New patch + Improved Invis + Rogues - ?? - Page 2

Nightowl2 · 11-14-2002, 12:38 AM

Ummm...extra feats the wizard gets? WHAT extra feats? The only class that gets extra feats that I know of is the fighter. Everyone else gets the standard number. Or do you mean there are feats a wizard can take but a sorcerer can't? I haven't noticed any myself.

1st ed....AD&D has come pretty far from that system of too-limited rules. But I think they went too far the other way with 3rd (the real rules not IWD2).

Jack...I've just never needed ORS. That's all there is to it.

Nightowl2

Gimli · 11-14-2002, 07:51 AM

Wizards also get extra feats, that is one reason I like them. They get one at 1st, then at 5th/10th/15th/20th/25th/30th. It's true, make one and you'll notice he has one more feat than he should at 1st level - and gets one every 5th level from there on out. In a normal mode game, if he finishes at say 16th, that's 4 more feats than a Sorcerer, or 2 more SF/GSFs, which isn't too shabby. I don't know that it says it in the manual, but they get them!

Gimli · 11-14-2002, 07:54 AM

Think NWN, where the Wizard got access to extra "metamagic" feats every 5 levels. Well in IWD II, they just get extra feats every 5 levels (and at 1st), and there's no restriction though in terms of which ones they can choose, they don't have to be magic-oriented.

Gimli · 11-14-2002, 07:57 AM

Hmm, well in some cases less is better in terms of rules and PnP gaming. It would be weird for me to play a PnP game where a party leader's effectiveness in that role is governed by checks against skills like Bluff, Diplomacy and Intimidate - rather than by purely how the person roleplays the character himself. I'd hate to think that in a game someone says "I use my bluff skill here to talk my way around this situation", rather than actually roleplaying it and coming up with some type of real dialogue the DM has to judge.

Still I do like the 3rd edition rules in general, for CPRGs they make party creation and development much richer and more fun.

Nightowl2 · 11-14-2002, 12:51 PM

Hmmm. I didn't notice that about wizards the one time I had one in the party. Then again, that was my first party and it was awhile back (like September!). Must look into this and see for myself.

Even if it turns out to be so, I still prefer sorcerers for ease of spell acquisition.

And it's not strictly 3rd ed, because only fighters are allowed the extra feats. Then again, there's much in this game that isn't strictly 3rd ed

Nightowl2

SpiritWarrior · 11-18-2002, 03:57 PM

Hehe sorry for delay Gimli - problems with reinstalling the game and mental computers.
Anyways I tried it. Cast Improved Invisibility on my Rogue and sent her in against a A) a Yuan Ti and B) an Orog at different times. As I predicted the first attack was a sneak attack but the rest were not.The rest of these attacks were frontal and caused normal damage yielding no sneak bonus. Im sure the combat bonus from being invisible was still there although the Yuan Ti was using Blind Sight quite a bit so I think even that was countered.

Gimli · 11-18-2002, 04:22 PM

Oh well - I still am having fun with my rogue =0)

11-14-2002, 07:51 AM	#12
Gimli Emerald Dragon Join Date: January 12, 2002 Location: Moria Posts: 912	Wizards also get extra feats, that is one reason I like them. They get one at 1st, then at 5th/10th/15th/20th/25th/30th. It's true, make one and you'll notice he has one more feat than he should at 1st level - and gets one every 5th level from there on out. In a normal mode game, if he finishes at say 16th, that's 4 more feats than a Sorcerer, or 2 more SF/GSFs, which isn't too shabby. I don't know that it says it in the manual, but they get them! __________________ There\'s one dwarf left in Moria that still draws breath!

11-14-2002, 07:54 AM	#13
Gimli Emerald Dragon Join Date: January 12, 2002 Location: Moria Posts: 912	Think NWN, where the Wizard got access to extra "metamagic" feats every 5 levels. Well in IWD II, they just get extra feats every 5 levels (and at 1st), and there's no restriction though in terms of which ones they can choose, they don't have to be magic-oriented. __________________ There\'s one dwarf left in Moria that still draws breath!

11-14-2002, 07:57 AM	#14
Gimli Emerald Dragon Join Date: January 12, 2002 Location: Moria Posts: 912	Hmm, well in some cases less is better in terms of rules and PnP gaming. It would be weird for me to play a PnP game where a party leader's effectiveness in that role is governed by checks against skills like Bluff, Diplomacy and Intimidate - rather than by purely how the person roleplays the character himself. I'd hate to think that in a game someone says "I use my bluff skill here to talk my way around this situation", rather than actually roleplaying it and coming up with some type of real dialogue the DM has to judge. Still I do like the 3rd edition rules in general, for CPRGs they make party creation and development much richer and more fun. __________________ There\'s one dwarf left in Moria that still draws breath!

11-18-2002, 03:57 PM	#16
SpiritWarrior Jack Burton Join Date: May 31, 2002 Location: Ireland Posts: 5,854	Hehe sorry for delay Gimli - problems with reinstalling the game and mental computers. Anyways I tried it. Cast Improved Invisibility on my Rogue and sent her in against a A) a Yuan Ti and B) an Orog at different times. As I predicted the first attack was a sneak attack but the rest were not.The rest of these attacks were frontal and caused normal damage yielding no sneak bonus. Im sure the combat bonus from being invisible was still there although the Yuan Ti was using Blind Sight quite a bit so I think even that was countered. __________________ Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...

11-18-2002, 04:22 PM	#17
Gimli Emerald Dragon Join Date: January 12, 2002 Location: Moria Posts: 912	Oh well - I still am having fun with my rogue =0) __________________ There\'s one dwarf left in Moria that still draws breath!

11-14-2002, 12:38 AM	#11
Nightowl2 Galvatron Join Date: December 11, 2001 Location: Plateau of Leng Age: 46 Posts: 2,190	Ummm...extra feats the wizard gets? WHAT extra feats? The only class that gets extra feats that I know of is the fighter. Everyone else gets the standard number. Or do you mean there are feats a wizard can take but a sorcerer can't? I haven't noticed any myself. 1st ed....AD&D has come pretty far from that system of too-limited rules. But I think they went too far the other way with 3rd (the real rules not IWD2). Jack...I've just never needed ORS. That's all there is to it. Nightowl2

11-14-2002, 12:51 PM	#15
Nightowl2 Galvatron Join Date: December 11, 2001 Location: Plateau of Leng Age: 46 Posts: 2,190	Hmmm. I didn't notice that about wizards the one time I had one in the party. Then again, that was my first party and it was awhile back (like September!). Must look into this and see for myself. Even if it turns out to be so, I still prefer sorcerers for ease of spell acquisition. And it's not strictly 3rd ed, because only fighters are allowed the extra feats. Then again, there's much in this game that isn't strictly 3rd ed Nightowl2

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