A slightly intellectual exercise

Aerich · 10-09-2004, 08:58 PM

I've got two games going and no time to play, so I won't be doing this for a while, if ever, - but...

What characters would you add to a HoW/TotL party starting from scratch that contained two human fighters that would dual-class at lvl 13 to mages or specialist mages?

It's something I've been mulling over lately. A party based around two F/M, possibly dualing one or both to a specialist mage. General idea is to have one be a distance killer, and one be a melee god. Thinking 3* in bows + 5* in daggers for the former, and 5* in Axe or Great Sword + whatever for the latter.

Suggestions?

ZFR · 10-10-2004, 06:47 AM

Bard,
figther/druid (DC or multi preferably DC),
Fighter/thief (DC or multi preferably DC),
Paladin (or a dwarven fighter/cleric or a half-elf ranger/cleric or a DC of version of one of the two)

NobleNick · 10-12-2004, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aerich:
I've got two games going and no time to play, so I won't be doing this for a while, if ever, - but...

What characters would you add to a HoW/TotL party starting from scratch that contained two human fighters that would dual-class at lvl 13 to mages or specialist mages?

It's something I've been mulling over lately. A party based around two F/M, possibly dualing one or both to a specialist mage. General idea is to have one be a distance killer, and one be a melee god. Thinking 3* in bows + 5* in daggers for the former, and 5* in Axe or Great Sword + whatever for the latter.

Suggestions?

Aerich,

[hunched over, rubbing hands and baring fangs in glee.] Design a party around 2 Battle Mages? Now here's an opportunity I can't pass up! Assuming, as always, the party will complete HoW and TotLM...

Well, after an hour of thought: Here's my perfect party... Oops! Unfortunately it has 7 characters!

1.) Fighter[12]/Mage [distance, *****Axe (use double-handed), ***Bow, no shield]
2.) Fighter[13]/Illusionist [melee, *****LongSword, ***Bow, shield]
3.) Fighter[9]/Thief [****LargeSword, ***Bow]
4.) Fighter[12]/Druid [*****Scimitar, ***Sling]
5.) Fighter[10]/Cleric [*****Mace, **Sling]
6.) Cleric[13]/Fighter [*****Hammer, ***Sling]
7.) H-elf Bard

Hmmm... And I don't have infravision. Hmmm... Not as easy as I thought it would be, especially when one is a dirty, greasy, greedy power-gamer like I am. Ground rule is 2 heavy DC F/M. I have been so spoiled with 2 DC Clerics that I want both of them, too. Need a DC or MC Thief. Want a DC Druid to make things interesting. Gotta have a Bard to fill in for Mage duties in the early game and to turbocharge this whole mess of Fighters with War Chant in the mid-to-late game. Hmmm... Decisions, decisions...

Is there any possible way to MC or DC: a Druid/Cleric; Druid/Thief; or Cleric/Thief? I have doubts about the latter two, but am hoping the Druid/Cleric is a possibility.

--------------------
What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!

Aerich · 10-12-2004, 10:30 PM

Cleric/Thief is possible. Erm, *slight hesitation* I know Thief-to-Cleric is possible - I've got one in the priest-party. Works ok, but certainly isn't the key party member yet - good support character, though. I dualed to Cleric (losing my thief skills) on DE lvl 3, at clvl 11. The remainder of DE was a pain, as were the confusion/poison traps in the Severed Hand.

You can't go Druid/Cleric because it's forbidden to D/C within the same "type"; it would be like going Fighter to Ranger. (Yes, I know you can do stuff like that in IWD 2...)

I've been mulling over a couple combinations:

1) F/M
2) F/M

3) Paladin (with LS, of course), or F (dwarven) - axe specialty, freeing up a F/M to take something different (LS, GS, dagger)
4) T/Cl - multi or dual[10] (gnomes can go multi, I think)
5) F/D - dual by preference
6) Bard

OR

3) F[13]/Dr
4) F[9?]/Cl
5) F/T - multi, or dual if can get to Flvl 9 before DE lvl 5
6) Bard

Fun, isn't this?

NobleNick · 10-13-2004, 01:31 PM

Erm, *slight hesitation* I know Thief-to-Cleric is possible - I've got one in the priest-party.

Fun, isn't this?

