Kensai/Thief legitimate dual or cheese?

[hiredgun1]

I understand you can start with a Kensai (and get all the bonuses) dual to a thief and then when thief gets special skill (use any item) the kensai keeps bonuses and can now use armor, ranged weapons, etc. Do you think this is a cheese tactic or legitimate. If legit, when should you dual kensai to thief?

[Gwayne]

I'm not to familiar with dualing characters,but I dont think it's cheesey
you just have a change of professions

[hazard]

I think its cheese. The kensai class was not intended to wear armour. You can do this even without the 'Use Any Item' ability, which is just ultra cheese. That is just my opinion though. It is written into the game so technically its a legitimate part of it.

[Northraven]

This makes a powerful character yes, but not invincible and not perfect at everything...if you dual to a thief from a Kensai you no longer get quite the THACO that a pure fighter continuing to advance in lvls would plus you still need to find a competent spell slinger to tag along with you...all-in-all a mighty combination though. I would say best time to dual to thief is around lvls 9-12, depending on personal taste.

[This message has been edited by Northraven (edited 07-14-2001).]

[ScottG]

Hazzard.

How can a Kensai/thief wear armor, even w/out the use any item ability?

IMO it makes a bit more logic to go pure fighter and dual to a subclass theif (which can be done by using shadowkeeper - while only a fighter set the subclass to the one you want, when you change to a thief you will be setup w/ your subclass).

[TheDutkanator]

NOT CHEESE!! You are completely changing your profession as mentioned earlier. You just retain the knowledge and former exp. of the Kensai. So, Hazard, you think that if a Mage dualled to a Fighter that he should not be able to use swords or wear helmets? If you answer "no" to that, then you should re-evaluate your former statement.

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Let's get'em guen!

"I'm sorry, did I kill you?" -TheDutkanator

[This message has been edited by TheDutkanator (edited 07-15-2001).]

[ScottG]

Mage class doesn't really follow the same limitations. (Though it should have - see below.)

Clerics - are not allowed to use edged wepons at all.
Druids - also have many limitations.
(These are however ethos limitations.)

However:

All of the learning accumulated while a Kensai was without the use of armor. It simply isn't logical to say that specific abilities earned in another class will automatically be applicable in this class. (If you learned to wield a sword w/ out armor you will not wield it w/ anywhere near the degree of skill with armor on.) Logically (if the programers had included it) it would be OK (since it is skill related and not ethos) to say that the Kensai/Thief could where armor but that when they do all of the skills and bonuses of the Kensai would become inactive (similar to a Mage/Thief where you can't cast spells while armored).

I would think it was OK if the armor you were wearing was magic and acted as if there was no armor on the wearer (but bladesinger armor doesn't even have this property) - however w/ this line of reasoning it doesn't make sense that a Kensai can't wear bracers (unless those bracers are so physically obtrusive that they hinder movement - which is doubtfull w/ the magic bracers).