Kid dies while his friends watch

[Epona]

Well said Melusine.

So a lot of you seem to think he deserved to die. Do you think people suffering from depression, addiction, and mental illness deserve to die? What kind of world do we live in, where people think it's OK to say things like that?

Let me tell you, it was in no way funny when a close relative of my ex ended up in intensive care after a suicide attempt. If you'd seen him with tubes and monitors, crying over what he'd done (and it was a real attempt, not a cry for help, he'd driven to a secluded spot at dawn and fortunately had been found by someone walking their dog) there is no way you could say he deserved to die.

My ex also made plans for suicide not so long ago. He suffers from clinical depression, which is an illness. He is very intelligent, but because of this illness he cannot handle the simple difficulties that life throws at him. He'd stopped taking anti-depressants because they made him feel worse (when he should have gone back to his doc to try a different prescription). He was being serious. He handed in his notice at work, and didn't tell anyone. I finally twigged what was going on when he told me 'whatever happens I want you to know it is in no way your fault' (we'd split a few months before after 11 years together, he suffered from depression before that, and we'd become good friends). I rallied a group of friends together to look after him, and he got through it - that time. Last week he tried it for real, took a bunch of pills. Fortunately he doesn't know much about medicines, and took ones that would not kill him or do him lasting damage. He is ill, he does not deserve to die because of that.

On a final note, apparently last night in a chatroom of a forum I visit daily (not this one) a visitor to chat (ie not a regular board member) said they were going to end it all. People there are decent, and tried to talk the visitor out of it. Someone alerted the webmaster, who was able, through a lot of detective work and by chatting casually to the person concerned, to find out where they lived and he called the US police in that town (the board is UK based and the webmaster lives in London) and got them to go round and check up on the person concerned. Top marks for that site and its members and webmaster.

[Memnoch]

There's a saying: Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

There's also another saying similar to that: People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

What this person did was certainly stupid. I don't know why this person did what he did, but until I do, I don't think I'm qualified to say that he deserved to die for being stupid. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. The article doesn't give you enough information to cast the stone IMO.

[homer]

I never said, myself that the individual deserved to die. All I was trying to indicate is that no one else is at fault for his death. I still think it is possible he was not depressed; he may have faked symptoms in order to get prescription drugs.

[Aelia Jusa]

Great posts Mel, LadyZ, Animal [img]smile.gif[/img] . Concur with all.

Originally posted by LordKathen: I think your all reading way to much in this. We dont know his motives. We can assume a lot of things to emphasize our own opinion, but we dont know the true, or whole, story. What we do know, is he died, from an irresponsable act. We do know that he was "bragging" about his high tolerance, and typed the last words, "I told you I was hardcore". This is pure egotism, and that is what killed him. As far as the chat room goes, its irrelevent. They were his audience. He could have one found elsewhere. MY opinion is that he killed himself by accident with his OWN stupidity.

It's true we don't know every detail. Which makes it even worse that people are so quick to say he deserved it! But I think you too, are making assumptions about what is given. You say it is egotism, and an irresponsible act - maybe, maybe not. I see that as seeking attention - and anyone who has needs such extreme attention and notoriety from people he doesn't even know that well isn't behaving rationally or normally, and just for that, he has my sympathy! He says 'I told you I was hardcore' - he feels he has to go to this huge extreme to 'prove' himself, for them to admire him. People who are thinking clearly, and who are totally healthy don't behave like this. Whether he meant to kill himself or not isn't that important; I personally think he probably did, but even if he didn't, his behaviour clearly shows he was not functioning in such a way that he was able to look after himself. And since I have a lot of compassion to go round, I feel for him.

[LordKathen]

Originally posted by Aelia Jusa: Great posts Mel, LadyZ, Animal [img]smile.gif[/img] . Concur with all. Quote: Originally posted by LordKathen: I think your all reading way to much in this. We dont know his motives. We can assume a lot of things to emphasize our own opinion, but we dont know the true, or whole, story. What we do know, is he died, from an irresponsable act. We do know that he was "bragging" about his high tolerance, and typed the last words, "I told you I was hardcore". This is pure egotism, and that is what killed him. As far as the chat room goes, its irrelevent. They were his audience. He could have one found elsewhere. MY opinion is that he killed himself by accident with his OWN stupidity.

