Extinct tree Lives!

[Morgeruat]

"The only difference between this date seedling and any other date seedlings I've seen come up is the length of the third leaf. This is very unusual," she said, pointing out one very long, thin leaf growing out of the pot. "It's certainly the oldest tree seed that's ever been sprouted. Wheat seeds from pharaohs' tombs have been sprouted, but none of the plants have survived for very long. Before this, the oldest seed grown was a lotus from China, which was 1,200 years old," she said. "I'm very excited. I wasn't expecting anything to happen. I'm really interested in finding out what the DNA testing is going to show. I know that date seeds can stay alive for several decades. To find out that they can stay alive for millennia is astonishing." Date palms are either male or female, but it's too early to tell the sex of Methuselah. Normally, female trees begin to bear fruit after about five years. "We have to figure out where we can put it so it can grow to maturity. Then we'll hope that it grows up and flowers so we can figure out whether it's male or female, and then it has offshoots and seeds so we can propagate it. It's very exciting to think that maybe someday we can eat 2,000-year-old dates, but there's a 50 percent chance that it's a male, in which case that won't happen," she said.

[Morgeruat]

Originally posted by mad=dog: As I understand it is not the same species as the regular date palm, but merely related to it. As a cultivated plant it does not thrive in nature (as an analogy imagine corn growing in the woods - big seeds that cannot be dispersed and a high demand for nutrients. It would be doomed outside the field) and I suspect it went extinct when war upon war in the area disrupted cultivation for a prolonged period. It seems to grow well in ecotypes similar to the Middle East - a climate I imagine is not optimal for normal date palms. EDIT: Typo

note from the article about why they stopped growing them

"I find it remarkable," said Cohen. "Two thousand years ago, during the Roman Empire, Israel was known for the quality of its dates. They were famous throughout the Roman Empire. But date growing as a commercial fruit export stopped at the end of 70 A.D., when the Second Temple was destroyed by the Romans. From then, the tradition was lost. "It's an interesting question what were the ancient dates like. We hope by genetic analysis, we can learn more about the character of the ancient date population." When the Romans invaded ancient Judea, thick forests of date palms towering up to 80 feet high and 7 miles wide covered the Jordan River valley from the Sea of Galilee in the north to the shores of the Dead Sea in the south. The tree so defined the local economy that Emperor Vespasian celebrated the conquest by minting the "Judea Capta," a special bronze coin that showed the Jewish state as a weeping woman beneath a date palm.

[Morgeruat]

Also interesting to note that most of the date palms in Israel now were imported from California.

[Morgeruat]

Originally posted by Lady Sedai: Hmmm...good point. Unless it's one of the types of plants that self-pollinates (and I have NO clue if that is so) I wonder if they will have to use some sort of "cloning" type techniques to revive the species...

I imagine they would most likely cross polinate with species that are compatible, it wouldn't preserve the species, but it would preserve many of the genetic traits of the plant (hopefully)

[mad=dog]

A hybrid with an existing date palm can be a solution, but even if such hybrids are viable they may turn out to be barren.

[Cloudbringer]

Ahh, thanks, I'd missed that part, Morg. Yes, I'm sure they'd try cross pollinating but then you would have a new hybrid, really, wouldn't you? Still it would have some of the characteristics of the parent plants and thus the Methusaleh version. Pretty wild stuff!

[ 06-15-2005, 03:19 PM: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

[krunchyfrogg]

Originally posted by Morgeruat: quote: Originally posted by Q'alooaith: Your saying your more mature than me because your older? You realy need to get you some learning.

Wow, someone call the Grammar Nazi.

As for "getting some learning" lets see, using "your" instead of "you're", "realy" instead of "really", and then the horrible grammar of saying "get you some learning" I really hope that was intentional or my faith in public education just got worse that it has ever been.

If you are going to criticize someone elses education and maturity level,
at least take the time to correct your own post. [/QUOTE]

[wellard]

Keeping an intresting topic alive ..

has anyone outside Australia heard of the Wollemi Pine? ‘Dinosaur tree’ or ‘living fossil’, the Wollemi Pine is certainly one of the greatest botanical discoveries of our time. In September 1994 David Noble, an officer with the NSW National Parks & Wildlife Service, discovered some trees he didn’t quite recognise. In a deep, narrow canyon of the rugged Wollemi National Park, he discovered what we now call Wollemia nobilis or the Wollemi Pine. The dramatic discovery of an evolutionary line thought to be long extinct is even more remarkable with these tall and striking trees growing only 150 km from Sydney, the largest city in Australia. They were found in the extremely rugged Wollemi National Park, a largely undisturbed wilderness area.


Discovering the Wollemi Pine in 1994 was like finding a family of dinosaurs alive and well. Growing only in a deep sandstone gorge of the Blue Mountains, the Wollemi Pine has intrigued and frustrated scientists. The genetic diversity of the ancient pines is exceptionally low, perhaps the lowest for any plant in the world. Nearly all of the 80 trees are clones - they have identical genetic code. How has it managed to survive through 200 million years of shifting continents and changing climates?

ABC catalyst

[ 06-17-2005, 08:13 AM: Message edited by: wellard ]

[Cloudbringer]

Wellard that is really cool! I love stories like this where something long thought lost is found alive and thriving. And it is fascinating that they haven't been changed much by outside influences after all these years!


Oh, almost forgot, the link takes me to an Australian Broadcasting 'page not found' page.

[Larry_OHF]

I remember a story similar to that one that said that the oldest tree in existance had been found but I cannot remember where they said it was, besides a mountain somewhere. It also was a pine of some sort.