Rogues versus priests?

[ArmageddonX]

Lets say you have the normal party of, warrior, warrior, wizard, wizard, priest, rogue. I think thats the normal one. Well I recently wanted all wizards and was yelled at for not having a rogue since they are supposedly DEATHLY important. IMHO, rogues are sloppy fighters that can't use much armor and are without spells (Until of course you guild em). The reason they are so important is for their ability to open chests, a required ability. With my five wizards and one rogue, all my rogue ever does is open chests and it's gotten way too easy for him.

I was thinking, what about a priest? Sure it takes a while to get pry and disarm trap but none of the REQUIRED chests exist in very early game... AND they can wear armor. I also think they are just as powerful of fighters as rogues, though I could be mistaken. The main reason I want a priest rather than a rogue is because of thier spells like spirit eye, healing, ressurect, haste, and dispell undead. All very useful.

So with a party of five wizards, which would be most useful, a priest or a rogue?

[Wyvern]

The priest

But - why not consider starting with 4 wizards, 1 priest and 1 rogue and switch your rogue to barbarian after he's become fairly accomplished - or switch him to a warlock. Having a rogue at the beginning of the game is useful because of the chests which help raise money. Later in the game, you have spells to open chests and if you continued to train the previously rogue character in picklock - he/she can still do that too.

Wyv
My rogue is both a good fighter and a good magic user at this point - course she has changed class a number of times to get there.

[ArmageddonX]

That sounds like... an idea... the problem is my five wizards kill everything before it reaches me. I'm on the hardest difficulty with often as the moster spawn setting and the game is still EASY. I kinda like that. So in other words, why would I need a fighter of any sort?

Also, though there may be a small delay in opening those chests, on the difficulty settings I'm on, I'll turn level three in no time allowing me to open those chests.

Hmm... guilds... I might wanna start to learn about that.

My rogue is now my absolute best fighter! As an Assassin, he has more HP than even the Paladin, who's certainly got a lot. BTW, I prefer my parties (when I do a full sixer) to be War/War/War/Rog/Pr/Wiz, which is the order I sort them in on the right side bar thing. Though the Wiz starts out *very* powerful, and ends up *very* powerful, in the extreme bulk of the game, i.e. every dungeon besides the first and the last, the real work is done by the Warriors.

Oh, note: one of the very first chests contains the Bauble Stick, which is certainly a "required" item.

One other thing: as fighters, Priests suck worse than Wizards until you make them Monks. What you have a Priest for is heal/raise dead/spirit eye (which *is* quite useful IMO) and whatever Vine Spells you can get your hands on, esp. Cure Poison. Dispel Undead is all but worthless; it might take out a skeleton if it's lucky. Also, the spell Disarm Trap only works on like 2 or maybe 3-star chests, which can easily be done with only a moderately skilled Rogue. And for the 4 & 5 star ones, the Rogue is absolutely essential.

[ArmageddonX]

Gauleiter, you certainly like warriors... I may have to post a new message with that as the question...

So your saying I need a priest eventually converted to monk that focuses on spirit spells...

Oh, and by the time I'm in the crypt and needing to pick the lock for the bauble stick I'm 3rd level on the difficulty setting I'm on.

It says you must have a high level of sorcery to open chests with success. Are you sure your priest has all that much sorcery?

I have also seen that a moderately skilled rogue can open chests with ease, thats why I though it would be more challenging for a priest but still fully possible.

BTW, I'm finished with power-gaming, I know most of all I need to know about the basic game. I'll either have wr/wr/wr/wz/pr/ro similar to you or wr/wz/wz/wz/pr/ro determining on what outcome the next post has (or something in the middle).

There's really no need for a rogue - you can change a warrior to a barbarian before the rest of the party even leaves the inn, and they have lockpick. Also there's no need to have six in the party - it's just more expensive to train them all. My first party had 4, and my current party is only 2. My party of 2 is ridiculously more powerful than the previous 4, since I train them and ascend roles early and often.
Gold is the measure of power in this game, so spend everything on training and you'll have a powerful party.

I, along with a small but vocal group, have been complaining for a while now that there is far too much focus on gold in this game.

Cygoth's right: the more gold you have, the more you can train and the stronger you are. Of course you can also buy expensive and powerful items with gold, but greater power is gained by spending it in the guilds on training and class changes.

Experience actually takes second place here, for, with gold, training in guilds is much faster than training out in the world. This is different than most (all?) other RPGs, where experience is the deciding factor, i.e. the more you play the stronger you are -- which, although certainly not an inaccurate description of W&W, doesn't take into account the enormous power gold has.

BTW, I actually change my Rogue to Barbarian first thing, along with a Warrior if I've got the cash. Makes no difference, you've just gotta have *someone* with lockpicking skills, and pickpocket sure speeds the game up.

BTW, ArmageddonX, Sorcery does two things that I know of:

1) Speeds up casting time
2) Increases the spell potency

So, yes, a high level of sorcery would make Disarm Trap more effective. However, my Zenmaster, who was Lvl 12 in Sorcery (which, incidentally, is the only skill that can't be trained in at guilds), still had zero success in disarming the 5-star Monk's Ward chest on Isle of Sands.