It's CHRISTMAS people, not XMAS...

[Timber Loftis]

Originally posted by Melusine: The X is the visual representation of the Greek letter Chi. Chi Ro are the first two letters of Christ's name in Greek. You come across them a lot in medieval manuscripts.

Wow, I never knew. Thanks so much - now that I learned something today, can I go home?

I agree that, given our current language and how that "X" gets interpreted, in semi-formal and formal communications, "Christmas" should be used. This would apply to Christmas cards, as well as decorations on your house (I personally wouldn't use any decorations with words anyway, but that's just me).

But, I'm over any offense I may have once found at the lazy vernacular "Xmas" when used casually - like in these forums or in emails. If you are so worried about putting Christ back in Christmas, start by boycotting malls this season. Christ is very hard to find in Christmas anymore. Hell, according to the Supreme Court, the State can't even display a nativity scene unless it also includes non-religious Christmas icons, such as Santa and his friendly reindeer. The S.Court did this to avoid having the State "establish" a religion, but I think it unwittingly legislated the required use of false idols. Oh well, I'm beginning to ramble now.

[Cloudbringer]

Good points, Sarah and Paris, but as you can see, not many people KNOW that esoteric bit of information! That's one reason I don't like the use of Xmas. I think it has become a 'quickie' way to type out the word, rather than symbolic of older days and Greek letters.

edit: Nice post , Timber!

Seriously, I don't think the vast majority of people attribute the orginal meanings to that 'X' anymore and it's for that reason I don't like to use it. If it WERE a widly recognized symbolic representation I doubt it would bother me at all.

And FWIW, I already knew about the use of the Greek but since I'd never once run into someone who used that abbreviation and also knew it before Saz and Mel, I'd never have assumed it was in general use from the early days or for that reason! LOL I honestly think it is used in today's world as a quickie abbreviation, like FWIW. THAT is what I meant about putting Christ back in Christmas, btw. Although, TL is right, it's getting crazy with all the politics involved. A local library here was forced to take a tree out of the lobby as it might make people think they were forcing a particular religion on everyone....uh..they also had hanukah decorations, but those got to stay!

[ 11-21-2002, 11:18 AM: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

[Sazerac]

Well, FWIW, Cloudy, I rarely ever use the abbreviated form except for packages. But I have far more important things to worry about than whether people choose to use XMAS or not. Put simply: when people stop using LOL, IMHO, and ROTFL, I'll say "nix" to XMAS.

Cheers,
-Sazerac

[Melusine]

Originally posted by Sazerac: Well, FWIW, Cloudy, I rarely ever use the abbreviated form except for packages. But I have far more important things to worry about than whether people choose to use XMAS or not. Put simply: when people stop using LOL, IMHO, and ROTFL, I'll say "nix" to XMAS. Cheers, -Sazerac

Ditto, LOL! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
FWIW, I don't use the abbreviation either but since at least three people here immediately knew what the X stood for, and some Christians did not, I wouldn't judge about other people's knowledge too quickly when they DO use it.

[adam warlock]

it's easier for me to type the short version.

[Moiraine]

Mélusine, maybe you can tell me why we French call it a totally different word : "Noël" ? [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Cloudbringer]

Originally posted by Melusine: quote: Originally posted by Sazerac: Well, FWIW, Cloudy, I rarely ever use the abbreviated form except for packages. But I have far more important things to worry about than whether people choose to use XMAS or not. Put simply: when people stop using LOL, IMHO, and ROTFL, I'll say "nix" to XMAS. Cheers, -Sazerac

Ditto, LOL! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
FWIW, I don't use the abbreviation either but since at least three people here immediately knew what the X stood for, and some Christians did not, I wouldn't judge about other people's knowledge too quickly when they DO use it.[/QUOTE]LOL, see my edit

[Melusine]

Originally posted by Moiraine: Mélusine, maybe you can tell me why we French call it a totally different word : "Noël" ? [img]smile.gif[/img]

I'm not sure Claude... I always thought it was derived from Latin "natalis", as in Dies Natalis. So the name directly refers to Christ's birth (nativity). But apparently this isn't completely waterproof... some people think that the word has either a Judaic or a Scandinavian/Germanic origin, IIRC.
I still think it's probably linked to natalis though.

Edit: about the attitude towards Christmas in the USA I hear some people about, that's pretty awful. Why shouldn't people be allowed to make Christmas decorations that they like, even if they have religious significance??
Holland is far less concerned with religion than America, I guess, but I think most people here would find it completely insane if institutions such as libraries or other public buildings couldn't put up trees or nativity scenes. Especially about the tree, that is so ridiculous! It doesn't even HAVE a Christian origin so how could that possibly offend non-Christians??
We used to have a wonderful nativity scene in my old village, with real animals. No one would even *think* about saying that is irreverent towards other religions. Weird.

[ 11-21-2002, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: Melusine ]

[Cloudbringer]

Russians refer to it as "The day of the Birth" (rough translation) which is similar in meaning to your Noel, Moiraine.

[johnny]

Originally posted by MagiK: Binks dude! some people dont like to use the word Christ and others are just lazy [img]smile.gif[/img]

That's me, lazy is my middle name... nice to meet you.