Inside the Numbers

[DraconisRex]

Agreeing to disagree is fine. I neither expect you, nor Bioware, to strictly adhere to an idealized, properly balanced RPG conceptualization where your character couldn't exist.

First, that would be incredibly arrogant on my part and I have no right to impose that view on anyone. Argue about it, yes. Impose, no.

Second, the devs ,pubs, etc. have to make money. The customer base for what I, and others of my ilk do, isn't large enough to keep them in jockey shorts for more than a week. They follow my lack of flash, tight monetary style of campaign, they're out of business.

Third, it's your game and you have every stinking right to enjoy it as you see fit. Period.

As for discussion focus, I don't think NWN is "just this module." It is 3E rules, PnP atmosphere, automated and with graphics. At no point in my original post did I indicate that these observations and explanations were limited to Bioware's, somewhat faulty in places, interpretation(s) of the rules/feats/etc. codified into the game environment.

And while, I'll admit the game is fun as heck, the module design has some serious flaws. But I don't really play this game to follow the story.

Instead, I run a diverse group of people through each level to see how they handle the challenges. I have 6 core (started from prelude and not deleted in Chapter 1) characters that are in Chapter 2 or 3.

1. Elspeth, Wizard (12), Fighter (2). She's an experiment on heavily armoured wizards. She has low dex and high ST & CN for a mage. She uses the "Still" feat for all spells with Somatic components.

2. Karia Blake, Ranger (6), Rogue (5). She's a "glade warden" and hunts down and kills those who despoil the forrests under her care. No matter where they hide.

3. Roland DeLyon. Fighter/Paladin/CLeric (2/3/3) hybrid. He was a mistake, but I haven't deleted him yet.

4. Amandur Ti'Triel. Wizard (17). Amazingly powerful guy. Maximum fireball anyone? [img]smile.gif[/img]

5. Faenor Be'litte. Druid (10). Not sold on him yet. He's been left in NW Woods for some time...

6. Rodon Ben'dun. Ranger (5), Wizard (6). Half-elf. Interesting.

and the 7th, but still in "prelude" is Gard Wettel. The plan for Gard is Rogue/Bard/Fighter.

There was another character, a half-orc Cleric/Rogue/Barbarian. (Shaman gets job in big city... ) However, I accidently deleted him.

[Darkman]

DraconisRex, it would seem to me that YOU are the powergamer here, not Tobbin. Would a role-player choose to create a fighter with extra low STR knowing that a gauntlet of STR can be found early in the game? Would a role-player choose to have 13 INT soley because he wants to use the Disarm skill? That sounds more like roll-playing to me. But I do not wish to argue about this. I just think it's unfair for you to accuse Tobbin of something that you are guilty of yourself.

BTW, I enjoyed your OFFENSE vs. DEFENSE post. Interesting stuff [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Tobbin]

Originally posted by Darkman: DraconisRex, it would seem to me that YOU are the powergamer here, not Tobbin. Would a role-player choose to create a fighter with extra low STR knowing that a gauntlet of STR can be found early in the game? Would a role-player choose to have 13 INT soley because he wants to use the Disarm skill? That sounds more like roll-playing to me. But I do not wish to argue about this. I just think it's unfair for you to accuse Tobbin of something that you are guilty of yourself. BTW, I enjoyed your OFFENSE vs. DEFENSE post. Interesting stuff [img]smile.gif[/img]

