Personal safety issues and my recent experience

[Cloudbringer]

LadyZekke- I'm guessing that would be a pretty big coincidence.. sounds like you may have been marked as a target.. but hard to know now.. just glad you DIDN'T find out then!!!

[Larry_OHF]

I think that screamer thing is a good idea, as Karen tells me further that she actualy loses her breath and would be unable to blow a whistle. I just hope that her hands would not also be rendered useless, as she tried figeting for her keychain!

quote:

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Originally posted by Larry_OHF:

My wife and I have read all of your posts together, and she has brought up an interesting question. Some women, herself included, tend to lose their voice in "extreme situations", thus being unable to scream.

What are your suggestions for those that have this problem???

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If you won't carry a GUN...LOOK LIKE YOU DO. Wear a jacket with low front pockets if you absolutely HAVE to walk anywhere where you may encounter danger...if someone approaches you, put ONE HAND in the corresponding pocket, straighten you shoulders and scope the person approaching out... cross the street if they don't cross it first...they are crazier than you LOL
By doing this though, you give the appearance that you are not looking for trouble but are ready for it. I've used this tactic many times and nine times out of ten, the person approaching me would be the first to cross the street...getting out of MY way because they assumed I had a gun or a knife in my pocket and that I meant them harm...we're talking in the dark, late at night and on deserted streets...people who looked more like they belonged there than I did...people who could not yet see my smiling face and know they had nothing to fear...just seeing me put my hand into my pocket was enough to raise alarm...I never carried a knife OR a gun LOL.

Never be afraid...martial arts, as was suggested, is a great form of self defense...you can bring people to their knees just by knowing how to grab their wrist...you can release a death grip by pulling back the pinky...lots of ways to hurt a potential rapist or worse with very simple moves that take nothing more to learn than the desire to know.
Always better safe than sorry.

[Durwyn]

Yes you can indeed, but with the stress grooming around you when the actual sittuation happens, will you still do anything? See as Larry said if his wife losses her voice in a situation it happens from stress. So if something like that happens I doubt anyone will be able to perform any moves at all if their lose their voice. And that not only happens to women but men also. You just get into a total shock... crazy eh? [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Nachtrafe]

quote:

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Originally posted by Larry_OHF:
I think that screamer thing is a good idea, as Karen tells me further that she actualy loses her breath and would be unable to blow a whistle. I just hope that her hands would not also be rendered useless, as she tried figeting for her keychain!

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Hmmm...a good point. Well...if your wife is truly concerned about her safety(and I really dont think anyone in today's world can afford to be unconcerned) then I highly recommend taking a self defense course. Even if she is never forced to use the knowledge gained she will feel better for knowing it, and so will you. [img]smile.gif[/img] Also, even if all the course does is give her the confidence to scream help, then its done its job. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[WOLFGIR]

Hiya Cloudy! Glad this is over and that you are a strong woman.
Since well I have been training alot of martial art in the more "extreme" self defence systems I can tell you all this.

1. Most important rule. Never be a victim. You have mentioned the look in the eye, good poise, never run, be calm, be in charge of your own emotions. This is the precautions before something happens.

2. Locations and awareness. Never walk close to a wall, always walk out abit before you round corners to be able to see what is behind it. If you walk to close you can be onned aginst it, or you can be jumped more easily. Stay away from dark streets, remote locations. And if walking at night, wear sneakers regardless of how nice dress you have. This is also important for guys, don´t try to run in fancy shoes, try to have sneakers to that tux!

3. When attacked. One of the most important things to remember if attakced is the psychological momentum, someone grabs you, kick hit scream and fast, stare the attacker in the eyes, show him you are not a victim, this might (I say might cause you never know) make the attacker hesitate and then place a kick Beckham would be envious of right between the leg, regardless sex on the attakcer, they won´t be that happy to run after that. About the keys, this is a good/bad thing. If you can hold them as a "tubelike" object in your hand, thats great, add a hardness to your own knuckles, if you try to have it sticking out like a stabbing wepaon between fingers, be prepaired for the pain, too many have broken fingers hands so on, but that might be worth it..
Pepperspray, shockguns, high heels (if you are not going to run) are better options. Pepperspray is visciosly effective..
Try to hit the opponent towards the face, regardless wether you hit or not, most will be defensive, you break attacker to defender, and hands go high to defend face. Remember Beckham? *womp* absolutley the best means a woman has to defend herself against men.

4. This is when you are attacked and on the ground. Mostly I would like to be able to show this but, well the reminding thing to keep in mind here is that a man can´t do it with his pants on. If he has a weapon well, this situation is the one we in Krav usually calls the do or die. Of obvious reasons. If no weapon is present, wait for the unbuckling of pants, hit with fingers against soft tagets, throat, eyes, kidneys, use your hips to shake to one side and hit him so the momentum is to the same way of the complete attack, try and get legs free and kick hard often and furious. Usually you have nothing to loose.

5. Free again, run like hell, keep low profile, run towards service stores, offices, banks with alarms, set it off do whatever. A fine for breaking a window is just money..

6. After.
Not much to tell, psychologist are better at this than martial arts instructors but remember one thing. IT IS NEVER YOUR FAULT! NEVER BLOODY EVER!