It's true we don't know every detail. Which makes it even worse that people are so quick to say he deserved it! But I think you too, are making assumptions about what is given. You say it is egotism, and an irresponsible act - maybe, maybe not. I see that as seeking attention - and anyone who has needs such extreme attention and notoriety from people he doesn't even know that well isn't behaving rationally or normally, and just for that, he has my sympathy! He says 'I told you I was hardcore' - he feels he has to go to this huge extreme to 'prove' himself, for them to admire him. People who are thinking clearly, and who are totally healthy don't behave like this. Whether he meant to kill himself or not isn't that important; I personally think he probably did, but even if he didn't, his behaviour clearly shows he was not functioning in such a way that he was able to look after himself. And since I have a lot of compassion to go round, I feel for him.[/QUOTE]I see your point here. And my sympathy goes out as well. I used to be a drug addict and have lost 2 friends from overdose. I read and reread that chat. I see that he was definetly seeking the attention from those watching, but how far does that go? And how old is this guy anyway? I also see a kid who thought maybe he was indestructable, as I did when doing my drugs. And also, are we sure those were his prescribed drugs? In highschool there was drugs like that everwhere. Maybe he got them from his moms med. cabinet. My point is, we just dont know. He is dead from irresponsability. Maybe he was suicidal and needed help. In this case, where was his mom? Why did he have those drugs? Methadone??? Sounds fishy to me. Im ranting now, excuse me...

[Oblivion437]

Apathy doesn't kill people, the actions that result do. The 'Smith2k' (I only glanced over the log, and it didn't seem all that meaningful to note the names, so if I'm wrong, eh.) certainly did encourage a deranged individual, but he didn't know he was deranged, or suicidal, or whatever. Obviously, his saying "This is normal behavior" vindicates their egging him on. I say he was an idiot. Anybody stupid enough to put their life in the hands of a grab-bag of drugs, deserves the results. If you think this is, in any way tragic, you're a freakin' moron. You're the same kind of person who would consider the death of a cell-phone using driver a tragedy, or the murder of a couple of drug dealers in the Bronx. When an adult, of 21, commits suicide, they made the choice. They popped the pill, they slit their wrists, they pulled the trigger. Society didn't do it. Their parents didn't do it. They did it.

[Ladyzekke]

Originally posted by Oblivion437: If you think this is, in any way tragic, you're a freakin' moron. You're the same kind of person who would consider the death of a cell-phone using driver a tragedy, or the murder of a couple of drug dealers in the Bronx.

Oblivion nothing is wrong with adding your own opinion re the subject, but calling us who actually CARE that a young man is dead Morons is rude, and far as I know, not allowed behavior on this forum (see the TOS). If it were, I'd have a colorful name calling reply for you.

[Davros]

Originally posted by ladyzekke: Quote: Originally posted by Oblivion437: If you think this is, in any way tragic, you're a freakin' moron. You're the same kind of person who would consider the death of a cell-phone using driver a tragedy, or the murder of a couple of drug dealers in the Bronx.

Oblivion nothing is wrong with adding your own opinion re the subject, but calling us who actually CARE that a young man is dead Morons is rude, and far as I know, not allowed behavior on this forum (see the TOS). If it were, I'd have a colorful name calling reply for you. [/QUOTE]Good catch LadyZ - I had missed the last couple of posts in this discussion, and the one you refer to is right out of line. Let's hope the rest of society has a little more compassion huh.

[Memnoch]

Originally posted by Oblivion437: Apathy doesn't kill people, the actions that result do. The 'Smith2k' (I only glanced over the log, and it didn't seem all that meaningful to note the names, so if I'm wrong, eh.) certainly did encourage a deranged individual, but he didn't know he was deranged, or suicidal, or whatever. Obviously, his saying "This is normal behavior" vindicates their egging him on. I say he was an idiot. Anybody stupid enough to put their life in the hands of a grab-bag of drugs, deserves the results. If you think this is, in any way tragic, you're a freakin' moron. You're the same kind of person who would consider the death of a cell-phone using driver a tragedy, or the murder of a couple of drug dealers in the Bronx. When an adult, of 21, commits suicide, they made the choice. They popped the pill, they slit their wrists, they pulled the trigger. Society didn't do it. Their parents didn't do it. They did it.

Dude, I won't have people calling other people on this forum freakin' morons, no matter what their belief is, or just because they disagreed with you. Watch yourself.

Also, comparing the above to the murder of a couple of drug dealers in the Bronx is NOT the same thing - to think so, you'd have to be a....but I won't say it.

Chill out and relax - there's no need to foam at the mouth when posting your opinion on something.

[karlosovic]

reading this just made me feel sick in the stomach. with the amount of time I've spent online in chatrooms and forums etc, and knowing how people brag and lie about who they are... it's just a little too real for me.

whoever said that its just like any of us who had 1 drink too many, or took a corner too fast etc... I hear ya, that's what I'm thinking. The amount of times I've just missed getting myself killed accidently... it's scary. Not that I'd ever take heaps of drugs just to show off, but I've pushed other boundaries and been lucky to escape. All it takes is one time, to take another step when every other step has been fine, and you're dead. Game over, and you can't reload.

It could happen to anyone