We reap what we sow?

SpiritWarrior · 10-31-2003, 05:44 AM

I read this on a site just a bit ago and thought I'd post it here for opinions. I personally think alot of it has truth to it especially the part about the negatively influential music on youths. It seems all my nephew listens to truly are songs about drugs, rape and criminal/violent acts.

And we wonder why all of a sudden all the kids think they're these bad ass black dudes with a grudge against society and a gun in their hands?
Before people start screaming, NO this is not me being racist or stereotypical but rather bringing to light the ridiculously unrealistic stereotype the music of today attempts to sell to our young people. That of a rebellious youth willing - no - enthusiastic about doing stupid crap. It reads as follows:

Where did our children get all their ideas??? From us???

Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when
they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped
and we might damage their self-esteem.

And we said, an expert should know what he's talking about,
so we won't spank them anymore..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then someone said teachers and principals better not discipline
our children when they misbehave.

And the school administrators said no faculty member in this
school better touch a student when they misbehave because
we don't want any bad publicity, and we surely don't want to
be sued. And we accepted their reasoning..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then someone said, let's let our daughters have abortions if
they want, and they won't even have to tell their parents.

And we said, that's a grand idea..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be
boys and they're going to do it anyway, let's give our sons all
the condoms they want, so they can have all the fun they desire,
and we won't have to tell their parents they got them at school.

And we said, that's another great idea..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then some of our top elected officials said it doesn't matter
what we do in private as long as we do our jobs.

And agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what
anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have
a job and the economy is good.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And then someone said let's print magazines with pictures of
nude women and call it wholesome down-to-earth appreciation
for the beauty of the female body.

And we said we have no problem with that.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And someone else took that appreciation a step further and
published pictures of children and then stepped further still by
making them available on the Internet.

And we said they're entitled to their free speech.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows
and movies that promote profanity, violence, and illicit sex.
And let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder,
suicide, and satanic themes.

And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, and
nobody takes it seriously anyway, so go right ahead..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Therefore, now we're asking ourselves why our children have no
conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it
doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and
themselves.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can
figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with...

"WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."

[ 10-31-2003, 05:49 AM: Message edited by: SpiritWarrior ]

Zuvio · 10-31-2003, 06:15 AM

Not true! Not true!
I grew up with NWA, used as much condoms as I did cigarettes, did drugs, cursed my parents, scolded teachers, behaved like a menace and rejected society all together. My dad never lay a hand on me and my mother could be mother theresa herself. And look where I'm standing now, after learning from my own dumb mistakes, I finally pieced together the puzzle: you gotta do it yourself! Influential entertainment is only influential if the recipient if susceptable to it wether it has a good home or not. I believe that the lack of either parent and maybe the lack of a peer (brother/sister) is much more damaging to a kid then then rap-music. Where you grow up is offcourse also determining.

It's only that all the bad cases/apples get singled out and put in the news that we suddenly have a generally bad view of the kids these days.

I DO agree however that we should abolish the taboos of not spanking children. Nothing will be damaged by that. And disciplining is an integral part of a childs upbring: it *has* to learn right from wrong. If after good raising the child still goes awry, it's too bad, not everyone can be helped, but thats only a small part of the youth.

I'm sorry if I sounded a little bit too assertive in this post, but I get freaked out by this kind of stuff.

Skunk · 10-31-2003, 06:39 AM

Oh? I rather thought that the logic went like this:

Where did our children get all their ideas??? From us???

A minority of experts state said we should spank our children when
they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped
and we might damage their self-esteem if we didn't.

And we said, the minority is always right,
so we should spank them..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then someone said teachers and principals better not interfere when the kids use violence to settle scores amongst themselves. And as for bullying, that isn't a problem - it's just kids emulating their parent-child relationship.
All healthy stuff.

Because a couple of experts say it's so
And we accepted their reasoning..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then someone said, let's let our daughters get raped if
our sons want to do it, and they won't even have to tell their parents.

And we said, that's a grand idea - violence is a quicker way of getting the girl you want..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be
boys and they're going to do it anyway, let's give our sons all the guns they want, so they can have all the fun they desire,
and we won't have to tell their parents that they're shooting other kids at school.

