Question on Christianity.

[fable]

quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick:
Fable, at best all such "early fathers" writings do is analyse the Bible/Torah. Christians today have the source material, and additional perspective. It's a reasonable assertion to claim that Christian/Jewish/Islamic theologians should have a greater understanding of the character of God, the Holy Spirit, and Lucifer, than the early fathers as so much has passed and been viewed since then.

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Then all you need to do is wait for me to post this useless material from the Early Fathers, and then you can post far more relevant and incisive comments of your own, and shoot down the earlier stuff immediately.

But this is the problem with writing from the perspective of non-belief. It IS an inanimate subject with that perspective.

On the contrary: I may not worship Jesus as part of Christianity, but Jesus and Mary are both part of my pantheon, and yes, I have and do worship them. [img]smile.gif[/img] It is a living tradition in the best sense of the Word. Where such matters are concerned, the higher intuitive heart and soul comprehend something which is timeless, and all members of a congregation, living and dead (or alive in Christ, as I believe it is sometimes said) join hands. The moderns, who have access to the latest scholarship, are not put before the ancients; nor are the ancients better, simply because (as some people once reasoned, foolishly in my opinion) they were nearer in time to Christ. I have heard it said by a Presbyterian minister I greatly respect that in the universal leveling of the human comprehension of Christ, time ceases to have meaning, and the weight of experiences of all Christians, in all periods, may possess something valuable.

The appeal to "non-professionals" as having no worth in a discussion is hardly valid when the views expressed are simply coming from "professionals" in any case possessing credentials that are extremely well-regarded. You have expressed your opinion that the Early Fathers have nothing to contribute; I have expressed mine that they do. I'll try posting some of their views upon the subject of sin and temptation when I get the chance, and you may then tell me how worthless their concepts are. De gustibus.

[ 01-24-2002: Message edited by: fable ]

[Yorick]

quote:

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Originally posted by fable:

I have heard it said by a Presbyterian minister I greatly respect that in the universal leveling of the human comprehension of Christ, time ceases to have meaning, and [/b]the weight of experiences of all Christians , in all periods, may possess something valuable[/b].....

....I'll try posting some of their views upon the subject of sin and temptation when I get the chance, and you may then tell me how worthless their concepts are.

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Fable that's what I'm saying. It seems we agree.

No need for the presumptious hostility at the end there mate. No such statement would eventuate.

[ 01-24-2002: Message edited by: Yorick ]

[fable]

quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick:


Fable that's what I'm saying. It seems we agree.

No need for the presumptious hostility at the end there mate. No such statement would eventuate.

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I may have mistaken where you're coming from. But please keep in mind that you really don't know where I'm coming from, either. I suspect we'll both have better ideas about this and a number of other matters after we die, and that the forming of all such assumptions are best postponed until that time.

[John D Harris]

quote:

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Originally posted by MagiK:


Yes it happens all the time..you see people quoting the commandment "thou shalt not Kill" and will treat that as an absolute..which it most certainly is NOT

You see people quoting "Judge Not lest ye be judged" and assume we are not allowed to make moral assessments of the actions of other people which is NOT what the quote is ment to address.

It goes on and on and on and on and on..

Hope that is enough cause I dont feel like digging out more misquote and twisted phrases, but there are bunches.

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MagiK, Please tell me you are from "Southern Maryland I could not argee with you more. My favorite is the "judge not lest you be judged" often misquoted or not quoted in the full context.

[Yorick]

quote:

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Originally posted by fable:
I suspect we'll both have better ideas about this and a number of other matters after we die, and that the forming of all such assumptions are best postponed until that time.

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But of course. Still, half the fun of life is discovery and subsequent opinion formulation. Like a four dimensional virtual reality whodunnit.

[Lord Killjoy]

off the topic but there are only 2 evils on this planet Organized religeon and Money. get rid of both and you will have a rather peacful world on a global scale. And don't throw the failure of communisum at me. The only way to make communisum work is to have the whole planet switch to it and unless that happens it will never work. ala Star Trek

Lord Killjoy

quote:

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Originally posted by John D Harris:


MagiK, Please tell me you are from "Southern Maryland I could not argee with you more. My favorite is the "judge not lest you be judged" often misquoted or not quoted in the full context.

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Acutally Im pretty much in the middle maryland area [img]smile.gif[/img] right between Baltimore and DC along I95 but Im nothing more than a transplanted Yankee though [img]smile.gif[/img] born and partially raised in PA [img]smile.gif[/img]

quote:

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Originally posted by Lord Killjoy:
off the topic but there are only 2 evils on this planet Organized religeon and Money. get rid of both and you will have a rather peacful world on a global scale. And don't throw the failure of communisum at me. The only way to make communisum work is to have the whole planet switch to it and unless that happens it will never work. ala Star Trek

Lord Killjoy

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The only way Communism OR Socialism will ever work on this planet is if you change the nature of human kind, which ain't gonna happen till we become a race of clones who all think alike and give the same values to everything that every one else does. Communism and Socialism just do not work, not because they arent great ideas but because they do not take into and can not take into account basic human nature. doesnt work doesnt work doesnt work. Whats more it HAS not worked. People work best when they know that they can achieve more by working harder than someone else, anytime you attempt to redistribute wealth forcibly, or put every one on a level field no matter how diligent or lazy you take away that which drives people to excell. We are incentive driven beings. HUMAN NATURE ya gots to deal with it, like it or not.

[Yorick]

quote:

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Originally posted by MagiK:


The only way Communism OR Socialism will ever work on this planet is if you change the nature of human kind, which ain't gonna happen till we become a race of clones who all think alike and give the same values to everything that every one else does. Communism and Socialism just do not work, not because they arent great ideas but because they do not take into and can not take into account basic human nature. doesnt work doesnt work doesnt work. Whats more it HAS not worked. People work best when they know that they can achieve more by working harder than someone else, anytime you attempt to redistribute wealth forcibly, or put every one on a level field no matter how diligent or lazy you take away that which drives people to excell. We are incentive driven beings. HUMAN NATURE ya gots to deal with it, like it or not.

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Noooooo! Take it to another thread!

[Gabriel]

quote:

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Originally posted by MagiK:


The only way Communism OR Socialism will ever work on this planet is if you change the nature of human kind, which ain't gonna happen till we become a race of clones who all think alike and give the same values to everything that every one else does. Communism and Socialism just do not work, not because they arent great ideas but because they do not take into and can not take into account basic human nature. doesnt work doesnt work doesnt work. Whats more it HAS not worked. People work best when they know that they can achieve more by working harder than someone else, anytime you attempt to redistribute wealth forcibly, or put every one on a level field no matter how diligent or lazy you take away that which drives people to excell. We are incentive driven beings. HUMAN NATURE ya gots to deal with it, like it or not.

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Right my thread so on this tanggent I like to say, no governmental system has ever worked up to it proposed Ideals (Freedom in Democracy, Equally in Communism, absolute rule in dictatorship (most others are these under different names)) BUT just because a nation has embraced Communist doesn't mean it is doomed to fail, the major example is China with its communist government. They are also beyond a dough a powerful nation in both might and political areas, even if they have some questionable acts but hey what nation doesn't.