Visit the Ironworks Gaming Website Email the Webmaster Graphics Library Rules and Regulations Help Support Ironworks Forum with a Donation to Keep us Online - We rely totally on Donations from members Donation goal Meter

Ironworks Gaming Radio

Ironworks Gaming Forum

Go Back   Ironworks Gaming Forum > Ironworks Gaming Forums > General Discussion
FAQ Calendar Arcade Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-17-2004, 07:32 AM   #1
InjaYew
Zhentarim Guard
 

Join Date: December 31, 2003
Location: SE Tornado Belt
Age: 63
Posts: 341
February 11, 2004 (67th anniversary of the Great Flint Sit-Down Strike)
An Open Letter from Michael Moore to George "I'm a War President!" Bush


Dear Mr. Bush,

Thank you for providing the illegible Xeroxed partial payroll sheets (or whatever they were) yesterday covering a few of your days in the National Guard. Now we know that, not only didn't you complete your tour of duty, you were actually paid for work you never did. Did you cash those checks? Wouldn't that be, um, illegal?

Watching the press aggressively demand the truth from your press secretary -- and refusing to accept the deceit, the dodging, and the cover-up -- was a sight to behold, something we really haven't seen since you took office (to watch or listen to the entire press conference, or to read the full transcript, go here).

More than one reporter pointed out that those pieces of paper your press secretary waved at them yesterday mean nothing. Even if they aren't forged documents, getting paid does not necessarily mean you showed up to do your duties. As retired Army Col. Dan Smith, a 26-year veteran, told the AP:

"Pay records don't mean anything except that you're in or you're out," said Smith. "It doesn't necessarily reflect what duty you've actually performed because pay records simply record your unit of assignment and then all of your pay and benefits per pay period."

Mr. Bush, this issue is not going to go away -- and I think yesterday's actions just dug you into a deeper hole. You're probably wondering why the heck this story won't just die. You probably thought that after I brought it up last month and then got slammed by Peter Jennings for uttering the "d" word, the whole matter would just disappear as fast as a bag of blow being thrown out the window of a speeding car on a deserted Maine highway.

But your "desertion" didn't go away -- and here's the reason why. You have sent countless numbers of our sons and daughters in the National Guard to their deaths in the last 11 months. You did this while misleading their parents and the nation with bogus lies about weapons of mass destruction and scary phony Saddam ties to al Qaeda. You sent them off to a never-ending war so that your benefactors at Halliburton and the oil companies could line their pockets. And then you had the audacity to prance around in a soldier's uniform on an aircraft carrier proclaiming "Mission Accomplished" -- while the cameras from your re-election campaign ad agency rolled.

THAT is what makes this whole business of your being AWOL so despicable, and makes the grief-stricken relatives want to turn away from you in disgust. The reason your skipping-out on your enlistment didn't matter in the 2000 election was because we were not at war. Being stuck in a deadly, daily quagmire now in 2004 makes your military history-fiction and your fly-boy costume VERY relevant.

You still have not answered the questions surrounding your National Guard "service." Let me repeat them as simply as I can for you (all of them based on the investigative work of the Associated Press and the Boston Globe):

1. How were you able to jump ahead of 500 other applicants to get into the Texas Air National Guard, thus guaranteeing you would not have to go to Vietnam? What calls did your father (who was then a United States Congressman representing Texas) make on your behalf for you to get this assignment?

2. Why were you grounded (not allowed to fly) after you either failed your physical or failed to take it in July 1972? Was there a reason you were afraid to take the physical? Or, did you take it and not pass it? If so, why didn't you pass it? Was it the urine test? The records show that, after the Guard spent years and lots of money training you to be a pilot, you never flew for the rest of your time in the Guard. Why?

3. Can you produce one person who can verify that he served with you in the Guard during the year that your Texas commanders said you did not show up? Why have you failed to bring forth anyone who served with you in the Guard while you were in Alabama? Why hasn't ONE SINGLE PERSON come forward?

4. Can you tell us what you did when you claim to have shown up in Alabama for Guard duty? What were your duties? You were grounded, so what did they have you do instead?

5. Where are the sign-up sheets that would have your name and service number on them for each weekend you showed up? Aaron Brown on CNN told us how, when he was in the reserves, he had to sign in each time he reported, and his guest from the Washington Post said, that's right, and there would be "four copies of that record" in the files of various agencies. Will you ask those agencies to release those records?

