Putin: Hamas are not terrorists

johnny · 02-09-2006, 06:05 PM

Source

I think he's completely lost his marbles now. I wonder what they're after this time.

shamrock_uk · 02-09-2006, 06:44 PM

Well, I haven't got a huge amount of time for Putin. But in this case, you have to read the diplomatic language:

Quote:

Speaking through a Spanish interpreter, Putin said: "We haven't considered Hamas a terrorist organization. Today we must recognize that Hamas has reached power in Palestine as a result of legitimate elections and we must respect the choice of the Palestinian people."

He's not saying they aren't terrorist, just that the Russian state won't treat them like they are.

Personally I think he's taking a pragmatic approach - it's good to open up some kind of a dialogue. If the West is refusing to do so, it's better that dialogue starts somewhere rather than not at all. Through a third party seems better than nothing IMO.

Plus they are the democratically elected government of the palestinian territories - it seems a bit wrong to not (at least) recognise their government and open up some kind of diplomatic channel, even if you don't give them any aid.

[ 02-09-2006, 06:45 PM: Message edited by: shamrock_uk ]

Sir Degrader · 02-09-2006, 07:45 PM

Granted, I'm afraid of Russian intervention in the Middle East.

shamrock_uk · 02-09-2006, 08:03 PM

Yeah, they're probably still annoyed that they never really managed to get the hang of effective Middle-East intervention in the past. Perhaps they see an opportunity to establish themselves again.

[ 02-09-2006, 08:18 PM: Message edited by: shamrock_uk ]

robertthebard · 02-10-2006, 12:53 AM

I was thinking along the lines of them having elections, and establishing a democracy being what we wanted over there. We've had relations with what we considered hostile governments before, but to totally ignore them seems wrong to me, somehow. They are a governed people now, and if they launch terrorist attacks against Israel now, it's an open declaration of war, and unties a lot of people's hands. Time to sit back and see what happens.

Morgeruat · 02-10-2006, 09:08 AM

The attacks have occured pretty much on a continual basis ever since the last cease fire, they don't get much press for the same reason that Saddam Hussein's AA guns firing at US planes in the No-Fly zones didn't get press, it's not interesting to most people despite the fact that it happened at least 4 times a week when I was in Kuwait in '99-2000. So the "declaration of war" was never withdrawn, Israel has just been kind enough not to declare it an open act of war by a hostile government and defend their nation by wiping out their attackers, settling instead for occasional attacks against the more egregious assaults. (really, when was the last time you heard about a non-suicide bombing attack on Israel that wasn't also about Israel's retaliation against it)

[ 02-10-2006, 09:15 AM: Message edited by: Morgeruat ]

Black Baron · 02-16-2006, 09:22 AM

Putin is *** ** * *****. May he **** ** ****.

Hamas is a terorrist organization, and nothing, i repeat nothing, short of military measures, will make it to abandon its way of thinking.

Hitler was also elected democratically. SO??? Democracy is more than free elections ladies and gentelmen. PA had its first free elections since the death of its dictator Arafat.

Citizens and denizens of Europe, lets say that Al-quaeda was elected democratically. Would you talk with Ben Laden? The difference between Al quaeda and Hamas is the proportions of their sucess in the field of terror.

Shamrock-The munich agreement was a result of diplomacy with hitler. Chamberlain will forever be remembered as an idiot.

Hamas must be broken now, before it is too late.
We must cut electricity and water, and suround the borders of hamas controlled regions with troops that will shoot down everyone or anything that comes there, or from there.

Most of the palestinians want our death.

It is a declaration of war.

Very well. As a soldier i look forward to this assignment.

shamrock_uk · 02-16-2006, 02:42 PM

I agree with most of what you write BB. It's only when we get to your proposed solution that I balk.

Maybe I just don't have the balls to approve of/order that kind of an assault on civilians.

I favour the wall solution myself.