I would like to thank you for defending me. I was going to raise the same issue, but thought it would be mis-read. I believe it is a valid question he intially raised though, just that the reasoning behind it wasn't sound (powergamer vs regular gamer). I try to go with the flow either in battle or in items I find. If something makes me that much better, then hey, go with it. I could max out my AC by choosing the +5 Holy Plate mail or something with a +5 ring of Protection +5 this and that, but I haven't. I was really surprised to see Shadow Legion Armor in Port Llast. Even moreso to see how much it costs. I had to go on 3 assignments before I could afford it. Now (when I play online with a friend from work), I barely get 10 hp per enemy (This is against Ogre's, Trolls, etc.) It takes me that much LONGER to level up now. Course that is a good thing or I would already be done with the game. I would like to add that the important areas of the game are still just as deadly for someone high level that they are for low level. I have noticed that the game throws in higher level enemy to fight if it thinks you can handle it. When I went back to the prison area in the 1st chapter, almost all of the enemy was Gang Leaders. I don't have magical protection (my main weakness especially death magic) so was having to heal up a lot. When I fought the trolls in the 2nd chapter, I didn't have to heal at all (I have a Greater Amulet of Health (took forever before I could afford that) and a ring of lesser power. So I gain +2 to regeneration. Still, when you lose like 30-50hp's a whack (some areas you lose hp's really fast), this barely helps at all. What really goads me is death magic. I could be perfectly fine and get hit by death magic (especially Bodaks) and then have to respawn (thereby losing a lot of experience points). Money isn't as much a problem now that I have items that work for me so I don't mind losing it as much. Dunno.

[Chewbacca]

I'm not taking sides here, but in defense of Draconisrex, It seems to me that the he is really just expirimenting with different characters to maximizes his knowledge and perhaps enjoyment of the game. Sorta like a NWN scientist....

I get the feeling that neither parties involved are "powergamers", but both love the game. If thats the case I'm right up there with Ya'll.

I gave my druid all the dual weld feats/skill, and I dont regret it. Its cool to see the scimitar and kama combo in action, especially now that I found a scimitar of speed! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Tobbin]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: I'm not taking sides here, but in defense of Draconisrex, It seems to me that the he is really just expirimenting with different characters to maximizes his knowledge and perhaps enjoyment of the game. Sorta like a NWN scientist.... I get the feeling that neither parties involved are "powergamers", but both love the game. If thats the case I'm right up there with Ya'll. I gave my druid all the dual weld feats/skill, and I dont regret it. Its cool to see the scimitar and kama combo in action, especially now that I found a scimitar of speed! [img]smile.gif[/img]

Where did you find the scimitar of speed? I would love to trade that out for my boots of speed. I could get my boots of striding back and boost up my HP. LOL. Yes, I agree, that was why I didn't really want to say powergamer there. I still believe the question to be a valid one, just brought up in an unusual way. I like testing some skills/options too. I didn't roll up my character, but chose the pre-rolled character that was already available (I liked the game so much that I didn't want to kill time restarting with another character. LOL)

[Chewbacca]

Scimitar of speed: Somewhere in chapter 3 for sure.

I think it was near the end of the ruins for the second word of power, but please dont hold me too that cause it was last week and the toolset has consumed most my NWN time of late. Hmm maybe it was the snow globe.. ah hell im of little use!

So was a prefab worth it? I personally love making new characters, but if I go overboard there I actually never get to playing the game, so I limit myself to one new character per module or game.

[Tobbin]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: Scimitar of speed: Somewhere in chapter 3 for sure. I think it was near the end of the ruins for the second word of power, but please dont hold me too that cause it was last week and the toolset has consumed most my NWN time of late. Hmm maybe it was the snow globe.. ah hell im of little use! So was a prefab worth it? I personally love making new characters, but if I go overboard there I actually never get to playing the game, so I limit myself to one new character per module or game.

It's been pretty good so far. I have a female ranger that I created too, but never got beyond level 1 Ranger / level 1 Sorceror. Once I get this character to 20th level I will try her out. Not sure how long it will be until I make the 3rd chapter, but hopefully soon. Now that I know a little more, I may recreate her though. Didn't allocate points well for a sorceror as I was thinking wizard (Gave her high int, but mediocre charisma)

I've had to restart a lot to go with my friends. They didn't want to start in the middle. I just found a Golden Circlet, so that has really helped out my character in the ruins in the 2nd chapter. Magic is my one weakness, and I kept getting stunned. It wasn't so bad with my AC at 37, but to enable the helm, I lost 10 AC so am back down to 27. Ah well. I found a club of smiting and this is whooping up on the flesh golems and the Minorgans (sp?). It's cool to see the magic leave from them when they get smited. LOL. Had to disable ring of power, so lost some regeneration too. Still going pretty good though. Traded out the boots of speed for the boots of striding +3. That has helped the HP's out. Well, back to the bu*t kicking for justice. LOL