PMS -- (tongue in cheek of course)

Originally posted by kiwidoc: I am sorry if I seemed ot object to the jokes. I don't - humour is a wpnderful thing. I just got a bit worried about things that implied that having PMS is your own fault and makes you an inferior person. Hell I have had atrociuos PMS with my Cluster Headaches and there is NOTHING inferior about me Not even my sense of modesty which is amazing

*Ahem*
PMS is caused by being a physically mature female.

A woman's cycle cannot be helped and I did not mean for my words to imply that it could.
Its symptoms, however, can be relieved if not alleviated completely.
That was my point in posting to begin with.

Now, I just don't see where you can sit and coddle others over things that can be helped (like depression) with proper treatment. You're a professional aren't you?

Kiwidoc, I can appreciate that your profession requires people to remain mentally unstable but honestly, if there are no extenuating circumstances (i.e. painful or terminal medical conditions), is it really necessary for people to hold on to all the bad stuff that made them cry to begin with and carry it with them throughout their lives as a reason to remain miserable?

These things can be elimated from our psyches, we just have to be willing to let go and make a change for the better. Before you know it, you have to wonder why you remained so sad for so long. It is a waste of precious time.

And I'll stick by my words that a proper diet is one stepping stone towards reaching a goal of physical and mental healthiness. That is proven medical fact. Don't expect any progress if you are not going to fuel your bodies with what it requires.

Depressed people should never give up hope and think that they will remain that way for the rest of their lives...it just isn't true.

Moni

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[Reeka]

Moni,

Not being hostile here at all, but just as people with other kinds of illness do not respond well to treatment, some people with depression do not respons very well to treament. And it is not just regular sadness and crying either, it is far more than that. It is also just not getting your psyche in order. Most doctors there day believe in a three-pronged approach to major depressiong, three factors that go into an episode: biology, the physical and chemical components in the brain; past experience and trauma; current circumstances and stresses.

Moni, I cannot stress to you enough that is not normal saddness. I have worked and continue to work very hard to let go of things. And I have great hope that I will never have another episode.

I am not getting on to anybody. Just trying to explain what depression is

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O_H_F

[kiwidoc]

Moni - please do not insult my profession. I do not keep people mentally ill, in fact I would dearly love to become obsolete. I literally put my life on the line every day I go to work in order to help people. I have been battered unconscious but I go back beacuse I CAN help.

A huge amount of research has shown there are vast numbers of people with illnesses of thought processes and mood that cannot be helped by dietary treatment, nor by talking therapies alone. This is accepted medical fact by every reputable group of health related professionals in the world.

Yes a lot of people can be helped by these measures but a lot simply cannot.
My point was that these people should not be made to feel like it is their fault or that they are inferior by you , by me or by anyone.

Sadly there ARE people who remain Depressed for all of thier lives. This is not because they refuse to give up their sadness - it is beacuse they are ill. If you cannot accept that then I am sorry but we will have to agree to disagree.

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There is only one kiwidoc, accept no substitutes

STANDARD OPERATING PROCEEDURE
www.judyhope.co.uk

I grew up severly depressed.
I was severly depressed from the earliest days I can rmemeber until I was 24 years old.
I know what it is like to wake up every day and pray that you'll be dead before the sun sets. I know what it is like to stand behind a gun and picture yourself taking out all the people who work to make you miserable.
Being depressed was the fault of my reactions to my violent upbringing.
Remaining that way after I reached adulthood and left home was my own. There is no place to put blame on others.
The simple act of forgiveness can mean everything.
I am not the only person in the world who has come back out of the pit to actually enjoy facing daily life and participating with the rest of the world.
Scientific fact is that depression is an imbalance of chemicals in our brains.
This chemical imbalance can manifest into physical symptoms i.e. waves of dull pain coursing through your bones and ulcers to name a couple. I have experienced them.
Chemical medications aren't the answer. They may alleviate the symptoms and make everything seem better but they can cause adverse reactions and don't allow a brain to produce the right chemicals naturally. A person with positive effects from the drugs more than likely, will be taking them for the rest of their life.
A good diet and a better perspective on things is a positive start to putting an end to it.
It takes time and practice not to look at things from a negative point of view.
I believe enough in people to think that if I can do it, anyone can.

If someone is going to or has to keep themselves in an environment where there is constant negativity I can see how they could never be cured.
Kiwidoc,
I appreciate people in your profession who are there to honestly help people get on their way in life. I do think though that if people were educated to the facts about what is involved in being a human (in an animalistic aspect) then they would find life easier to understand and to cope with.

I never said people who suffer are inferior to people who don't. If anyone thinks it was implied, they were mistaken.

I feel good, I am good.


Moni

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[kiwidoc]

Moni - I am sorry you have had so much deep, deep sadness in your life and I admire you for dealing with it so well. However that is not the same thing as Severe Depression.

