Matrix Revolutions

[Arnabas]

Ok, I took forever to see this movie and I am thinking it was not worth the wait. I have a few questions, because frankly, I didn't get it. Spoilers for anyone else who hasn't seen it...
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1. Smith beats Neo at the end, then the machines seem to pump Neo full of energy, causing the Neo-turned-Smith to explode, followed by the other Smiths. Why? What did they do?
2. Why did the machines keep their end of the bargain? Neo failed to defeat Smith, so they didn't have to fulfill their end of things.
3. Related to #2, why is there peace? The machines are still feeding off of humans, so do they stop and make nice? Or do the Zionites simply not care about any of the millions of other people still enslaved? I would think that they would want to free them. As soon as they try, the war would be back on.
4. The little Indian girl. As I understood it, she was in the train station waiting for the chance to cross over into the real world (as in outside the machine... How?) but she goes to the Oracle instead. Why would she need to take the train to the Oracle? They are both in the Matrix together. Why not walk to her apartment?
5. Little Indian Girl part 2... She makes the sunset? Pretty powerful. I thought she was a program "without purpose".
I think the main thing that irritates me is that I find it inconceivable that there would be peace at the end of the movie. Neo didn't do a bloody thing, except die. I guess in that regard, the machines know that they can reload things and start over. They'll probably wait a week and then crush Zion anyway.
Can anyone make sense of this?

[ 06-02-2004, 10:27 PM: Message edited by: Arnabas ]

[Sir Goulum]

1. I'm not sure exactly, but I think when they did whatever they did to Neo, since he was Smithized, it killed the rest of them.

2. He defeated them, by letting him win. The machines had to kill Neo then, because he would have destroyed the machine world. Therefore, Neo won, since the machines died.

3. I think this was answered in the end, when the Architect was talking with the Oracle. She asked him "Are the all free?". He replied "Yes.". I assume they were talking about this.

4. The train took her out of the Matrix.

5. Umm...she was bored? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Your last comment was answered, at least I think, when the Architect said to the Oracle "What, you think I'm a human?" after she said "I have your word" (After the conversation in #3.). I think that sorta means that he's a machine, and he doesn't lie, etc.

[The Hierophant]

Ok, here are my interpretations of your questions. And it has been a while since I've seen these movies, so my memory/ideas may be a litle skewed....

Originally posted by Arnabas: 1. Smith beats Neo at the end, then the machines seem to pump Neo full of energy, causing the Neo-turned-Smith to explode, followed by the other Smiths. Why? What did they do?

Smith and Neo exist to oppose each other. They are positive and negative. Destructive and Creative. Polar opposites. When Smith defeats Neo and absorbs him into his own programming, he cancels out the very thing that gave him his individual identity as the 'anti-neo'. He destroys the sole purpose of his own existance, and thus self-destructs.

2. Why did the machines keep their end of the bargain? Neo failed to defeat Smith, so they didn't have to fulfill their end of things.

Neo does defeat Smith, andhe is the only one who actually had the power to do so, for reasons I stated in answer to your previous question. He came to the realisation of the sacrifice he must make near the start of 'Revolutions'. Neo did not fail, sacrificing himself was the only way that Smith could ever be defeated, as no one else shared the relationship with Smith that he did.
The machines are bound to their agreement. They are sentient, and are capable of experiencing 'feelings' and making conscious choices, as is described by the 'family' on the train.

3. Related to #2, why is there peace? The machines are still feeding off of humans, so do they stop and make nice? Or do the Zionites simply not care about any of the millions of other people still enslaved? I would think that they would want to free them. As soon as they try, the war would be back on.

The humans feed off machines too, as is described in the 'engine room' scene of Matrix: Reloaded. But in both cases, as a result of the new 'peace', humans and machines only feed off the 'unconscious' ones, the ones that cannot/do not wish to think for themselves. Thus, the architect states that all who 'want out' shall be released from the matrix. Likewise, Humans do not exploit the 'conscious', 'thinking' machines, and only use mindless drones to meet their survival needs.

