National Sales Tax vs IRS tyranny!

Originally posted by Azred: quote: Originally posted by MagiK: So basicly you are saying being poor, or lazy or just uninterested is an excuse to not to have an equal share of the burden. That if you are hard working, industrious and successful through your own efforts, you should be penalized for the lack of ability and initiative of others?

See? That's what I was saying--every plan has flaws in it, even if the flaw is in how the plan is perceived.
After designing this plan, I saw that it was simply nothing more than "from each according to his ability" which is completely against having everyone give an equal share.

The problems of 1) inequality of income and 2) how the idea of income is connected to personal worth are too difficult to overcome as of yet. At least, I admit that I have yet found no way of resolving those particular difficulties.[/QUOTE]The plan also assumes that with no motive for self gain, that each person will actually contribute. The naked truth is that Quite a large percentage of human beings, if given the basics for free will contribute nothing. They are quite content to sit on their butts, hanging with their friends playing games and not actually giving anything back to the system. It is the critical flaw in the US's current welfare system. I see it quite frequently all around me.

If all humans or even the majority of humans were altruistic and intelligent, we could have the sort of socialistic society that is depicted in Star Trek, no one with needs unmet, no greed or avarice, everyone would contribute fairly and live to better their selves.... Unfortunately Hman beings are by and large NOT like that at all.

Originally posted by The Hunter of Jahanna: Taxes wouldnt be so bad if they didnt pay senators and congressmen 6 figure salarys when they only work part of the time.They should all get paid hourly and not annualy.If they dont work then they dont get paid. I bet that would change their whole perspective on things.

The original Idea was that they wouldn't BE professional politicians, nor would they have retirement packages that mere mortals dream of, they were supposed to be regular folks from the real world representing the common man...these guys don't have a clue what a common man is, let alone on how to do right by them.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: But, don't get your hopes up. And, do you really think "they" will do this *instead* of an income tax - try *in addition* to one. Like I said I'm for it, but we'll never have the political will to do it right.

You AIN'T just whistling Dixie, let's see them abolish the IRS FIRST, then put in a striaght sales tax.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by MagiK: quote: Originally posted by Attalus: LOL, same here in Texas, MagiK, no state income tax, and the tar and feathers for anypolitician who dares mention one. (Ask Jim Hightower )

Seriously? No State income taxes in TX? Hell I may relocate. I can't move to Florida because the wages are too low, but in Texas you can earn a fair living!
Tennessee doen't have a big enough tech sector.[/QUOTE]Don't count Florida out MagiK, It depends on where you live. In the panhandle sure wages are low, compared to other parts of the country, on face value. Hale my wife and I bought a house, lived and raised two daughters, on my wages $7.50 per hour. It's not the high cost of living that gets you IT'S the cost of living high. You can find houses 1600-2000 sf for around the $100,000 range. Now don't all you big city folks come rushing down to get one of those houses cuase we'll just raise the prices on you
Wages are low here in Alabama too, but we have a State income tax, Lord we got taxes coming out the ying-yang.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Azred: One of the main reasons that governments have to institute a taxation scheme is because left to themselves most people would not freely give money to the government, even for the most basic social services such as water or roads.

You got that right, I've often wondered all these people that piss & moun about tax cuts if they take the tax cut, or do they keep paying the higher tax rate? Does anybody want to take that bet?

Originally posted by John D Harris: Don't count Florida out MagiK, It depends on where you live. In the panhandle sure wages are low, compared to other parts of the country, on face value. Hale my wife and I bought a house, lived and raised two daughters, on my wages $7.50 per hour. It's not the high cost of living that gets you IT'S the cost of living high. You can find houses 1600-2000 sf for around the $100,000 range. Now don't all you big city folks come rushing down to get one of those houses cuase we'll just raise the prices on you Wages are low here in Alabama too, but we have a State income tax, Lord we got taxes coming out the ying-yang.

LoL My sympathies to your YinYang JD [img]smile.gif[/img] All I know is I only have a couple of real vices, and they just happen to be really expensive ones So I "want" (note, that I didn't say NEED) the high $ income, so that I can have a 2000-2500 sqf. home and the electronic toys to go in it [img]smile.gif[/img] Plus, the real reason I don't relocate out of this bastion of the Democratic party, is that my kids are close to me here...Florida and texas are both too far away

Not that it matters, but I was dating a lady who had an 8500sqft. home with a three car garage.....I felt like I would get lost on the way to the john.

[ 11-15-2002, 11:23 PM: Message edited by: MagiK ]

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by khazadman: I'm for the flat tax. Now as for the poor paying the taxes.... Yeah right. here in the US the top 50% of wage earners pay 96.09% of taxes.

Yeah and they ONLY make something like 87.01% of the taxable income, Hale they're paying what? about 120% of their fare share of taxes. Oh, yeah before anybody even tries to jump on the "well they're rich and can afford it band wagon" If you make over $27,682 a year you are one of the top 50%!
$55,225 you're one of the top 25%!! Pays 84.01% of the tax BUT only earns 67.15% of the income.
$92,144 a year you're one of the top 10%! Pays 67.33% of the tax But only earns 46.01% of the income.
$128,336 a year one of the top 5%! Pays 56.47% of the tax But earns 35.30% of the income.
$313,469 a year one of the top 1%! PAYS 37.42% of the Tax But EARNS ONLY 20.81% of the income!
Now that leaves us with the bottom 50% of income earning tax payers, Hmmmm lets see what their tax burden is compared to the income. Pays 5.91% of tax but earns 12.99% of the income.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by MagiK: quote: Originally posted by John D Harris: Don't count Florida out MagiK, It depends on where you live. In the panhandle sure wages are low, compared to other parts of the country, on face value. Hale my wife and I bought a house, lived and raised two daughters, on my wages $7.50 per hour. It's not the high cost of living that gets you IT'S the cost of living high. You can find houses 1600-2000 sf for around the $100,000 range. Now don't all you big city folks come rushing down to get one of those houses cuase we'll just raise the prices on you Wages are low here in Alabama too, but we have a State income tax, Lord we got taxes coming out the ying-yang.

LoL My sympathies to your YinYang JD [img]smile.gif[/img] All I know is I only have a couple of real vices, and they just happen to be really expensive ones So I "want" (note, that I didn't say NEED) the high $ income, so that I can have a 2000-2500 sqf. home and the electronic toys to go in it [img]smile.gif[/img] Plus, the real reason I don't relocate out of this bastion of the Democratic party, is that my kids are close to me here...Florida and texas are both too far away

Not that it matters, but I was dating a lady who had an 8500sqft. home with a three car garage.....I felt like I would get lost on the way to the john.[/QUOTE]Well I can understand the Wants vs Needs