What punishment should she get? (III)

[Melusine]

Originally posted by harleyquinn: It would be easy, except that as you said in your first post, she was shooting while driving by, so she was putting others at risk, albiet a very small one given the time, there are people out walking at that time, so I stand by my statement of her being lucky that no one happened to walk by at the same time she was driving by pulling the trigger.

And I agree. Cerek, first you concede she might not have hit the first time because of nerves or that she had missed and merely hit the wall(Quote: my guess is that she completely missed the first time (due to nerves), or just hit the wall (which wouldn't do much actual damage)), but a minute later you assert that it would be "very easy" for her to make sure she didn't hit anyone. I cannot see how the two viewpoints can be reconciled. I'll give you that there are probably not many people around in the middle of the night, but not that if there HAD been people, that it would have been easy to avoid hitting them.

[Tancred]

The actual story never says she shot the place while driving past... it just says she drove OUT to the clinic and shot it, not drove by it or drove up to it. We don't know.

[Lanesra]

Originally posted by LordKathen: 1 year imprisonment. Counseling. Another year, working with rape victoms. Back in prison for 5, if she ever has a gun agian.

Sorry, what has this to do with rape victims? What possible help could she be to them.? I'm also confused as to what her intents were, if she was against abortion then she must be pro life, If she fired a gun at a clinic indiscriminatley, then she is in my opinion a hypocrite, as she could have killed someone.

[LordKathen]

Originally posted by Lanesra: Quote: Originally posted by LordKathen: 1 year imprisonment. Counseling. Another year, working with rape victoms. Back in prison for 5, if she ever has a gun agian.

Sorry, what has this to do with rape victims? What possible help could she be to them.? I'm also confused as to what her intents were, if she was against abortion then she must be pro life, If she fired a gun at a clinic indiscriminatley, then she is in my opinion a hypocrite, as she could have killed someone.[/QUOTE]Women that are pregnant from rape, should be aloud abortion. At an early term of course after counseling about odoption. That was my only point. That maybe there is another side to just abortion for birth control as I have seen. I dont know, its a fine line. Not real sure about how I feel. I didnt mean to start a debate here.

[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by Melusine: Quote: Originally posted by harleyquinn: It would be easy, except that as you said in your first post, she was shooting while driving by, so she was putting others at risk, albiet a very small one given the time, there are people out walking at that time, so I stand by my statement of her being lucky that no one happened to walk by at the same time she was driving by pulling the trigger.

And I agree. Cerek, first you concede she might not have hit the first time because of nerves or that she had missed and merely hit the wall(Quote: my guess is that she completely missed the first time (due to nerves), or just hit the wall (which wouldn't do much actual damage)), but a minute later you assert that it would be "very easy" for her to make sure she didn't hit anyone. I cannot see how the two viewpoints can be reconciled. I'll give you that there are probably not many people around in the middle of the night, but not that if there HAD been people, that it would have been easy to avoid hitting them.[/QUOTE]As Tancred has pointed out...the article does not say she was actually driving as she shot...it just says she drove out to the clinic.

I also said that my hypothesis of why she went back a second time was pure speculation. I was trying to "put myself in her shoes". From what I've heard of this woman (which is precious little - I admit), this was very "out of character" for her. She quit her job at the hospital without notice just a couple of weeks ago.....then shows up in a town 100 miles away and shoots at an abortion clinic.

Now then, if I were to take the same actions she did...I would be extremely nervous - at least on my first trip. I'm not going to shoot while driving my car...because there is just too much that can go wrong. Plus, I'm not strong enough to hold a 12 gauge shotgun one handed and fire it. So I'm going to pull into the parking lot. I don't want to get out of the car, because somebody might see me (it isn't likely at midnight - but you never know). So I would probably stick the gun all the way out of the window, fire a round, then take off fast.

Since I'm rushing my shot, I may not do the damage I want to. So I go back to the hotel to calm down. A few hours later, I feel a little more confident and not as nervous. So I go back out to the clinic. I drive by at a regular speed at first, to see if any cops are around and inspecting the damage from my first shot. Seeing no police officers around, I study the clinic a little more closely. This time, I decide exactly where I want to park my car. I pull up close enough to the front so that I can step out of the car, fire into the front and shatter the windows (and maybe the door). I pull into the parking lot, look around to make sure I don't see anybody, then proceed with my plan.

