Do Germans have nazis?

[Zbyszek]

I was listening news today in the morning and i heard that German Nazis made demonstration against American bombing of Afghanistan yesterday in Berlin. It is ludicrous - nazis against bombing of muslim Asians. And next news - there was of course antimanifestation organized by co-called leftists and so-called anarchists. If you dont know what was the real reason i will tell you - they treat it as an entertainment, sport - so-called manifestants meet and can fight each other and police of course. So-called nazis were agains american imperialism, all I can say is that they are probably jealous that they are not imperialists.
Have you seen so-called anarchist, leftists, religious rightists, political rightists, so-called ecological radical all joined togeter in Seattle, Praha, Genova? Do you support them, think they are OK? What are they doing, do they build anything, do they teach, enlighten, whatever. They destroy, they make terror - they are terrorists. They have terrorized Italy government, so it banned filghts and trains to Genova, resotored borders control.
It all resembles me strongly such a picture: fans of english football club (honest families fathers, workers etc), are sitting in a pub (after lost game or season but not really), and after eight bear or sixth or tenth, some guy from other district of town come in and says "What a den". They all take mugs, bottles (to make tulips), cry aloud GOD SAVE THE QUEEN, FOR MOTHER RUSSIA, FOR OUR VATERLAND, and charge.
I think there is no big difference between so-called activists from Seattle and drunken fans. For sure they are not anarchists, they are hools. Anarchism it is mutualism, self-governing, federalism (there is also individual anarchism but it is just egoism).

And to all who would write with CAPITAL letteres greeenpeace. Have you supported action agains SHELL oil platform, are you against nuclear tests and genetical engineering? And after big action against shops with furs, or boming Afghanistan you go for vacation to warm countries. You dive, maybe go for underwater safari with camera you will get a tan. Do you know that fishery and diving destroys coral-reefs? Do you know that in a few decades genetical engineering will be probably the only chance to see many species alive? Do ypu know the problem? At the beginning of 1980-ties there were 5 billion of people, 15 years later there were 6 billion of people. Next billion will come in less than 10 years. The main ecological problem of Earth is unlimited procreation of mankind.
You cry like a football fan: human rights!, God save the Queen!, for mother Russia! You want give them right to destroy whole biosphere, whole ecosystem.

Zbyszek

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Zbyszek: I was listening news today in the morning and i heard that German Nazis made demonstration against American bombing of Afghanistan yesterday in Berlin. It is ludicrous - nazis against bombing of muslim Asians. And next news - there was of course antimanifestation organized by co-called leftists and so-called anarchists. If you dont know what was the real reason i will tell you - they treat it as an entertainment, sport - so-called manifestants meet and can fight each other and police of course. So-called nazis were agains american imperialism, all I can say is that they are probably jealous that they are not imperialists. Have you seen so-called anarchist, leftists, religious rightists, political rightists, so-called ecological radical all joined togeter in Seattle, Praha, Genova? Do you support them, think they are OK? What are they doing, do they build anything, do they teach, enlighten, whatever. They destroy, they make terror - they are terrorists. They have terrorized Italy government, so it banned filghts and trains to Genova, resotored borders control. It all resembles me strongly such a picture: fans of english football club (honest families fathers, workers etc), are sitting in a pub (after lost game or season but not really), and after eight bear or sixth or tenth, some guy from other district of town come in and says "What a den". They all take mugs, bottles (to make tulips), cry aloud GOD SAVE THE QUEEN, FOR MOTHER RUSSIA, FOR OUR VATERLAND, and charge. I think there is no big difference between so-called activists from Seattle and drunken fans. For sure they are not anarchists, they are hools. Anarchism it is mutualism, self-governing, federalism (there is also individual anarchism but it is just egoism). And to all who would write with CAPITAL letteres greeenpeace. Have you supported action agains SHELL oil platform, are you against nuclear tests and genetical engineering? And after big action against shops with furs, or boming Afghanistan you go for vacation to warm countries. You dive, maybe go for underwater safari with camera you will get a tan. Do you know that fishery and diving destroys coral-reefs? Do you know that in a few decades genetical engineering will be probably the only chance to see many species alive? Do ypu know the problem? At the beginning of 1980-ties there were 5 billion of people, 15 years later there were 6 billion of people. Next billion will come in less than 10 years. The main ecological problem of Earth is unlimited procreation of mankind. You cry like a football fan: human rights!, God save the Queen!, for mother Russia! You want give them right to destroy whole biosphere, whole ecosystem. Zbyszek

The population estimates are 9 billion by 2032....... Blimey, that date looks *so* 21st century....... Oh yeah, that's were we are....... forgot for a minute there.....

