The Silmarillion (and the four other stories in the same book)

[dplax]

Before anyone points out that there have been earlier topics about this I'll say that I did a search and all of those topics were ancient.

I just finished rereading the Silmarillion for the fourth or fifth time and I was amazed again at all the amount of detail and thought Tolkien had to put into it. No wonder he did not manage to finish the book in his lifetime. While I don't agree with all the ways in which Christopher Tolkien manages his father's literary heritage publishing the Silmarillion was definately the right thing to do.

Browsing through the old threads I found quite a few interesting discussions about certain parts of the books. Some people compared Silmarillion to the Bible or the Old Testament and while I don't want to go into discussions about religion because of the ban, I don't totally agree with this. Maybe the Ainulindalë and the Valaquenta refer to the creation of the world, but the other parts of the book (Quenta Silmarillion, Akallabêth and Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age) are a story, not mythological stuff (IMO).

Another interesting discussion in the older threads, which wasn't resolved, was about who was Morgoth's greatest servant. It is said clearly several times in Quenta Silmarillion that Sauron was the most powerful of the Maiar, yet valid points can also be made for Gothmog, Glaurung and Carcharoth once he consumed the Silmaril.

My favourite part of the whole book is either the story of Beren and Lùthien or the story of Tùrin Turambar. It is hard (for me) to make a choice between the two as both are heroic and sad and any story writer could be proud if he made a comparable story.

Well I think I made quite a few discussable points there, but someone feels that something else would be worth discussing don't hesitate.

[Thoran]

I think Sauron was the most powerful of Morgoth's minions (might have said that last time too [img]smile.gif[/img] . Glaurung and Carcharoth were "Individual Contributors", powerful but only as a single entity.

Now I've only read the Silmarillion a couple times, but I seem to recall that Gothmog was the Balrog who led Morgoth's armies... he's a closer match to Sauron but he still operated under Morgoth's close supervision. Sauron on the other hand had his own forces, lands that he controlled (Minas Tirith after kicking the Elves out), and his own minions that did his bidding. I think between those two you might have an argument, Gothmog probably the more powerful personally (after all, Huan handed Sauron his butt in single combat, I doubt he could have done that to Gothmog) but Sauron the more powerful leader.

[ 01-05-2005, 04:32 PM: Message edited by: Thoran ]

[dplax]

When I said Carcharoth I meant after he consumed the Silmaril. Although then he was out of control and did not serve any master, but a power comparison would still be interesting with the others.

[Sir Degrader]

I'd have to say Sauron, he lasted the longest, he survived. In terms of evolution, he is the best.

[Thoran]

I don't recall Carcharoth becoming "more powerful" after eating the Silmaril... just that he went insane (but I could be forgetting, it's been a while since I read the book).

Overall I think it's too bad the Silmarillion never got finished, I think it would have been even better than LotR (and would probably have taken decades to write).

[Larry_OHF]

My favourite part of the whole book is either the story of Beren and Lùthien or the story of Tùrin Turambar. It is hard (for me) to make a choice between the two as both are heroic and sad and any story writer could be proud if he made a comparable story.

<font color=skyblue>I am in full agreement here.

I would beg on my hands and knees for somebody to do a movie about either one of them.</font>

[ 01-06-2005, 11:32 AM: Message edited by: Larry_OHF ]

[dplax]

Or while we're at it a tv series of the Silmarillion would also be cool.

[Variol (Farseer) Elmwood]

I've never read the entire thing. As much as I like LotR, I just got bored. I know it gets better later so I may pick it up again.

[ 01-08-2005, 07:44 AM: Message edited by: Variol (Farseer) Elmwood ]

[dplax]

If you don't like the two beginning stories (Ainulindäle and Valaquenta) then just jump to Quenta Silmarillion. It has much more action in it that the other stories.

[Blunderbuss]

I loved that book! It's been a couple of years since I read it. But the detail and the style in which it was written is absorbing. I've recently bought Unfinished Tales and can't wait to getting round to reading it. I think my favourite story was the one of Turin. I thought at the end when he spoke to his sword, asking to kill him swiftly was so imaginative. It wouldn't work for any other author but for Tolkien it works brilliantly. As you can see from my sig. and forum name, I'm somewhat of a Tolkien fan.