Homeland defense

I think homeland security is far more important than bombing Afganistan. Part of that security comes from providing the stability of food, housing and health care for every citizen. My point is using so much military power abroad seems like a detriment to what going on inside the American border and this extends beyond recent events to. I am not slamming the military here either, it is neccessary for the defense of the nation and is a right of democracy. I 'm just questioning the priorities of American and others military policy in relation to domestic and foriegn security. Now that I have flown in America and have seen the my safety is being secured by camoflauged men with m-16s (it is very new here in America to see a sustained military presence like this at a national level) I have decide my opinion is that the military action here at home is way more important in stopping terrorism than the one in Afganistan. I question the priorities in which we are using our resources. I could care less about terrorists in Afganistan considering there are still some here in my home. I want as much resources that we have available to stop them and shore up the defenses. A good offense is only the best defense if you have clear cut offensive objectives and goals. Tackling terror abroad or at home isn't a clear cut objective because of the elusive nature of terror organizations.

This arguement isnt against the military actions in Afganistan or against terrorism per se, but is a discourse on the priorities a large, rich and powerful nation like the U.S. or even a group of nations like Europe should examine when placing resources and taking action.

What do you think? Are we doing enough so far with regards to homeland security, and does sustaining a large military presence abroad effect homeland security in your home country?

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by G'kar: What do you think? Are we doing enough so far with regards to homeland security, and does sustaining a large military presence abroad effect homeland security in your home country?

I agree with you.

Regarding homeland security, I'm not sure if we're doing enough, because to US it's a brand new science, and the learning curve means death for someone. This is a frightening thought for Americans. Everyday we see more and more Anthrax deaths, infections, and exposures. I think it's the fault of civilians as much as the government's though, because we are so preoccupied with our "rights" being violated. It's time all Americans become involved in election campaigns (not running, but monitering), getting out to "rock the vote", and properly supervise our government.

Somethings, like protecting the population, go beyond the "right" to do "as you 'please' within the law". As an American, my right to stay alive is the one I most value, and there is an order of importance. All of our rights and civil liberties are important, but the order of importance is critical. This subject will be the basis for votes in the near future, and the basis for short terms of office, at the next election.

To effect homeland security, I do believe it requires a presence abroad, because as you stated earlier, "a good offense, is the best defense." The combination of the two is best, and a presence abroad is both at the same time! If violated, it's imperative that we are able to retaliate, in order to deter similar action. Our current military doesn't need to be brought home to handle affairs, instead, our homeland defense should be increased to a satisfactory level.

Of all the "Western" cultures, ours was the only one that never had to consider these things (on this level), but now, those times have passed...
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"Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins."

[This message has been edited by Ronn_Bman (edited 10-30-2001).]

Originally posted by Ronn_Bman: ...our homeland defense should be increased to a satisfactory level. Of all the "Western" cultures, ours was the only one that never had to consider these things (on this level), but now, those times have passed...

Indeed on these points and other made in your post. We may not be in total agreement on all facets of the topic, but a balanced strategdy is what I'm advocating as well.

On another note...I noticed I became hyper-aware of my surroundings the second I entered Logan airport on Saturday morning, also when I pick-up mail or go to the mall, but I still do these things in confidence. I think in America, generally, we have all become a bit more aware in daily life. I feel my own responsiblity to homeland defense is way more than just writing about it in a message forum. I had no idea what exactly I would do if a terror cell tried to hijack the plane I was on, but I gaurantee I wouldnt do nothing if a greater disaster could be averted. It is very strange to me to think that way, but that is one of the effects 9-11 has had on me. Neighborhood watch has a brand new meaning now...

[Ladyzekke]

Well I kinda feel as you G'Kar. If the U.S. put as much money, time and effort into defending us as much as they do dropping bombs, I think I'd feel better. I mean, these attacks our military are doing right now are supposed to be ultimately, to protect us. But if too much attention is focused on attacking Afghanistan, and things may be overlooked here in our homeland re local threats, then the "protecting us" part isn't working as well as it could. Of course, most of our post offices here where I live are infected with anthrax, and the news keep saying "Be on Alert, there may be another terrorist attack", etc., so I am a bit looking at things right now from a more personal perspective than an overall one.

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Originally posted by ladyzekke: Well I kinda feel as you G'Kar. If the U.S. put as much money, time and effort into defending us as much as they do dropping bombs, I think I'd feel better. I mean, these attacks our military are doing right now are supposed to be ultimately, to protect us. But if too much attention is focused on attacking Afghanistan, and things may be overlooked here in our homeland re local threats, then the "protecting us" part isn't working as well as it could. Of course, most of our post offices here where I live are infected with anthrax, and the news keep saying "Be on Alert, there may be another terrorist attack", etc., so I am a bit looking at things right now from a more personal perspective than an overall one.

It is personal LadyZekke, or it has become that way for me.

[skywalker]

So is the "newest" alert by Mr. Ashcroft merely a CYA tactic. A few weeks ago they set all security agencies on highest alert because of possible terrorist attacks. It was never called back. Now (2 days ago) we have another alert, but no details.