4. The little Indian girl. As I understood it, she was in the train station waiting for the chance to cross over into the real world (as in outside the machine... How?) but she goes to the Oracle instead. Why would she need to take the train to the Oracle? They are both in the Matrix together. Why not walk to her apartment?

Not sure what you're getting at here. She seeks the safety with the Oracle, to save herself from being deleted due to the 'impracticality' of her 'function' (expression of love and joy: making brilliant sunsets [img]smile.gif[/img] ). The Oracle is an artistic, chaotic, creative force in the machine world. She exists to foster chaos. To 'unbalance the equation' so to speak. Which is why she is so feared and respected by the Architect (the machine epitome of law, order and organised structure). She has the power to hide and defend 'impractical' programs from deletion. Like i said, it has been a while since I saw this movie, I'll have to watch it again to pick up the little details... [img]smile.gif[/img]

5. Little Indian Girl part 2... She makes the sunset? Pretty powerful. I thought she was a program "without purpose". I think the main thing that irritates me is that I find it inconceivable that there would be peace at the end of the movie. Neo didn't do a bloody thing, except die. I guess in that regard, the machines know that they can reload things and start over. They'll probably wait a week and then crush Zion anyway. Can anyone make sense of this?

Again, regarding little girl, see my previous answer. There is no practical use for her beautiful sunsets, thus she is scheduled for deletion due to her 'inefficiency'. But her parent programs 'love' her, and wish her continued existance (to 'hold on to their connection'), despite her not serving a practical use in the machine world.

I think the point is that the war is a result of miscommunication between humans and machines. Each have believed the other to be so totally alien for so long, that the only way the conflict has ever been played out in the past is through violent decimation (ie: machines detroying Zion). But this is always only a temporary solution, as violence always is, and the conflict always arises anew, with a new Zion, and a new genocidal conflict.
I guess the point here is that in finally coming to understand each other's needs and motivations, and by communicating emphatically and making sacrifices, humans and machines are able to live with each other and are not doomed to perpetual war. I dunno, that's my take on it. I think it's a great story all the same [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 06-02-2004, 11:28 PM: Message edited by: The Hierophant ]

[Azred]

Originally posted by Arnabas: 2. Why did the machines keep their end of the bargain? Neo failed to defeat Smith, so they didn't have to fulfill their end of things.

<font color = lightgreen>Machines are very literal--it is not in their nature to lie. This, of course, poses a question: is the ability to lie necessary to achieve an artificial human-like intelligence? I mean, we know dogs are intelligent but they never lie, so in order for a computer to approximate intelligence as if it were human wouldn't it have to have to ability to lie? In order to lie, the computer would have to be able to creatively construct information that is not true, a sure sign of intelligence if ever such a sign existed.</font>

Originally posted by Arnabas: 3. Related to #2, why is there peace? The machines are still feeding off of humans, so do they stop and make nice? Or do the Zionites simply not care about any of the millions of other people still enslaved? I would think that they would want to free them. As soon as they try, the war would be back on.

<font color = lightgreen>An excellent question. In fact, why should the machines make a deal in the first place? The Architect's claims of "the death of the entire human race" are unfounded--since the machines grow humans, they simply kill every human already connected to the Matrix and start from the crops they already have that are not yet connected. Thus, they remove the problematic humans and start from scratch. Simple.

One puzzling question I've never heard anyone ask before is this: why do the machines make more machines? [img]graemlins/saywhat.gif[/img] </font>

[Stormymystic]

same reason people make more people it is their way to reproduce

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Stormymystic: same reason people make more people it is their way to reproduce

Yeah, never struck me as odd either. They create more machines and programs to suit practical means, then dismantle/delete them and redistribute parts when and where necessary.

[Morgeruat]

yup, the same principle behind feeding people liquified humans, take the useless byproduct of an obselete piece of equipment and make it useful.