09-16-2001, 07:49 PM | #221 |
Guest
Posts: n/a
|
Ya know it never fails to amaze me that it always people who were born into, raised and educated in the west who see it as such a failure and horrible culture. THese people who would be shot and killed, imprisioned and/or tortured just for having said even half of what they post here if theyr were in these so so superior middle eastern and eastern countries....If the west sucks so badly why not emigrate to Syria or Iran? Im sure they would be glad to have anyone who wanted to go there. Just wondering of course. Anyone have a decent answer?
------------------ Disintigration is easy, If you really want to impress me, ReIntegrate it. |
09-16-2001, 08:03 PM | #222 | ||
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
Join Date: March 12, 2001
Location: Birmingham, West Mid\'s, England
Age: 87
Posts: 2,859
|
Quote:
Quote:
------------------ |
||
09-16-2001, 08:11 PM | #223 |
Guest
Posts: n/a
|
You do realize ALL life is predatory...right?? you do understand the concept of the food chain and all that? Well At least the west DOES in general acknowledge that human life is somewhat more important than your average hotdog
and that to indicriminately kill others is generally a bad thing. Capitalism is not evil, or apalling. It is a system that rewards hard work and discourages laziness. Yeah it needs tweaked here and there but Apparently it has only been really implemented for a little over 200 years, so give the US some time to tweak further, and who knows the system may get fixed. In the mean time the European and other general localities over on that side of the pond have had many many centuries to find a better system...Don't see any on the horizon..unless someone is hiding it from me. Which would be par for the course, some silly sod sets up a Utopia and then forgets to invite me the story of my life I tell ya, it's such a shame And here I thought that lady Fljtosdale was scandinavian in residence and here you are hanging out in the UK hehehe the things I learn on Sunday nights. may peace be on you Lady Fljotsdale you gave me some diversion this eve and you always make me think (however painful that may be) ------------------ Disintigration is easy, If you really want to impress me, ReIntegrate it. [This message has been edited by MagiK (edited 09-16-2001).] |
09-16-2001, 09:55 PM | #224 | |
Banned User
Join Date: August 9, 2001
Location: ...
Posts: 694
|
Quote:
|
|
09-16-2001, 11:12 PM | #225 | |
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
Join Date: March 12, 2001
Location: Birmingham, West Mid\'s, England
Age: 87
Posts: 2,859
|
Quote:
------------------ |
|
09-17-2001, 12:29 AM | #226 | |
Banned User
Join Date: August 9, 2001
Location: ...
Posts: 694
|
Quote:
But not necessarily with us in other ways or for other actions. No, I don't think we should play hopscotch with them to keep them from getting mad at us. I am very much aware that our insult and injuries to them run far deeper than neglecting potential hopscotch partners. You are trivializing what the US has done to the peoples of the Middle East by your sarcasm about not doing anything to anger them, as if we were talking some minor playground injury here instead of the deaths of hundreds of thousands directly or indirectly caused by the US since World War II in the region. As for your comments about not wanting to be my neighbor, you seem to be misunderstanding my position. As a general rule, I certainly do not condone the bombing of anyone. |
|
09-17-2001, 12:40 AM | #227 | |
Banned User
Join Date: August 9, 2001
Location: ...
Posts: 694
|
Quote:
Regarding SEC: hmmm . . . yes, that would seem to be better for you guys. We still haven't found a replacement opponent yet. Our canceled game was non-conference, and the remaining open dates are incompatible with that team, so we are looking for another opponent. |
|
09-17-2001, 07:46 PM | #228 | |
Fzoul Chembryl
Join Date: July 26, 2001
Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK
Posts: 1,781
|
Quote:
On your point about despots and tyrants, no, I am not putting all the blame on the West for their actions and existence. I am putting some of it, however. In the majority of cases, past actions taken by Western countries have contributed to the creation of the conditions in which tyrants flourish. It cannot be denied that America, with oodles of help from Pakistan, (just to take a fr'instance), created the Taliban, who have been oppressing the Afghans who don't agree with them for lo, these many moons. It cannot be denied that huge numbers of people in the Middle East are deprived of democracy by disgusting regimes which are often funded AND ARMED by the West to suit their own strategic aims. (If you don't like these filthy regimes, DONT SELL THEM F*CKING ARMS! Same goes for Britain and other Western countries, by the way, just in case you think I'm America bashing here.) If you want to be champions of democracy, then why support regimes such as that in Saudi Arabia, which have no respect for democracy? The Israeli thing is not particularly clever either, and is at the root of many of the problems. Why persist in supporting Israel's illegal occupation of the West Bank and Gaza? Without American funding, support and arms, they wouldn't be where they are now, (and you almost certainly wouldn't be in the position you are in now. It's a major contributory factor.) And yes, there are evil people in the world. What do you mean, 'they are what they are because they are evil'? Come off it. Just out of interest, how do evil people become evil, in your opinion? Is there an 'evil' gene, do you think? Is 'evil' innate? Are some babies born evil? Do you think that evil arises, fully formed, out of a vaccum? ***** I would be really interested to have your view on this. I have to say I find some of your views simplistic in the extreme. 