Aerich,

Yes, quite fun. Some times I think this is more fun than actually playing the game (but then I play and realize how foolish that statement is).

O.K., given that you made a DC Thief/Cleric work, I assume an MC is O.K. That solves my crunch. I was not happy with the frailty of my MC Mage/Thief in the late game, especially since she was always pulling point-man duty; but a Thief/Cleric should be significantly sturdier with the extra HP and wearing better armor. I also wasn't pleased that my Bard soon outstripped my MC Thief/Illusionist in Mage power. Hate to see my Thief/Cleric hobble along on the Cleric side. Oh, well, we do have another full DC Cleric in the party; so have the two-Cleric party that I found so valuable in HoW/TotLM. And with the Gnome, we regained infravision. O.K., Here's my entry into the "Dual Battle-Mage Power Party" sweepstakes:

1.) Fighter[13]/Illusionist [*****LongSword, ***Bow, shield]
2.) Fighter[12]/Necromancer [*****Axe (use double-handed), ***Bow]
3.) Fighter[12]/Druid [*****Scimitar, ***Sling]
4.) Fighter[10]/Good_Cleric [*****Mace, **Sling]
5.) Gnome Thief/Neutral_Cleric [*Hammer, *Sling]
7.) H-elf Bard

Down to 4 heavies instead of 5, and backstabbing is out of the question; but we have our Thief, kept the Druid -AND- Bard, and are 2 deep in Clerics and 3 deep in Mages (including TWO full Battle-Mages and the Bard). This will work.

Neither one of the Battle-Mages can be strictly classified as front line or ranged: either one is just as deadly as a full Fighter at either position, and both will sport over 150 HP at the DC (Assuming CON=18). The Illusionist has the advantage of the extra 1/2 ApR from making F[13]; and the Illusion spells (Mirror Image, Blur, Improved Invisibility) make her excellent tank material (the Necro does not have access to these spells). The Necromancer, on the other hand, has a plethora of spells in the Necro school (that the Illusionist cannot access) that call for physical contact with the enemy, i.e., also good in the front line; but for different reasons.

I think the Illusionist spells are more important for front line. The Necro can always come up front to lay hands on a baddie and fry them back to the netherworld, then retreat if necessary. Both Mages have access to the important Conjuring and Invocation schools; and, between the two, all schools are covered. Add in the general Mage capabilities of the Bard and we are way beyond well covered in arcane skills.

BTW, I think the MC restrictions are for Specialist Mage: IIRC, only a Gnome can MC a specialist Mage, and only an Illusionist at that.

--------------------
What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!

[ 10-13-2004, 08:53 PM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

pritchke · 10-13-2004, 03:28 PM

Yes a MC Thief/Cleric is possible but is only available for one race. I think it is the Gnome that this combo is possible for.

[ 10-13-2004, 03:31 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

10-09-2004, 08:58 PM	#1
Aerich Lord Ao Join Date: May 27, 2004 Location: Canada Age: 42 Posts: 2,061	I've got two games going and no time to play, so I won't be doing this for a while, if ever, - but... What characters would you add to a HoW/TotL party starting from scratch that contained two human fighters that would dual-class at lvl 13 to mages or specialist mages? It's something I've been mulling over lately. A party based around two F/M, possibly dualing one or both to a specialist mage. General idea is to have one be a distance killer, and one be a melee god. Thinking 3* in bows + 5* in daggers for the former, and 5* in Axe or Great Sword + whatever for the latter. Suggestions? __________________ Where there is a great deal of free speech, there is always a certain amount of foolish speech. - Winston S. Churchill

10-10-2004, 06:47 AM	#2
ZFR Legion Symbol Join Date: February 14, 2002 Location: Ireland Age: 39 Posts: 7,367	Bard, figther/druid (DC or multi preferably DC), Fighter/thief (DC or multi preferably DC), Paladin (or a dwarven fighter/cleric or a half-elf ranger/cleric or a DC of version of one of the two) __________________ ZFR