I park the car, step out and this time I fire TWO rounds at the front of the building. I then get back in my car and drive back to the hotel at a more normal pace.

Now..this is all pure conjecture on my part, but it fits into the description given in the article. She fire one round at the clinic around midnight. She then returns 3 hours later (because she didn't do enough damage the first time) and fires two rounds. I'll admit the possibility of hitting an innocent standerby is greater the first time around (because I'm more nervous and may fire too quickly and inaccurately). The second time, the likelihood if hitting an innocent is far less likely. Not only is there very little chance of anybody being out there at that time, but I'm a little calmer now and I take time to look around before getting out of the car.

So, I'm not being hypocritical in my statements (IMO anyway). By going out there after midnight, the chances of an innocent person strolling by at the time I do the shooting is almost non-existent to begin with. It could happen, but it isn't very likely.

[Lord of Alcohol]

I dont think shooting a building is any way to solve problems. Whether your are pro or anti abortion doesnt matter. I dont like churches, they mess up traffic but I'm sure as heck not going to shoot my rifle at one. People can be hurt, you might not know they are there. Perhaps a homeless person, who knows. She is all grown up and should know better. If I did something like that it would be jail without doubt. The double standard for women in NC will likely give her probation

[Ziroc]

Anyone know if this case has passed sentance yet? If so, what was the sentance?

Just wondering.. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Timber Loftis]

Paging CEREK. CEREK the Barbaric, please report to the CEO's office. You've been officially "called to the carpet."

Inquiring minds *do* want to know.

[Cerek the Barbaric]

Here is the latest information I could find on the case.


Psychological evaluation sought for woman accused in Asheville abortion clinic shooting
By Julie Ball
March 5, 2003 11:21 p.m.

ASHEVILLE - The attorney for a Murphy woman charged with firing shots at an abortion clinic wants her to undergo a psychological evaluation.

Brenda Kay Phillips, 44, of Murphy, was indicted on six counts stemming from the February shooting.

She appeared briefly in a federal courtroom Wednesday, but a scheduled arraignment was postponed.

"If the government agrees, the arraignment will be postponed for the purpose of the psychological examination," U.S. Magistrate Judge Max Cogburn Jr. said Wednesday.

Jack Stewart, Phillips' attorney, filed a motion Monday seeking a psychological evaluation for Phillips.

The motion indicates Phillips "has a history of mental health issues that may become pertinent to defendant's defense of this cause and, more particularly, the defendant's ability to stand trial."

Stewart said the evaluation could take 30 to 60 days.

Charges against Phillips include threatening to damage abortion clinics in Asheville and Birmingham, Ala., damaging the Asheville clinic and weapons charges. She faces a minimum of 35 years in prison just for the weapons charges, according to Stewart.

Authorities allege Phillips fired a shotgun into the Femcare clinic on Orange Street Feb. 13.

The clinic was closed at the time of the shooting, and no one was hurt.

A federal indictment filed last month alleges Phillips also threatened to damage the Femcare building "by use of an explosive" less than a month before the shooting incident.

She is also charged with making a similar threat to damage the New Woman All Women Health Clinic in Birmingham, Ala.

Both clinics have been the target of violence in the past.

An off-duty police officer was killed and a nurse badly injured when a bomb exploded at the Birmingham clinic in 1998. Federal authorities later charged Eric Rudolph, who was living in Cherokee County, with the bombing.

In 1999, police found a partially exploded bomb outside the Asheville clinic.

Rick Schwein, FBI supervisory special agent in Asheville, would not comment on the specifics of this case but said, "Generally, anytime there's an act of violence directed at an abortion clinic, we're going to look for ties to organizations or other individuals who advocate the use of violence."

Assistant U.S. Attorney Jerry Miller could not be reached for comment Wednesday.

published in Asheville Citizens-Time March 5, 2003

Looks like she's facing a LOT of prison time for her actions (35 years minimum for the weapons charges alone). [img]graemlins/wow.gif[/img]