6. If you were in fact paid for that time when you apparently went AWOL, will you authorize the IRS to release your 1972-73 tax returns?

7. How did you get an honorable discharge? What strings were pulled? Who called who?

Look, I'm sorry to have put you through all this. I was just goofing around when I made that comment about wanting to see a debate between the general and the deserter. I had no idea that it would lead to this. And there you were, having to suffer through Tim Russert on Sunday, saying weird things like "I'm a war president!" I guess you believe that, or you want us to believe that. Americans have never voted out a Commander-in-Chief during a war. I guess that's what you're hoping for. You need the war.

But we don't. And our troops in the National Guard don't either. I know you see the writing on the wall, so why not come clean now? We are a forgiving people, and though you will not be returned to White House, you will find us grateful for a little bit of truth. Answer our questions, apologize to the nation, and bring our kids home.

Yours,

Michael Moore
mmflint@aol.com
www.michaelmoore.com

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/index.php
InjaYew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2004, 09:26 AM   #2
Illumina Drathiran'ar
Apophis
 
5 Card Draw Champion
Join Date: July 10, 2002
Location: I can see the Manhattan skyline from my window.
Age: 38
Posts: 4,673
I like Michael Moore. Very much. He might be a bit too radical at times and alienate people, but I enjoy him very much.
__________________
http://cavestory.org
PLAY THIS GAME. Seriously.

http://xkcd.com/386/
http://www.xkcd.com/406/

My heart is like my coffee. Black, bitter, icy, and with a straw.
Illumina Drathiran'ar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2004, 09:33 AM   #3
Timber Loftis
40th Level Warrior
 

Join Date: July 11, 2002
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 11,916
Sometimes he hits the mark, but generally I think he should just sit and spin.
__________________
Timber Loftis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2004, 08:04 PM   #4
InjaYew
Zhentarim Guard
 

Join Date: December 31, 2003
Location: SE Tornado Belt
Age: 63
Posts: 341
I have mixed feelings about him meself. The more I read about him, the more I think he genuinely is trying to use his celebrity to make America a better place, and he really is a clever man, but he's also an entertainer\writer\filmmaker and he sometimes travels over the top to get his points across.

Right now though, right this very minute, I like him a whole lot. We'll see how long that lasts.
InjaYew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2004, 08:42 PM   #5
Barry the Sprout
White Dragon
 

Join Date: October 19, 2001
Location: York, UK.
Age: 41
Posts: 1,815
Don't agree with him on everything (unsuprisingly I think he sometimes isn't "radical" enough!) but this is the kind of stuff I think he's very good at. He uses wit and simple tenacity to really embarress politicians into admitting some stuff they'd rather just forget ever happened. Thats what I really admire him for - he just won't quit until he's got a proper answer. This is a prime example.
__________________
[img]\"http://img1.ranchoweb.com/images/sproutman/certwist.gif\" alt=\" - \" /><br /><br /><i>\"And the angels all pallid and wan,<br />Uprising, unveiling, affirm,<br />That the play is the tragedy, man,<br />And its hero the Conquerer Worm.\"</i><br /> - Edgar Allan Poe
Barry the Sprout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2004, 08:57 PM   #6
Felix The Assassin
The Dreadnoks
 

Join Date: September 27, 2001
Location: Orlando, FL
Age: 61
Posts: 3,608
Metinks it's time for this Moore guy to ask this Kerry guy about some woman!
__________________
The Lizzie Palmer Tribute



Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.

John F. Kennedy
35th President of The United States

The Last Shot

Honor The Fallen

Jesus died for our sins, and American Soldiers died for our freedom.




If you don't stand behind our Soldiers, please feel free to stand in front of them.
Felix The Assassin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2004, 01:23 PM   #7
Cerek the Barbaric
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
 

Join Date: October 29, 2001
Location: North Carolina
Age: 61
Posts: 3,257
I also don't remember Mr. Moore asking Clinton any "probing questions" about Monica Lewinsky, White Water, or any number of other issues which caused controversy during Clinton's 8 years in office.