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If someone wants to I can go find some litterature about both the psychology effects and tricks and techniques when attacked..
I hope that you can find some reason in my rumblings and if you are interested in anything, don´t hesitate to ask me.

[Epona]

quote:

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Originally posted by Sir Taliesin:



I wasn't talking about revenge, just self-defense. I understood english law forbides someone from even defending themselves with NON-LETHAL means. If you where walking down the street and another woman came up and started hitting on you for no apparent reason other than to cause you bodily harm, do you under the British system have the right to hit back or do you have to run away? What if she continues to pursue you down the street. Can you turn and face her or do you simply have to keep running because you have an escape route. If the intruder that entered your room hadn't stopped and you brained him over the head and killed him with the lamp, even though you intended no permement harm, could you be tried for murder or man-slaughter? Are you expected to just lay there and take it? I am not flaming, just trying to understand.

We don't condone revenge here in the states either, just a right to self-defense. That is two different things in the eyes of the law.
If a woman is being raped, and she has to use lethal force to stop that rape then that's OK. If that same woman was raped and then she killed her rapist on the street two weeks later then she has committed murder in the eyes of the law. The law is quite clear about the use of self-defense in my state. You can only use lethal force if YOU or ANOTHER is in FEAR of THEIR LIFE. In this state burgerly isn't a reason to use lethal force; however the if the burgler is waving a knife around and trying to stab you, you may use lethal force. Even assualt isn't a grounds to use lethal force. You must PROVE that you were in fear of your life.

Having said that, there are cases in this country that self-defense got someone off on murder that I don't agree with. Case in point.
About fifteen years ago a young man was shot in the back and killed, because he was a peeping tom. The home owner pleaded self-defense and the Grand Jury (made up of citizens in our city) refused to return and indictment of the home owner. I didn't agree with that then and I don't now. The young man that was killed was shot in the back. He was running away and a threat to no one. That doesn't happen here often, but it can happen. I'd have had the home owner tried in court for murder, personally. That's an opinion that isn't too popular arond here. I also still feel strongly about the right to bear arms and a right to self-defense.

To those of you that finished this long and sometimes rambling post, THANK YOU! Epona I'm asking again! [img]smile.gif[/img]

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Good post, I can see where you're coming from! I think this is a major cultural difference here, we see things quite differently with respect to carrying guns, and I respect that. In England, yes you would likely find yourself charged with manslaughter if it was clearly self defense, and murder if there were any doubt about whether there was no other option. So you must run! Of course no *cough* sensible jury would find you guilty if they were convinced you were protecting yourself and really had no other option, but I have heard of people being charged and convicted of ABH through using hairspray as a weapon when they could have escaped.

Interestingly, we had a very similar case to the one you mention - a farmer shot a young lad who had broken into his house, and was sent down for murder. There was a huge campaign whipped up by the media to get the guy released (based on the idea that you should be able to defend your own property). What most of the media failed to mention though was that the boy was shot in the back and that the farmhouse was derelict to the extent that it looked uninhabited - OK the lad shouldn't have been there, but no way was it self defence, it was murder!

[Epona]

quote:

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Originally posted by Larry_OHF:
I think that screamer thing is a good idea, as Karen tells me further that she actualy loses her breath and would be unable to blow a whistle. I just hope that her hands would not also be rendered useless, as she tried figeting for her keychain!

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Yes, get her a screamer, definitely - she should carry it in her hand when walking alone, not in her bag or a pocket.
Some people do freeze up in fear, but it is impossible to tell how you would really react.

Before the incident that I posted happened, I always thought I would completely freeze up - and I didn't. Although I am less confident now about walking anywhere alone or staying in hotels, I am *more* confident of my ability to protect myself should the worst happen - because I now know that I can scream (and damn loud too, I always knew that the singing would come in handy!!)

[Cloudbringer]

Wolfie, that's a very good post! Lots of useful tips and suggestions!
Larry, I do think your wife might try classes AND carry the high decibel device. I know I've seen them, even owned them when in college. One version can be held on your wrist with a small key affixed so that if it is pulled off, the sound starts. One that I saw, also had a flashing light and looked almost like a flashlight for carrying around at night.


Epona, I know what you mean! I am always careful when alone, but doubly so in hotels and parking garages.

Cloudy

[Cloudbringer]

quote:

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Originally posted by Nachtrafe:


But, no matter how much martial arts you know, or how big of a gun you carry, or how many books you've read, the most important thing in surviving a bad encounter is TRAINING. You have to *react* properly, and the best way to do that is to train it in. Why do you think Military combat training is so intense. You have to react, not think. If you overthink, you tend to freeze. Fortunately, Cloudy made all the right preventative moves, and it saved her. But, if she had actually been attacked, could she have effectively fought back? I for one certainly hope so. I'm kind of fond of her. But she and we, will never know. And hopefully, she, and we, will never have to.

BTW...a huge [img]graemlins/kiss.gif[/img] for you Angeleyes. I'm glad you're all right. [img]smile.gif[/img]

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Just occured to me, I never responded to this, honey! Yes, I think I learned the preventatives because I don't know that I have that much confidence that I could deal with the actual attack. And yes.. I'm most glad I didn't have to find out.. I suspect that's when I'd panic.

[img]graemlins/kiss.gif[/img] back at you, sweetheart. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Cloudy