And we said, that's another great idea - violence is the most economical way of getting your point across..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then some of our top elected officials said it doesn't matter
what we do in private as long as we do our jobs.

And agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what
anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have
a job and the economy is good.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And then someone said let's print magazines with pictures of
nude women and force women into prostitution and call it
wholesome down-to-earth appreciation
for the beauty of the female body.

And we said we have no problem with that. Using physical force to impose our will is what life is all about.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And someone else took that appreciation a step further and
published pictures of children and then stepped further still by
making them available on the Internet.

And we said that they were entitled to use physical force on kids to make them do what we want.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows
and movies that promote profanity, violence, and illicit sex.
And let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder,
suicide, and satanic themes.

And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, and
we do all that stuff in the home anyway, so go right ahead..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Therefore, now we're asking ourselves why our children have no
conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it
doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and
themselves.

Afterall, violence starts in the home.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can
figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with...

"WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."

[ 10-31-2003, 06:46 AM: Message edited by: Skunk ]

Vaskez · 10-31-2003, 06:46 AM

Heh, I also grew up on NWA. I decided after a few cigs that smoking wasn't for me and never had the urge to do drugs. I've never heard a rap song promote rape, and I've heard A LOT of songs, although they do promote a lot of negative things. I had a good example from my parents so knew not to take the stuff I listened to (and still do), seriously. I concentrated on the lyrical talents and good beats. Otherwise I agree with most of the post SpiritW.

Skunk · 10-31-2003, 07:04 AM

The truth of the reasons behind delinquency is probably somewhere inbetween the pro-physical punishment and anti-physical punishment camps.

Parent's who over-discipline their kids are just as likely as parent's who under-discipline their kids to produce 'monsters'.

What works with one kid may not work with another; as parents we need to be flexible and vigilent to this - rather than argue on the merits of corporal punishment. The only right disciplinary method is the one that works for your child. There is no magic 'one-size-fits-all' solution.

Bungleau · 10-31-2003, 09:14 AM

Just remember as you think about this.... one of the best-selling and most popular books of all time is filled with rape, murder, sodomy, incest, premarital sex, and worse. Attempts to get it banned or restricted from children would be met with harsh opposition from many fronts, including the religious right and left, the moral majority (which is neither), the liberals and the conservatives.

About the only group that wouldn't object furiously to banning the Bible would be the agnostics... 'cause they don't care.

*sets back waiting for the agnostic flashback...*

cloud ff7 38 · 10-31-2003, 09:50 AM

I disagree with some of that but its all right pretty much.

Zuvio most people dont turn out like you after the drugs and what not they just continue to be bad. Hey but its a good thing you turned out good [img]smile.gif[/img]

Vaskez · 10-31-2003, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bungleau:
Just remember as you think about this.... one of the best-selling and most popular books of all time is filled with rape, murder, sodomy, incest, premarital sex, and worse. Attempts to get it banned or restricted from children would be met with harsh opposition from many fronts, including the religious right and left, the moral majority (which is neither), the liberals and the conservatives.

WTF you on about?? You can't compare the Bible to the stuff we're talking about here. It's a completely different argument. We're talking about things that promote murder etc. and the Bible highlights them as sins and discusses why we shouldn't do them and the consequences of doing them. I'm sorry but that's one of the stupidest posts I've seen on here.

[ 10-31-2003, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: Vaskez ]

cloud ff7 38 · 10-31-2003, 10:21 AM

Please do not turn this thread into a bible disscussion.

Vaskez · 10-31-2003, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cloud ff7 38:
Please do not turn this thread into a bible disscussion.

Sorry tiger, wasn't me who started it [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Oh and I doubt Johnny the homicidal maniac said "smile your dead" cos that makes no sense. Maybe "smile you're dead". [img]tongue.gif[/img] Oooh I'm annoying ....