On your Greenpeace point Zby - are you saying that a lot of activists/ supporters of a less rapist mentality towards the earth aren't consistent - ie. don't practice what they preach?

If so, what I would say to you is most activists do, *up to a point*. It is impossible to live so lightly on the earth that you don't leave a mark - the only way to do that is commit suicide and ask to be buried without a coffin.

Most of us are working towards living lightly. We do what we can. Maybe we don't drive a car, but do take holidays abroad (me, - but I don't go near them reefs, dude! )

Totally with you on the nuclear testing and genetic engineering, by the way. Here in Britain we are currrently trying to stop the government from embracing a signficant increase in nuclear power stations - they seem to think as these wretched things don't add to the CO2 content of the atmosphere, they they're a great way to allow us to get our emissions down as per Kyoto. Duh!! Fecking eejits - our government don't know diddly squat when it comes to environment, - not to mention a whole load of other things.... More nuclear stations! Yeah, right. (Let's give the terrorists something really juicy to fly into - hey, why not!!)

PS. Unlimited procreation is a massive problem, I agree. Solutions seem very far away, however.........

Cheetah sends love and hugs to the Zbyszek kitten.

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Most Ecstatic Mistress of the Illuminati

Feisty Kitten Mascot and Succourer of the Waifs and Strays Hugging and Smooching Club

Don't Dream It, Be It (Easy, - Just Keep Choosing the Same Thing...)

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Zbyszek: And next news - there was of course antimanifestation organized by co-called leftists and so-called anarchists. If you dont know what was the real reason i will tell you - they treat it as an entertainment, sport - so-called manifestants meet and can fight each other and police of course. So-called nazis were agains american imperialism, all I can say is that they are probably jealous that they are not imperialists. Have you seen so-called anarchist, leftists, religious rightists, political rightists, so-called ecological radical all joined togeter in Seattle, Praha, Genova? Do you support them, think they are OK? What are they doing, do they build anything, do they teach, enlighten, whatever. They destroy, they make terror - they are terrorists. They have terrorized Italy government, so it banned filghts and trains to Genova, resotored borders control. Zbyszek

Zby - I don't agree with you at all on this one! It could be an idea to go along to an anti-globalisation protest/march, before you start making sweeping generalisations about what goes on - how about it, dude? (I went on one a few weeks ago. *No violence at all*. About 90% or more of peole who take part are genuinely peaceful people concerned about the planet we live on who want to wake up government and big business to what is happening on this planet.

There are a small minority of hate filled idiots who use these occasions as excuse to stir up trouble and get their violence fuelled kicks. I despise these people totally, as they have given what are genuine protests about genuine problems that need to be addressed a very bad image indeed, with the result that many people dismiss the anti-globalisation cause (just to take an example), focusing instead on the few extremists who take part in the demos.

As usual, the (mostly rightwing) press are doing their utmost to distort actual happenings, ably assisted by such total arseholes as Berlusconi, (who owns a good chunk of the italian media, as well as being president of the country - and it's richest man, incidently... ho ho ho.... )

I must say, I'm getting very fed up of this coupling of activists with terrorists, which is *so* negative for activists. The recent happenings in America are already providing excuses for govt's all over the world to crack down on what is meant to be peaceful protest (until it is hijacked by extremists.) I knew such cracking down was going to happen, - the bombing was a heavensent opporutnity for western governments on this particular front, as they have been getting increasingly panicky about anti-globalisation protests.

I don't agree with violent protest at all. However, a point you might like to consider - would government anywhere have given a flying ■■■■ if a small minority of people hadn't started getting heavy?

Be interested to have your views.

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Most Ecstatic Mistress of the Illuminati

Feisty Kitten Mascot and Succourer of the Waifs and Strays Hugging and Smooching Club

Don't Dream It, Be It (Easy, - Just Keep Choosing the Same Thing...)

[This message has been edited by Silver Cheetah (edited 10-28-2001).]

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Silver Cheetah: Zby - I don't agree with you at all on this one! It could be an idea to go along to an anti-globalisation protest/march, before you start making sweeping generalisations about what goes on - how about it, dude? (I went on one a few weeks ago. *No violence at all*. About 90% or more of peole who take part are genuinely peaceful people concerned about the planet we live on who want to wake up government and big business to what is happening on this planet. There are a small minority of hate filled idiots who use these occasions as excuse to stir up trouble and get their violence fuelled kicks. I despise these people totally, as they have given what are genuine protests about genuine problems that need to be addressed a very bad image indeed, with the result that many people dismiss the anti-globalisation cause (just to take an example), focusing instead on the few extremists who take part in the demos. As usual, the (mostly rightwing) press are doing their utmost to distort actual happenings, ably assisted by such total arseholes as Berlusconi, (who owns a good chunk of the italian media, as well as being president of the country - and it's richest man, incidently... ho ho ho.... ) I must say, I'm getting very fed up of this coupling of activists with terrorists, which is *so* negative for activists. The recent happenings in America are already providing excuses for govt's all over the world to crack down on what is meant to be peaceful protest (until it is hijacked by extremists.) I knew such cracking down was going to happen, - the bombing was a heavensent opporutnity for western governments on this particular front, as they have been getting increasingly panicky about anti-globalisation protests. I don't agree with violent protest at all. However, a point you might like to consider - would government anywhere have given a flying ■■■■ if a small minority of people hadn't started getting heavy? Be interested to have your views.