The question is how much higher a state of alert can you get. I think the Government is covering their butts in case something does happen. If nothing happens, well the proper authorities did the job right and if something does happen, they can say we alerted everyone, but we can't catch everything. The problem is that we should continue a normal routine, except be aware that we may be attacked within this week. That's quite a tightrope that we are being asked to walk and there seems to be no safety net below us.

Homeland Security should be job 1, not the tracking down of terrorist groups in foriegn lands imo. You can't get them all, hell we're havin a hardtime getting the first group. How many Arab Nations do we attack so we can "smoke all the Evildoers out of their holes" and "bring 'em back Dead or Alive". We really do need to make this land and other nations need to make their countries safe against these threats.

Mr. Ridge should be one of the most powerful men in the USA and I don't see it happening. Is is because it is easier for the Gov. to show us they are doing a good job by displaying videos of explosions in Afghanistan than to convince us that our Homeland Defense is doing a good job? We need to be "bulletproof" and I don't mean "Missile Defense" either. I like to think that if a terrorist group can plan an attack, the proper people can stop them. They just need to learn how to share the info.




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Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati!

Mark

[Hiram Sedai]

I am esasperated at the lack of domestic security in the wake of September 11th. I am truly tired of the cliches and false comfort provided by a token response by the National Guard. The airports continue to have underpaid and undertrained staff in security. There is no change to how long bags or x-rayed or how people are checked out.

I am concerned about the mail situation because of my place in the scheme of things. I'm responsible for 10 people who handle mail every damn day. I also feel very bad for the people who have already contracted Anthrax.

Like many other people, I'm dependent upon the news to inform me of the situation and how the United States will respond. The nebulous response from the goverment is frustrating. It seems like we are told to be paranoid but not given precise instructions. "Don't open your mail" is not a viable solution to our current predicament. I need more. What am I to do when one of my people get Anthrax? We depend on the Post Office's to be our first line of defense and they are dropping like flies.

This is more of a rant than an logical discussion, and for that I apologize. I'm a bit upset.

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[skywalker]

Originally posted by Hiram Sedai: I am esasperated at the lack of domestic security in the wake of September 11th. I am truly tired of the cliches and false comfort provided by a token response by the National Guard. The airports continue to have underpaid and undertrained staff in security. There is no change to how long bags or x-rayed or how people are checked out. I am concerned about the mail situation because of my place in the scheme of things. I'm responsible for 10 people who handle mail every damn day. I also feel very bad for the people who have already contracted Anthrax. Like many other people, I'm dependent upon the news to inform me of the situation and how the United States will respond. The nebulous response from the goverment is frustrating. It seems like we are told to be paranoid but not given precise instructions. "Don't open your mail" is not a viable solution to our current predicament. I need more. What am I to do when one of my people get Anthrax? We depend on the Post Office's to be our first line of defense and they are dropping like flies. This is more of a rant than an logical discussion, and for that I apologize. I'm a bit upset.

As is your right to be upset. So many of us really don't feel the same tensions and pressures that others do. I know, personally, that all these anthrax attacks affect me less because I live in Nowherefield Vermont. This does not mean I do not care though, just that the feelings of not being insecure are lessened by geographic position.

If anyone feels you are overeacting about this, then they do not understand how others truly feel.

Let out your steam here. It's a good place to do it.

Hang in there Hiram!

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Still The Most Humbly Prideful (?) Member Of The Illuminati!

Mark

Originally posted by Hiram Sedai: I am esasperated at the lack of domestic security in the wake of September 11th. I am truly tired of the cliches and false comfort provided by a token response by the National Guard. The airports continue to have underpaid and undertrained staff in security. There is no change to how long bags or x-rayed or how people are checked out. I am concerned about the mail situation because of my place in the scheme of things. I'm responsible for 10 people who handle mail every damn day. I also feel very bad for the people who have already contracted Anthrax. Like many other people, I'm dependent upon the news to inform me of the situation and how the United States will respond. The nebulous response from the goverment is frustrating. It seems like we are told to be paranoid but not given precise instructions. "Don't open your mail" is not a viable solution to our current predicament. I need more. What am I to do when one of my people get Anthrax? We depend on the Post Office's to be our first line of defense and they are dropping like flies. This is more of a rant than an logical discussion, and for that I apologize. I'm a bit upset.

Be upset! Like I said it has become personal. I was impressed by the security at Logan Airport here in Boston and at the airport in minneapolis. At least 6 possible random searchs at the variuos stages of your journey through the airport. The young woman in uniform who checked my ticket and ID was alert, but friendly. So was the supposedly underpaid airport security gentleman who bent and prodded my thin wallet and examined my keychain for sharp metal. There was a sense of purpose amongst the security people, how-ever underpaid they are. Also each bag was scrutinized and any buzz of the first alarm delegated you to a second line with a upclose hand metal-detector scan, and most people with carry-on luggage were questioned of the contents. My peers had all spray bottles in their carry-on examined, and several had batteries, nail-clippers, and hairspray confiscated! I took no carry-on luggage so my journey was scot-free. finally 3 out of 12 people boarding the plane were pulled aside for personal metal detector scans and physical bag checks, randomly. Still, I was wide awake and alert of every soul on that palne I could sense until it landed three hours later. That I am still getting used too.