Language and foreign culture

[Lord Starshadow]

I know, Timber Loftis. But I just started to rant and didn't want to lose my train of thought. Who knows what might have happened or what it would've crashed into! [img]smile.gif[/img]

Admittedly, it is difficult to pick up a language, especially if you're older. The best time to learn a language is when one is younger; kids pick up things in no time! Perhaps we should have language classes at earlier times in the schooling process?

[Charean]

Originally posted by Lord Starshadow: It really is a shame that many Americans are against learning a new language. Languages are beautiful, and very helpful when traveling abroad. But many Americans seem to think that everyone in the world should speak English and use that as their reason to not learn. It's a terrible attitude that needs to change, and I think it helps fuel the perception that other countries have of Americans, that Americans feel that they are "above" all other countries.

I honestly don't think it is that Americans are against learning another language per se - there are lots of kids who learn how to use a computer and other things of that nature. I think it is laziness. But the educational system in our country is best suited for another thread.

No, we don't have an official language, and Congress has been trying to get a law passed to have one. For some reason, it is a real sticky point. Having an official language does not preclude one from using other languages as the need arises, and looking back - I really wish I learned Spanish instead of French in school. Now that I live in TX, it would have been good to know.

People make more money if they are bilingual or even polyglots. I have a couple of friends whose father was in the State Department. If you get certified to be a translator, the money is very good.
Most corporations, governments and businesses love to have someone who speaks more than one language. It makes for good relations and opens up opportunities.

Having said that and gone way off topic, having a national language would be a good idea. But I would love to see more kids really learn more languages to give them more opportunities.

[Timber Loftis]

The reason a national language is a sticky issue is the minute Congress tries to enact one, the Spanish-speaking lobby rolls out the big guns and argues for Spanish to be the national language. And, with a much greater percentage of Spanish-speakers willing to go to the mat (or the voting polls) for their languange that there are English speakerrs willing to do the same, the outcome quickly becomes a bit scary no matter how far-fetched the likelihood that Spanish would actually get chosen above English.

[Cloudbringer]

We have had a resurgence of 'political' interest in languages in this state (NY). They made a year of any foreign language mandatory for students in the State's colleges and Universities recently. You wouldn't believe how many try to get out of it! But at least we are finding that our High Schools push the subjects too.

[The Ornery One]

To start with, I think that if you are going to move to another country, you should learn that countries main language. I wouldn't move to another country without being able to at least speak enough of their language to ask questions. Also, it seems like people in other countries, other than US, are more likely to speak a second language. I wish that US schools would have more choices in foreign languages and had it available in the lower grades, not just high school. When I was in school, the only classes available were spanish, french, and latin and they were only available in high school.
My son has picked up a lot of spanish from watching Sesame Street but will probably forget most of it in the next few years. It's also to bad that my grandma doesn't remember very much serbian, or she could have taught me a little.

[The Hierophant]

A great topic for debate! And lots of insightful replies too!
I agree with the general consensus of 'learning a country's mother-tongue' in terms of how the adult generation reacts to foreign language situations. However I also believe that an increased effort to stimulate the interest in foreign language and culture at primary-school level is vital if a multi-lingual, poly-cultural generation is to develope (the demands for which are becoming increasingly apparent as immigration becomes such a global force of social change). Education of the younger generation is vital in this, mono-linguisticism shall only serve to increasingly polarize society internally, strengthening the rifts and psychological borders of various ethnic 'communities within communities'. However, making languages 'official', 'unofficial' or 'secondary' isn't going to necessarily solve anything either. The key to this is to create within our children a desire to understand the nuances of global culture (which includes the learning of language), as opposed passing legislation that grants officiality to one or two particular languages and/or ethnic cultures.

[True_Moose]

Well, up here it's two, and it seems to work fine. Of course, here you have a very centred French-speaking population (Quebec, New Brunswick, and pockets in Manitoba and Ottawa), so it's a bit easier to centralise. Comes from the fact that we are really two separate nations (not countries!) within the same country. BTW, I learned last week that a nation is simply a group of people ethnically and historically united in one mass. It's pretty much only English that takes nationalism to mean countries.

I don't think it really makes any sense for the US to get a second language. I mean, what would you do? Spanish hardly seems appropriate in Montana, French is useless outside Louisiana, for the most part, and the only other tongue that would be logical, some form of Native American, is really disjointed (by which I mean varies largely according to local dialect...obviously Navajo is different than Inuit.)

I would consider that you should probably learn to adapt to English in the US. I mean seriously, not to sound prejudiced against any language, but it's a skill you need to live a productive and happy life in any country (I mean the primary language, not necessarily English.)

I don't think Americans are against learning a second language, though certainly the public schools aren't mandated in any way (up here, you have a right to be able to access French immersion schools.) It's still a valuable skill. I mean, try making business deals in Beijing in English, for example.

Just my 2 cents' worth...

[K T Ong]

I know two languages -- Chinese, and the language in which I'm typing this message now. And I'm very glad I know these two languages, not just one of them, because each of them grants me access to an entire universe of meaning and thought which simply cannot be entered from the other side through translation, and I'm very much the richer for it. I mean, you can't really taste the flavor of, say, the T'ang poems in English translation. Or Wordsworth in Chinese translation either.

I can sympathise with those who feel that what language the individual wishes to learn should be his/her own business, but I reckon sometimes the political climate in which a nation or sociocultural milieu finds itself would make it suicidal not to learn certain languages. Certainly this is true of English. Like it or not, there's now this supergiant monster in the sky with powers that would make Sauron look like a wimp, with stars and stripes on its body [img]tongue.gif[/img] , that's saying to everyone: Speak English -- or DIIIIEEEE!!!! Dunno about other countries, but the gentlemen in power here in my country Singapore said 'okay' to this around forty years ago. Now English has become so predominant here that our mother tongues, such as Chinese, are almost in danger of being wiped off the scene. No doubt this will greatly please my dear Anglo-Saxon friends here on this board...

[ 11-03-2002, 05:09 AM: Message edited by: K T Ong ]

[Donut]

I don't think Americans should embark upon learning another language before they have mastered English.

Where's that bloody tin hat?

[WillowIX]

Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Alicat, this is a very interesting topic, one which I've seen bandied about for many years! I was a Russian language/literature major in college and when you do a BA and MA based on another culture and it's literature you find yourself hearing alot about how bad Amercians are because most of our population never bothers to learn a second language. As you noted, it can go both ways too, not only do the English speakers amongst us fail to pick up another language but those for whom English isn't the mother tongue frequently never bother to learn English.

Wow you speak Russian Cloudy? I´m so jealous! I have a few Russian friends who introduced me to Russain poetry. Alas I feel that a lot goes to waste in the translation.

Now about the topic. A lot of people fail to pick up English you say. Now I don´t know how to interpret that [img]smile.gif[/img] . Are you talking about in the US or in the world? First a believed it was the latter but now I`m not so sure anymore lol, since there´s an obvious reason for a lot of people not being able to speak English. Lack of schools and education of course. Most of Africa and Asia lacks that. In Europe I´ve never met anyone who didn´t speak English and their English was pretty good as well. Since I live near the Quebec border (and my dad´s from Montreal) I was forced to learn French as well. Then I studied in Sweden for 1 year and a half and picked up a little of that. After that I learned that English speaking people have a terrible accent when speaking foreign languages lol. Why is that? Anyone know that? I mean our languages can´t be that different can they? (I also speak some Spanish and it´s the same about the accent).