If he really wants to earn my respect, then let's see him subject liberals to the same satirical microscope he uses for conservatives.
__________________
[img]\"http://img.ranchoweb.com/images/cerek/cerektsrsig.jpg\" alt=\" - \" /><br />Cerek the Calmth
Cerek the Barbaric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2004, 02:22 PM   #8
Illumina Drathiran'ar
Apophis
 
5 Card Draw Champion
Join Date: July 10, 2002
Location: I can see the Manhattan skyline from my window.
Age: 38
Posts: 4,673
NOBODY should ask Clinton about Monica. Nobody should ask Kerry about that woman. NOBODY SHOULD CARE!
It should NOT matter!
No.
We shouldn't care what people do in the bedroom.
This extends from Monicagate to gay marriage.
I realize that some people say, "By becoming a politician, these men put their private lives on public display."
I'm saying it shouldn't be that way.
Unless a 'transgression' has something to do with their leadership, or makes them a hypocrite, the public shouldn't care about the sex lives of public figures.

[ 02-18-2004, 02:23 PM: Message edited by: Illumina Drathiran'ar ]
__________________
http://cavestory.org
PLAY THIS GAME. Seriously.

http://xkcd.com/386/
http://www.xkcd.com/406/

My heart is like my coffee. Black, bitter, icy, and with a straw.
Illumina Drathiran'ar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2004, 03:33 PM   #9
Cerek the Barbaric
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
 

Join Date: October 29, 2001
Location: North Carolina
Age: 61
Posts: 3,257
Quote:
Originally posted by Illumina Drathiran'ar:
NOBODY should ask Clinton about Monica. Nobody should ask Kerry about that woman. NOBODY SHOULD CARE!
It should NOT matter!
No.
We shouldn't care what people do in the bedroom.
This extends from Monicagate to gay marriage.
I realize that some people say, "By becoming a politician, these men put their private lives on public display."
I'm saying it shouldn't be that way.
Unless a 'transgression' has something to do with their leadership, or makes them a hypocrite, the public shouldn't care about the sex lives of public figures.
Why shouldn't the allegations against Clinton and Kerry matter? Both are married men (at least I think Kerry is married). That means that both mean presumably took vows to "forsake all other women". Clinton admitted to breaking those vows and Kerry is accused of doing the same (although the allegations against Kerry seem far less substantive). So that does make Clinton a hypocrite and could possibly make Kerry one also.

But if you say that current (or recent) allegations of sexual misconduct shouldn't matter, then I submit that an alleged discrepency in George Bush's service record from 3 decades ago also shouldn't matter. The National Guard gave him an Honorable Discharge. Technically, that should close the book on any allegations of him being AWOL.

However, all of that is really a moot point. MY point is that Michael Moore should subject liberals to the same microscopic inspection and satirical wit that he has used on the conservatives...but you ain't gonna see it happen.

Until Moore DOES treat BOTH sides of the political fence equally, he will not earn my respect.

One final note on Bush's supposed AWOL incident - I found documents back in the summer of 2002 that supported his claim that he was not AWOL when this issue first came up. I've searched the Archives, however, and cannot find the thread now. But I did find Sign-In and Payroll sheets that verified his location during the time in question. I assume it is the same documents he released to the press last week, but these documents were accessible on the web nearly 2 years ago, so it isn't like they were just created to quiet the current controversy.
__________________
[img]\"http://img.ranchoweb.com/images/cerek/cerektsrsig.jpg\" alt=\" - \" /><br />Cerek the Calmth
Cerek the Barbaric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2004, 03:38 PM   #10
skywalker
Banned User
 

Join Date: March 1, 2001
Location: VT, USA
Age: 63
Posts: 3,097
I believe the woman allegedly involved with Kerry has also denied she had any extra-marital contact with him.

Mark
skywalker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Is George W. Bush the worst president in 100 years? pritchke General Discussion 21 05-24-2006 05:09 AM
Need help to write a "letter of cancellation" to a company Larry_OHF General Discussion 4 04-01-2005 10:19 AM
Searching for "Star Blazers" aka "Uchuu Senchen Yamato," or "Space Battleship Yamato" Skydracgrrl General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) 0 12-02-2004 09:27 PM
Letter to Editor Again Bashing President Bush Timber Loftis General Discussion 34 02-12-2004 02:15 AM
Michael Moore plans Bush-bin Laden film Grojlach General Discussion 10 04-02-2003 01:09 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
©2024 Ironworks Gaming & ©2024 The Great Escape Studios TM - All Rights Reserved