bumping.....

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Most Ecstatic Mistress of the Illuminati

Feisty Kitten Mascot and Succourer of the Waifs and Strays Hugging and Smooching Club

Don't Dream It, Be It (Easy, - Just Keep Choosing the Same Thing...)

[Sazerac]

This belongs on the war forum, guys, not general discussions.

Moving...



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Patience, my BUTT...I'm going to KILL something!!!

[Barry the Sprout]

I agree with you totally cheetah person. It is so annoying to have a completely peaceful protest highjacked. It plays straight into the world medias hands as we can be simply described as mad extremists.
Also there is a picket of Nike in Oxford Circus this Wed if you are interested. It will hopefully be peaceful and effective.

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Life is like a piece of cheese. Mice only enjoy it in cartoons and it is better with toast

[Silver Cheetah]

Originally posted by Barry the Sprout: I agree with you totally cheetah person. It is so annoying to have a completely peaceful protest highjacked. It plays straight into the world medias hands as we can be simply described as mad extremists. Also there is a picket of Nike in Oxford Circus this Wed if you are interested. It will hopefully be peaceful and effective.

Nike picket? Would love to, but can't get up to London Wednesday, unfortunately... Are you going?

BTW, does Robert Rankin ring any of your bells?



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Most Ecstatic Mistress of the Illuminati

Feisty Kitten Mascot and Succourer of the Waifs and Strays Hugging and Smooching Club

Don't Dream It, Be It (Easy, - Just Keep Choosing the Same Thing...)

[Fljotsdale]

Some very good points, Zbyszek! I don't agree with everything you posted, but I agree with a lot.

The population issue is hugely important. There are so many of us now that we are heading for disaster if we don't curtail its growth - but how we do that is beyond me.
Among wildlife, if a population grows too big for its habitat, the habitat becomes so damaged that the overpopulating species suffers starvation, disease, sterility on a massive scale until the numbers drop to a level the habitat can cope with.
If we are not careful, the same will happen to us..... and we already have the symptoms.

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Here be Dragons!
Proud to be Dubbed Queen of the Illuminati by Diogenes.

"If I say something to you and it can be taken two ways, and one of those ways upsets you...I meant the other one."

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by Sazerac: This belongs on the war forum, guys, not general discussions. Moving...

Hmm.. I cant agree with you Sazerac. I havent written anything about war. I dont want discuss about war because probably nobody will agree with me anyway . I have written about so-called leftists and rightists - they are just hools. I have written about "activists" who invaded Seatlle, Praha, Genova.
(it is SC , she is guilty , she was writing about terrorists and nuclear plants ).

I was writing about population problems. About ecology.
My short point of view: Nuclear Power is our future. We can not change it. In 30-50 years ALL available energy resources except of wind/water/solar will be used.
And terrorists: this is cost of freedom, they want to be free. It is their ethnic, religious right. Josef Stalin moved more then half of Chechenya to northern Siberia. He had no longer any problems with Chechens.

Since I have been already moved here I will say: I believe in war.

[Zbyszek]

SC:
If so, what I would say to you is most activists do, *up to a point*. It is impossible to live so lightly on the earth that you don't leave a mark - the only way to do that is commit suicide and ask to be buried without a coffin.

Most of us are working towards living lightly. We do what we can. Maybe we don't drive a car, but do take holidays abroad (me, - but I don't go near them reefs, dude! )
-----------------------------

I am not saying that you dont believe. You try to change, you are peacefull but what do you change: you dont eat meat, you do not have car and what is the reaction of world about it? You protect against killing whales. Do Norwegians or Japanese care?

I am saying - this is insignificant. The problem is so-called freedom, freedom to procreate, cut tree, to consume, freedom to migrate. People do not want to learn, to listen, to feel responsible. They have to be forced.


Btw. Lets close all nuclear plants, do you think that many trees would survive?

Love Zbyszek


[This message has been edited by Zbyszek (edited 10-29-2001).]