10-12-2004, 10:30 PM	#4
Aerich Lord Ao Join Date: May 27, 2004 Location: Canada Age: 42 Posts: 2,061	Cleric/Thief is possible. Erm, slight hesitation I know Thief-to-Cleric is possible - I've got one in the priest-party. Works ok, but certainly isn't the key party member yet - good support character, though. I dualed to Cleric (losing my thief skills) on DE lvl 3, at clvl 11. The remainder of DE was a pain, as were the confusion/poison traps in the Severed Hand. You can't go Druid/Cleric because it's forbidden to D/C within the same "type"; it would be like going Fighter to Ranger. (Yes, I know you can do stuff like that in IWD 2...) I've been mulling over a couple combinations: 1) F/M 2) F/M 3) Paladin (with LS, of course), or F (dwarven) - axe specialty, freeing up a F/M to take something different (LS, GS, dagger) 4) T/Cl - multi or dual[10] (gnomes can go multi, I think) 5) F/D - dual by preference 6) Bard OR 3) F[13]/Dr 4) F[9?]/Cl 5) F/T - multi, or dual if can get to Flvl 9 before DE lvl 5 6) Bard Fun, isn't this? __________________ Where there is a great deal of free speech, there is always a certain amount of foolish speech. - Winston S. Churchill

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10-13-2004, 01:31 PM	#5
NobleNick Quintesson Join Date: February 5, 2002 Location: Huntsville, AL, USA Age: 63 Posts: 1,045	Erm, slight hesitation I know Thief-to-Cleric is possible - I've got one in the priest-party. Fun, isn't this? Aerich, Yes, quite fun. Some times I think this is more fun than actually playing the game (but then I play and realize how foolish that statement is). O.K., given that you made a DC Thief/Cleric work, I assume an MC is O.K. That solves my crunch. I was not happy with the frailty of my MC Mage/Thief in the late game, especially since she was always pulling point-man duty; but a Thief/Cleric should be significantly sturdier with the extra HP and wearing better armor. I also wasn't pleased that my Bard soon outstripped my MC Thief/Illusionist in Mage power. Hate to see my Thief/Cleric hobble along on the Cleric side. Oh, well, we do have another full DC Cleric in the party; so have the two-Cleric party that I found so valuable in HoW/TotLM. And with the Gnome, we regained infravision. O.K., Here's my entry into the "Dual Battle-Mage Power Party" sweepstakes: 1.) Fighter[13]/Illusionist [***LongSword, Bow, shield] 2.) Fighter[12]/Necromancer [**Axe (use double-handed), Bow] 3.) Fighter[12]/Druid [**Scimitar, Sling] 4.) Fighter[10]/Good_Cleric [**Mace, Sling] 5.) Gnome Thief/Neutral_Cleric [Hammer, Sling] 7.) H-elf Bard Down to 4 heavies instead of 5, and backstabbing is out of the question; but we have our Thief, kept the Druid -AND- Bard, and are 2 deep in Clerics and 3 deep in Mages (including TWO full Battle-Mages and the Bard). This will work. Neither one of the Battle-Mages can be strictly classified as front line or ranged: either one is just as deadly as a full Fighter at either position, and both will sport over 150 HP at the DC (Assuming CON=18). The Illusionist has the advantage of the extra 1/2 ApR from making F[13]; and the Illusion spells (Mirror Image, Blur, Improved Invisibility) make her excellent tank material (the Necro does not have access to these spells). The Necromancer, on the other hand, has a plethora of spells in the Necro school (that the Illusionist cannot access) that call for physical contact with the enemy, i.e., also good in the front line; but for different reasons. I think the Illusionist spells are more important for front line. The Necro can always come up front to lay hands on a baddie and fry them back to the netherworld, then retreat if necessary. Both Mages have access to the important Conjuring and Invocation schools; and, between the two, all schools are covered. Add in the general Mage capabilities of the Bard and we are way beyond well covered in arcane skills. BTW, I think the MC restrictions are for Specialist Mage: IIRC, only a Gnome can MC a specialist Mage, and only an Illusionist at that. -------------------- What's a party, without a song? Bards ROCK! Party On!! [ 10-13-2004, 08:53 PM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

10-13-2004, 03:28 PM	#6
pritchke Bastet - Egyptian Cat Goddess Join Date: September 5, 2001 Location: Calgary, AB Age: 49 Posts: 3,491	Yes a MC Thief/Cleric is possible but is only available for one race. I think it is the Gnome that this combo is possible for. [ 10-13-2004, 03:31 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

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