The Impending Fall-out

[Animal]

It looks like the day draws closer, so I pose a question to everyone.

It's obvious that a deadline will be set tonight, and it's fairly obvious that Saddam will not comply. Recently, Saddam claimed that if the US attacks, then it will start WW3, as Iraq will fight the US wherever their is land, air or sea.

Now, I hope this turns out similiar to Kuwait. Iraqi troops have already attempted surrender, heck, they were surrendering to reporters during the Gulf War. I feel Saddam holds his army together with fear, so let's hope that his people realize just what they are fighting for before too many people are killed.

Anyway, my question being this. Based upon Saddam's statements, the fact that Bin Laden is still MIA, and the current state of North Korea, do you feel that terrorist actions will intensify against the US and UK after the Iraq conflict?

Do you think that Bush will finish the job his old man started and eliminate Saddam? It must have crossed Bush's mind that he's not going to be able to simply let Saddam walk away from this. Not that I know Saddam personally, but history has shown that he is quite vengeful, so if he is exiled, it's only a matter of time before he starts trouble somewhere else.

It's almost a Pandora's Box. Once we open it, what's going to happen. Do you feel that Saddam should be allowed to live in exile, or do you think the US/UK will remove the threat permanently?

[NiceWorg]

I suppose Saddam knows his fate already. He has no future anywhere else than in his own country. It´s possible that they take him to the famous court in belgium, but you never know if Saddam ends his own days before that.

I´m waiting to hear how eastern nations react on this. My guess is that terrorism won´t increase, although that depends what is done to the political system of Iraq. The war is not over even when it´s over.

[the new JR Jansen]

Just a clarification. That famous court isn't in Belgium, it's in the Netherlands.

[NiceWorg]

A-ha, point taken.

[Bardan the Slayer]

Originally posted by NiceWorg: I suppose Saddam knows his fate already. He has no future anywhere else than in his own country.

Not strictly true. Saddam is a very very rich man, and he would be quite welcome in some countries. Syria springs to mind as someone who would be willing to give him a place to live in return for a few hundred million dollars of his stolen money.

There are always people willing to take in maniacs. Hell, even in this country there were politicians (past and present) willing to give General Augustino Pinochet refuge, despite the fact he was a mass-murdering torturer.

Never underestimate the innate callousness and greed of mankind.

[ 03-17-2003, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: Bardan the Slayer ]

[Azred]

I support bringing down Hussein because he is too unstable a force in the Middle East; his continued presence will cause far too much trouble for any future peace process. Saddam has to realize by now that he will not walk away from this one--someone, whether our forces or his own, will gun him down, or perhaps he'll even do it himself. No nation will harbor him, because Bush will turn his military gaze upon any country doing so.
Meanwhile, Bush has "tough-talked" himself into a corner, leaving only one way out--to get rid of Saddam by any means necessary. How unfortunate it is, to be caught in a whirlwind of events beyond your control and the pressure of having to live up to being "Presidential".

And so war will begin and people will die. Life is not always pretty nor is it fair. Oh, well.

Of course terroristic attacks, or at least the threat of them, will increase against the US, Israel, and their allies. The terrorists will be out for revenge; this will continue for many years.

On a positive note, life will continue as normal, despite all the people on the radio and TV being overly dramatic. Trust me on this one. [img]graemlins/petard.gif[/img]

[Sir Heinrich Godfrie IV]

Posted By: NiceWorg I suppose Saddam knows his fate already.

We can only hope, but from what I heard today coupled by past experience, I have my doubts. On I believe, Fox News earlier this evening (after Bush's speech), I listened to a former U.S. state department official (can't remember his name) who served under James Baker the then Secretary of State for "Bush 41" during the Gulf War.

The discussion during this show turned to the topic of, "how sane is Saddam". Well this state dept official recalled the last minute meeting, (which he was present for) between James Baker and Iraq's Foreign Minister Tariq Aziz. This meeting was a last ditch effort to convince Saddam Hussein (through Aziz) that the U.S. was serious about a war to liberate Kuwait. The then Secretary Baker handed a letter to Tariq Aziz, who has always been known as the smoothest, calmest, and most collected senior member of Saddam's regime. This letter was apparently a personal ultimatum that the U.S. wanted Tariq to hand to Saddam himself in order to prevent the Gulf War. When Tariq read this letter outloud his voice started trembling, his hands started shaking, and he began to sweat. After the meeting concluded, the letter layed there on the table.

This state dept official said that it has never been in Tariq Aziz's nature to be scared, nervous, and unsure. So he ventured to say that the reason why Tariq was so frightned to deliver this letter was because he was affraid that Saddam would LITERALLY kill the messenger.

So this sort of gets back to what you (NiceWorg) said about Saddam already knowing that his fate is sealed. Saddam thinks that he is bullet proof, and that he will someday rule an Arab Empire stretching from North Africa to Pakistan. The guy is a full-fledged lunatic. He has historically been known to make some horrendous blunders starting with the Iraq-Iran War in the early 1980's, which resulted in over a million Iraqi deaths. Then of course with the Gulf War where his military was demolished by the U.S. led coalition because of his stubborn stupidity. On top of that, his favorite movie is the "Godfather" and an idol of his has always been Joseph Stalin.
So sadly enough, I'm affraid that the guy is simply not sane enough to see the obvious, that his blood will soon become wall paint, or atleast let's hope.

[ 03-18-2003, 12:44 AM: Message edited by: Sir Heinrich Godfrie IV ]

[Bardan the Slayer]

Originally posted by Sir Heinrich Godfrie IV: The guy is a full-fledged lunatic. He has historically been known to make some horrendous blunders starting with the Iraq-Iran War in the early 1980's, which resulted in over a million Iraqi deaths. Then of course with the Gulf War where his military was demolished by the U.S. led coalition because of his stubborn stupidity. On top of that, his favorite movie is the "Godfather" and an idol of his has always been Joseph Stalin.

If further proof were needed that this is all true, one of his mistresses revealed that before the Gulf War, he was heard to say about America,

"Who is America? I am Saddam Hussein!"

The guy was totally convinced beyond all doubt his troops would drive the Americans away. What a loony.

Apparently, when he found out that his 'elite troops' were scouring the desert for Americans ... to surrender to ... he was unapproachable for days.

[Donut]

It isn't true that no country will take him in. Colin Powell said at the weekend that the US had been in contact with several states to encourage them to accept him. Once the war starts that may well change.

I understand that the US and the UK have been phoning Iraqi officers on their mobile phones and sending emails to encourage them to surrender quickly once the war starts. The signs are encouraging and they feel they know which will fight and which will not.

[Ronn_Bman]

Donut, if I'm not mistaken Turkey had offered Saddam safety in an effort to prevent war a few weeks ago.