Severe Depression is when you dont wake up because you cannot sleep. If you do sleep you are plagued by severe nightmares and wake hours before you need to and lie there looking at the roof. You dont even have the energy to consider suicide, and besides you don't deserve to die. Maybe you can smell the stench of your own rotting flesh that is going to infect the world with disease and kill thousands. Sometimes you can hear them whispering about you in the street as you pass by.

You cannot eat and you are steadily starving yourself to death. You contemplate killing children because the world is such an awful place it would be kinder - but thankfully you have no energy to carry out your plans. You are far more likey to feel numb than upset, but you have completely lost the ability to laugh. You have absolutely no sex drive at all, and you don't even care that it has gone.

Your body's daily rhythms no longer function, all your hormones are abnormal. You cannot respond to stress - you just feel flat.

I am very, very sad to say that this is how life is for tens of thousands of people who dont get the help they need because of the stigma of mental illness. Currently medication is the ONLY thing that has been shown to help these people. They genuinely cannot help themsleves. I truly wish we had better treatment, be we do save lives with what we have. Severe Depression is a fatal disorder - it kills people.

[bilqis]

Moni, you are very fortunate that all of those things worked for you.. that you found something that works for you. Please don't make the mistake of thinking that because something worked for you, that it will work for everyone. We are all different. We all have subtle differences in our chemistry and psyche due to many factors -- genetics, environment, diet -- we will not all react the same way to the same set of factors. So what does work for you may not work for another.

Kiwidoc is right when she said:

Originally posted by kiwidoc: A huge amount of research has shown there are vast numbers of people with illnesses of thought processes and mood that cannot be helped by dietary treatment, nor by talking therapies alone. This is accepted medical fact by every reputable group of health related professionals in the world. Yes a lot of people can be helped by these measures but a lot simply cannot. My point was that these people should not be made to feel like it is their fault or that they are inferior by you , by me or by anyone. Sadly there ARE people who remain Depressed for all of thier lives. This is not because they refuse to give up their sadness - it is beacuse they are ill. If you cannot accept that then I am sorry but we will have to agree to disagree.

I worked on a psych ward for several years, dealing with people with all kinds of illnesses, but most prevelent was depression. People suffering depression are often truly immobilized by it. They simply can not do any of the things that worked for you. They need more help than a change of diet or attitude could maybe give them. They deserve compassion and support. There is still so much stigma against depression, people making the depressed feel responsible for their illness, that many people are not seeking help when they should. Why live in misery when one can be helped? That help can come in different forms -- diet, pills, therapy, or combinations of each -- but it's important that each person find the combo that works for them!

The same can be said for PMS. It can truly make someone lose control. Diet change may help, but really, all that I said above about depression also applies to PMS.

Feel like I'm beating a dead horse here... I just am disturbed to see judgemental comments being made about something that is very different, very real and difficult to live with for so many people. Especially when I hoped this thread would be FUN and FUNNY.

I apologize to all for opening this can of worms.

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Having abandoned my
search for truth, I am
now looking for a good
fantasy.

[This message has been edited by bilqis (edited 06-20-2001).]

[Larry_OHF]

Being married only two years, I used to KNOW when the time came, and take evasive precautions.

Now, after the baby, neither one of us knows when the cycle begins. It comes so calmly and quitely, that she is surprised by it.
Her cycle is off because of the DEPO shot, which (next to abstenance) is the best thing to prevent another pregnancy.
She may have that time come once every two to three months, and they are gentle, as she puts it.
Amazing stuff! That DEPO shot...

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Loyal guardian of the OHF
Devoted member of the Ironworks
Only member of the Elite Bodyguard to Rikard (the fool that takes the bullet)
Ertai's back-up
Memnoch's chief look-out
Member of the Ancients club
Witness of the 4,000th post by Cloudposter

[This message has been edited by Larry_OHF (edited 06-20-2001).]

[kiwidoc]

kiwidoc races onto the thread and sweeps bilqis off his feet in a huge hug. Honey the jokes you posted WERE funny, you were non judgemntal and gentle. We still love you


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There is only one kiwidoc, accept no substitutes

STANDARD OPERATING PROCEEDURE
www.judyhope.co.uk

[Larry_OHF]

I just went and told Karen about some of the stuff you all were saying here, and she wanted me to mention that in the newspaper one day she read a statistic report that 92% of the women in prison that killed somebody did it during their PMS moments.
Are any of you surprised at that?
Sounds logical to me.

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Loyal guardian of the OHF
Devoted member of the Ironworks
Only member of the Elite Bodyguard to Rikard (the fool that takes the bullet)
Ertai's back-up
Memnoch's chief look-out
Member of the Ancients club
Witness of the 4,000th post by Cloudposter

[bilqis]

Originally posted by kiwidoc: kiwidoc races onto the thread and sweeps bilqis off his feet in a huge hug. Honey the jokes you posted WERE funny, you were non judgemntal and gentle. We still love you

errrrr.. thanks Kiwidoc doll, but... errr.. I'm a WOMAN.

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Having abandoned my
search for truth, I am
now looking for a good
fantasy.