improved knockdown

[SpiritWarrior]

Originally posted by ScottG: Sure - humanoid spellcasters can be disrupted from casting with a succesfull knockdown. However in the same time it takes to achieve a knockdown you can usually kill that spellcaster simply by hiting it repeatedly (and if you have a high number of attacks you will usually disrupt their spells b4 they ever cast a single spell). (Spellcasters typically run low on hitpoints, the ones that are easy to kill quickly, and the ones that don't usually are either immune to knockdown or are practically immune to knockdown.) If your fighting melee style the key to just about all encounters is: hit hard (high damage), hit a lot (many attacks), always make contact (high hit probability).

Alot of the time casters tend to have more concentration than discipline so even if you do score multiple hits you may well not disrupt a potentially lethal spell. Now I agree at lower levels a casters conc. is usually low enough to disrupt but at higher levels it becomes more difficult. And yes, stoneskin really has no effect since knockdown requires a dis. check.

[ 09-27-2003, 09:07 PM: Message edited by: SpiritWarrior ]

[cloud88]

Originally posted by ScottG: Sure - humanoid spellcasters can be disrupted from casting with a succesfull knockdown. However in the same time it takes to achieve a knockdown you can usually kill that spellcaster simply by hiting it repeatedly (and if you have a high number of attacks you will usually disrupt their spells b4 they ever cast a single spell). (Spellcasters typically run low on hitpoints, the ones that are easy to kill quickly, and the ones that don't usually are either immune to knockdown or are practically immune to knockdown.) If your fighting melee style the key to just about all encounters is: hit hard (high damage), hit a lot (many attacks), always make contact (high hit probability).

What is it that makes "high hit probability" better...Str?

[ScottG]

Str (if your not utilizing high dex. and the feat weapon finesse) for melee + weapon modifiers and your base (or modified) attack score (which is character level and class level dependent). (I.E. say a base attack of 6 with a str. score of 18 (providing a modifier of +4) with a +2 weapon gives = +12 to hit. The higher the number the greater your chance to hit - though this is compared against the opponent's AC modifiers and then "rolled" to determine if there is a "hit".)

Spirit Warrior and Luvian make good points - particularly with regard to Luvians mention of damage soaking spells like Stoneskin. If your character can't dispell it (or doesn't have another combatitive measure like the one discussed below) then you could be SOL.

An alternative to knockdown (and improved knockdown) could also be derived from a weapon's special attack (typically Daze or preferably Stun). This essentially provides the same sort of disabling feature as Knockdown, though a potion of clarity or its spell alternative may block this special attack (but its VERY rare).