'War' on terrorism - a fine sounding piece of rhetoric, that, until you examine it a little more closely. Yes of coures, I would LOVE to see terrorism eradicated. But I can tell you this, the American government will not accomplish it the way they seem to be going about it. (A brief glance at history will tell you that.) Trying to treat the symptoms of a disease whilst blatantly ignoring the root causes gets us precisely nowhere. Tough on terrorism - yeah.....right.... what about being tough on the causes of terrorism? People support terrorists such as bin Laden because their lives are a misery, and they see no other hope. The way they see it, the West has everything, and they have nothing, and the West has contributed to their misery. Kill one terrorist, and a thousand martyrs spring up in his place. Can you not see that?? The conditions in which terrorists breed are still going to be there, but worse than ever, due to your intervention. You aren't going to be doing yourselves any favours by barging in with all your power and might! In the Middle East, not to mention much of the rest of the world, America is often perceived as promoting a fundamentalist view of individual liberty and free markets, whilst being careless of the huge and growing inequalities between the developed and undeveloped world that they bring in their wake. (This is a whole big subject in itself, which I discussed at some length in the GATS thread.) Much could be done, by America and the rest of us rich Western countries, to change that view. Capitalism doesn't have to promote inequality. Unfortunately, it all too often does. (If you're interested, I can list you a whole list of books, sites and whatnot on this subject, which quote FACTS and FIGURES in relation to global capitalism and poverty in the world today.) Last but not least, I'd like to say that I find your view of human beings dispiriting in the extreme. This idea that ALL life is predatory and out for itself. I think it's crap, if you'll excuse the term. The point about human beings is we are INTELLIGENT, at least, that's the theory. (Some far less than others, admittedly.) We have the capacity for self awareness (although some are more self aware than others). We also have the capacity for enlightened self interest, which extends a lot further than personal self interest. Truly enlightened self interest extends to the planet as a whole, to the human race as a whole. Enlightened self interest is creative. It sees that we could do things differently, if we wanted to. We also have the capacity for love, and that alone has the power to change the world out of all recognition, if we let it. You want to know how to defuse terrorism? Try carpet bombing countries such as Afghanistan with food and medicine. Follow that up with doctors and teachers.... and so on. Right now, they live in misery, and their leaders tell them constantly that it's all the West's fault. Constructive action speaks louder than rhetoric about democracy. Why don't we show them different? ------------------ [This message has been edited by Silver Cheetah (edited 09-17-2001).] |
|
09-17-2001, 07:52 PM | #229 | |
Ra
Join Date: March 11, 2001
Location: Ant Hill
Age: 49
Posts: 2,397
|
Quote:
|
|
09-17-2001, 11:27 PM | #230 | |
Banned User
Join Date: August 9, 2001
Location: ...
Posts: 694
|
Quote:
Shall we conclude that all such airmen are rabid dogs who should be wiped off the face of the earth, or that they are just "born evil"? Magick, there is no need to imagine "evil" men in the Middle east to account for the hostility and hatred that some hold for the US and the West. Even if they were the best of men to begin with, we have given them reason after reason to declare us the great enemy. Please do read up on the history of the area. From the point of view of the west, it has been since World War I a vast oil reserve that we have sought to keep under our control through any means necessary, including military force and shameful activities of the CIA-- for example the propping up of the last Shah of Iran and his murderous regime, which was the direct cause of popular Iranian hatred of the US and the storming of the US embassy during the popular uprising which swept the Shah from power. US -- Iranian relations are still strained, over 20 years later, because of it. As Silver Cheetah says, the real, long term answer to stopping terrorism lies in treating people fairly to begin with. [This message has been edited by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown (edited 09-18-2001).] [This message has been edited by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown (edited 09-18-2001).] |
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Twin Lamps | Korvanik | Miscellaneous Games (RPG or not) | 2 | 02-02-2004 03:48 PM |
Twin Peaks | Grojlach | Entertainment (Movies, TV Shows and Books/Comics) | 3 | 02-06-2003 07:47 PM |
My stats for people in the 2 towers (contains two tower spoilers) | Sythe | Baldurs Gate II: Shadows of Amn & Throne of Bhaal | 2 | 12-22-2002 10:49 PM |
Twin Lamps | Thamrys Greybeard | Miscellaneous Games (RPG or not) | 5 | 09-23-2002 04:40 AM |
Stats on the Twin Towers | Avatar | General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) | 14 | 09-11-2001 03:50 PM |