Alchemist - > Bard dual class

[Kylospylon]

After an exceptionally long break from Wiz8, I've come crawling back like the slithering slime that I am. But I needed something new so I thought I'd include a few dual classed characters to mix things up a bit. I'd never dual classed any of my characters before, because I was afraid to gimp them.

Apart from my Alchemist(3) -> Bard character, my duals are pretty straight foward:

Bishop(18) -> Alchemist (to eaze lvl ups, more reliable lvl 6-7 alchemist spells by endgame).
Bishop(18) -> Psionic (to eaze lvl ups, be immune to mental effects etc, to compliment the bishop-alchemist).
Ninja(4) -> Ranger (for stealth and critical strike, ignoring the magic because I've already got enough alchemy in the party).

The idea behind the alc-bard was to create a character that would have music and enough competency in magic to maintain herself, without needing contant attention from other casters, or a steady supply of stamina potions. I decided to halt the lvls of Alchemist when I reached lvl 3, since any more than that would severly handicap music. I picked only water spells (except for heal wounds) and was careful to always cast acid splash in battles to build water skill (for stamina), and mix lots of potions to build alchemy.

It was a pain to rest so often to recover mana, and end up being 3-4 lvls below the rest of my party, but once I thought I had enough skill in alchemy and water magic to be effective throughout the game, I went up 4 lvls in Bard, pumping music at each lvl up. I'm confident that it will be fairly easy to get music up to where it should be very quickly (without too much cheesy training). I don't care about locks and traps, coz I've got a rogue, but I suppose it would be possible to start building that skillset up if you had to.

The end result should be a character that has much more juice than a regular bard by means of being able to cast stamina on him/herself, that peaks a little later in the game, and that doesn't hinder the offensive abilities of my other casters (by having them cast stamina intermittently).

Downsides:

- may have to wait to use certain instuments because of a slightly lower bard level
- slightly lower hitpoints (just a handfull)

On a side note; I managed to get the Alc-Bard's divine magic up just enough so she wouldn't have to carry health potions in her inventory, thereby freeing up that spot for another musical instrument (a little perk).

Apologies for the long post, and if this is old news to some of you.

[Wereboar]

- Usually, i have the dulcimer of mending before my inventory is full of instroments. So i don't need to carry healing potions.

- having to wait 3 additional level to use certain intruments (haste, heal all, restoration, nuclear blast) seem like a big drwaback for me. The high-level instruments will be useless for you.

[Loudhy]

I never used Nuclear Blast. IIRC it was found somewhere in the Rapax Castle and after I found it, I didn't met much monsters that were vulnarable to fire.
I won that game so I think he shouldn't be worry about missing the highlevel instrument. IMO the Dulcimer of Mending or the Rousing Drums will work, even with a lower level.

[img]graemlins/monster5.gif[/img]

[ 06-09-2004, 01:48 AM: Message edited by: Loudhy ]

[Wereboar]

I often go to Rapax areas quite early (twice even with level 11 parties). Usually, i have the infernal horn before i'm able to use it (level 18). And thats before Mt.Gigas caves, SE wildernesse, sea caves, ...

IIRC you need to be level 8 for haste and for heal all (or was it 11 for heal all?). And at that level, you usually get only a level 1 or 2 effect. So it takes longer before they become useful, if you do some levels with another class.

[Krull]

Yes, I think level 11 and then class change. That way you have access to the Dulcimer of Healing and Arresting Aria, two potent instruments.

I'm playing a solo Bard at the moment. I was going to class change to a Samurai at level 12 (at level 11 now with Music at 90+). I'll save and also do an Alchemist to see what happens. As it's a solo, should be able to reach level 18 as an Alchemist before the end.

[Scatter]

If i understand Kylo, his Alchemist levels were in order to be able to staminize himself. I've never had too much lack of stamina with a bard, as i don't use the instruments in battle much--usually just the one Hasting and maybe a Soul Shield. In fact, i haven't played a Bard in quite a while because i have found cast magic to be more effective.
Bard-to-Sam is a lot of fun, as is Bard-to-Fighter. Bard-to-Alchemist will seriously reduce your weapons choices.

[ 06-09-2004, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: Scatter ]

[Kylospylon]

Thanx for the input.

Yeah, I considered all of what you guys have said, and decided that the idea, at least, warranted a try anyway. My Alc->Bard isn't my initial 'haster', so I'm not that concerned with being a few levels behind. If I didn't have another haster (my bishop-psionic), I probably wouldn't risk having to use the drums 3 levels later. After lvl 13 or so, I imagine the alc-bard could become the main haster, freeing up my psionic a bit. The point is that with a psionic you want to be casting haste until about lvl 13 to build up fire magic anyway.

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I almost always leave Bayjin and the Sea Caves till after the rapax, just before I'm ready to ascend, so my bards can use the infernal horn and my psionics can use prismic chaos on the rinjin. High end fire spells like prismic chaos and nuclear blast aren't much fun if you get them when you're playing in the rift or on the peak. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Kylospylon]

Quick update.

My Bard is at lvl 15 now, Alc(3)+Bar(12). Music skill is at 96, but I'm still fizzling more often than I'd like. She's the main 'haster' now, and has 60-70 points in sword, but hardly ever misses due to maxed dexterity and high strength from numerous items. She can outdamage my fighter in melee, but that's because for once I went with axes for my fighter and he's still wielding a mediocre bipennis.

(Please don't tell me that axes are poor and I should go for swords, I know. I had to try an axe-wielding fighter for novelty's sake.)

In conclusion, making a bard able to 'stammirize' her/himself is handy but not worth the effort really. IMO

I may change her to fighter later, but I doubt it - for once I actually managed to snag all the bard gear! With reflexion and a shield, there's really no need to improve her AC, and her stats (dexterity excluded) are all fairly average without the bard stuff.

On a different note:

What do you persons consider to be the greatest 2-H axe? I've heard of a few good ones a bit later in the game. The only one I remember is 'The Ripper', but are there others?

[Wereboar]

I think Blades of Aesir is the best one i found.
Don't remember how good the Crusader 2H Axe was. Definately not as good as Aesir, but i don't recall how it compared to the Ripper.
But The Ripper has the advantage that it is fix (IIRC even at two places)

[Scatter]

Yep. And you can PP one. (from the same victim that has Estoc and Divinemail)