Oh yeah, good point about Munich. Poor Chamberlain, he sounds so gutted in his war address. Perhaps a bumbling, loveable sort of idiot? [img]smile.gif[/img]

02-09-2006, 06:05 PM	#1
johnny 40th Level Warrior Join Date: April 15, 2002 Location: Utrecht The Netherlands Age: 58 Posts: 16,981	Source I think he's completely lost his marbles now. I wonder what they're after this time. __________________

02-10-2006, 12:53 AM	#5
robertthebard Xanathar Thieves Guild Join Date: March 17, 2001 Location: Wichita, KS USA Age: 60 Posts: 4,537	I was thinking along the lines of them having elections, and establishing a democracy being what we wanted over there. We've had relations with what we considered hostile governments before, but to totally ignore them seems wrong to me, somehow. They are a governed people now, and if they launch terrorist attacks against Israel now, it's an open declaration of war, and unties a lot of people's hands. Time to sit back and see what happens. __________________ To those we have lost; May your spirits fly free. Good Music: Here. Interesting read, one of my blogs.

02-10-2006, 09:08 AM	#6
Morgeruat Jack Burton Join Date: October 16, 2001 Location: PA Age: 43 Posts: 5,421	The attacks have occured pretty much on a continual basis ever since the last cease fire, they don't get much press for the same reason that Saddam Hussein's AA guns firing at US planes in the No-Fly zones didn't get press, it's not interesting to most people despite the fact that it happened at least 4 times a week when I was in Kuwait in '99-2000. So the "declaration of war" was never withdrawn, Israel has just been kind enough not to declare it an open act of war by a hostile government and defend their nation by wiping out their attackers, settling instead for occasional attacks against the more egregious assaults. (really, when was the last time you heard about a non-suicide bombing attack on Israel that wasn't also about Israel's retaliation against it) [ 02-10-2006, 09:15 AM: Message edited by: Morgeruat ] __________________ "Any attempt to cheat, especially with my wife, who is a dirty, dirty, tramp, and I am just gonna snap." Knibb High Principal - Billy Madison

02-16-2006, 09:22 AM	#7
Black Baron Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: September 7, 2003 Location: Israel Age: 39 Posts: 877	Putin is * * ***. May he ****. Hamas is a terorrist organization, and nothing, i repeat nothing, short of military measures, will make it to abandon its way of thinking. Hitler was also elected democratically. SO??? Democracy is more than free elections ladies and gentelmen. PA had its first free elections since the death of its dictator Arafat. Citizens and denizens of Europe, lets say that Al-quaeda was elected democratically. Would you talk with Ben Laden? The difference between Al quaeda and Hamas is the proportions of their sucess in the field of terror. Shamrock-The munich agreement was a result of diplomacy with hitler. Chamberlain will forever be remembered as an idiot. Hamas must be broken now, before it is too late. We must cut electricity and water, and suround the borders of hamas controlled regions with troops that will shoot down everyone or anything that comes there, or from there. Most of the palestinians want our death. It is a declaration of war. Very well. As a soldier i look forward to this assignment. __________________ Case from my reservist service: Kids attention, I have brought you something... Don't pull that ring private!!

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02-09-2006, 07:45 PM	#3
Sir Degrader Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom Join Date: November 3, 2001 Location: Canada Age: 63 Posts: 2,871	Granted, I'm afraid of Russian intervention in the Middle East.

02-09-2006, 08:03 PM	#4
shamrock_uk Dracolich Join Date: January 24, 2004 Location: UK Age: 41 Posts: 3,092	Yeah, they're probably still annoyed that they never really managed to get the hang of effective Middle-East intervention in the past. Perhaps they see an opportunity to establish themselves again. [ 02-09-2006, 08:18 PM: Message edited by: shamrock_uk ]

02-16-2006, 02:42 PM	#8
shamrock_uk Dracolich Join Date: January 24, 2004 Location: UK Age: 41 Posts: 3,092	I agree with most of what you write BB. It's only when we get to your proposed solution that I balk. Maybe I just don't have the balls to approve of/order that kind of an assault on civilians. I favour the wall solution myself. Oh yeah, good point about Munich. Poor Chamberlain, he sounds so gutted in his war address. Perhaps a bumbling, loveable sort of idiot? [img]smile.gif[/img]

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