MS Word or Excel for the first time. You will not always be initially successful at what you're trying to do; don't give up that easily. Trial and error, and looking at how existing items/spells are put together, are the only way to learn how to use it. Like in all things start simple, and then add more complexity to your items as you go. I personally think this would be a good idea, Vaskez. Maybe you could expand on some of the points that Drizzt raised in his tutorial. The feedback I'm getting is that 90% of people who start editing quit within 1 week because they either can't work out how IEEP works (even though there's a comprehensive help section) or they want a complex item with effects that don't exist in the game, so it's impossible to use a template. I think that once people are past that initial hurdle they will pick the nuances of editing up easily.

Yep, I agree with all that....don't look a gift-horse in the mouth!!! IEEP may not have an editing for dummies guide but I found it very easy to use etc., and I had no help from tutorials, so if I can do it, so can others...

Memnoch what Drizzt's tutorial are u talking about? I only know of his kit one, although I've never read it. Are u now saying I should do a more advanced kit making tutorial?

[Bruce The Aussie]

personally i'd like to have a good guide to CRE editing. if you want a little help in anything. i'd be happy to help. also i've thought up a great way to make make more monk like kits (more like a monk and less like arcane fist)

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Bruce The Aussie, Camp Barbarian Hunter OHF
jester of LH and Master Beastmaster of the clan of the Kats