[ 10-31-2003, 10:57 AM: Message edited by: Vaskez ]

10-31-2003, 05:44 AM	#1
SpiritWarrior Jack Burton Join Date: May 31, 2002 Location: Ireland Posts: 5,854	I read this on a site just a bit ago and thought I'd post it here for opinions. I personally think alot of it has truth to it especially the part about the negatively influential music on youths. It seems all my nephew listens to truly are songs about drugs, rape and criminal/violent acts. And we wonder why all of a sudden all the kids think they're these bad ass black dudes with a grudge against society and a gun in their hands? Before people start screaming, NO this is not me being racist or stereotypical but rather bringing to light the ridiculously unrealistic stereotype the music of today attempts to sell to our young people. That of a rebellious youth willing - no - *enthusiastic* about doing stupid crap. It reads as follows: Where did our children get all their ideas??? From us??? Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem. And we said, an expert should know what he's talking about, so we won't spank them anymore.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then someone said teachers and principals better not discipline our children when they misbehave. And the school administrators said no faculty member in this school better touch a student when they misbehave because we don't want any bad publicity, and we surely don't want to be sued. And we accepted their reasoning.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then someone said, let's let our daughters have abortions if they want, and they won't even have to tell their parents. And we said, that's a grand idea.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be boys and they're going to do it anyway, let's give our sons all the condoms they want, so they can have all the fun they desire, and we won't have to tell their parents they got them at school. And we said, that's another great idea.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then some of our top elected officials said it doesn't matter what we do in private as long as we do our jobs. And agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have a job and the economy is good. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And then someone said let's print magazines with pictures of nude women and call it wholesome down-to-earth appreciation for the beauty of the female body. And we said we have no problem with that. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And someone else took that appreciation a step further and published pictures of children and then stepped further still by making them available on the Internet. And we said they're entitled to their free speech. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows and movies that promote profanity, violence, and illicit sex. And let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes. And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, and nobody takes it seriously anyway, so go right ahead.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Therefore, now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with... "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW." [ 10-31-2003, 05:49 AM: Message edited by: SpiritWarrior ] __________________ Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...

10-31-2003, 06:15 AM	#2
Zuvio Gold Dragon Join Date: May 19, 2002 Location: Blessed are those who are not.... Age: 42 Posts: 2,556	Not true! Not true! I grew up with NWA, used as much condoms as I did cigarettes, did drugs, cursed my parents, scolded teachers, behaved like a menace and rejected society all together. My dad never lay a hand on me and my mother could be mother theresa herself. And look where I'm standing now, after learning from my own dumb mistakes, I finally pieced together the puzzle: you gotta do it yourself! Influential entertainment is only influential if the recipient if susceptable to it wether it has a good home or not. I believe that the lack of either parent and maybe the lack of a peer (brother/sister) is much more damaging to a kid then then rap-music. Where you grow up is offcourse also determining. It's only that all the bad cases/apples get singled out and put in the news that we suddenly have a generally bad view of the kids these days. I DO agree however that we should abolish the taboos of not spanking children. Nothing will be damaged by that. And disciplining is an integral part of a childs upbring: it has to learn right from wrong. If after good raising the child still goes awry, it's too bad, not everyone can be helped, but thats only a small part of the youth. I'm sorry if I sounded a little bit too assertive in this post, but I get freaked out by this kind of stuff. __________________ [img]\"http://img121.exs.cx/img121/4236/zuviodemonnoname2hf.gif\" alt=\" - \" />

10-31-2003, 06:46 AM	#4
Vaskez Takhisis Follower Join Date: April 30, 2001 Location: szép Magyarország (well not right now) Posts: 5,089	Heh, I also grew up on NWA. I decided after a few cigs that smoking wasn't for me and never had the urge to do drugs. I've never heard a rap song promote rape, and I've heard A LOT of songs, although they do promote a lot of negative things. I had a good example from my parents so knew not to take the stuff I listened to (and still do), seriously. I concentrated on the lyrical talents and good beats. Otherwise I agree with most of the post SpiritW. __________________ Too set in his ways to ever relate If he could set that aside, there'd be heaven to pay But weathered and aged, time swept him to grave Love conquers all? Damn, I'd say that area's gray

10-31-2003, 09:14 AM	#6
Bungleau 40th Level Warrior Join Date: October 29, 2001 Location: Western Wilds of Michigan Posts: 11,752	Just remember as you think about this.... one of the best-selling and most popular books of all time is filled with rape, murder, sodomy, incest, premarital sex, and worse. Attempts to get it banned or restricted from children would be met with harsh opposition from many fronts, including the religious right and left, the moral majority (which is neither), the liberals and the conservatives. About the only group that wouldn't object furiously to banning the Bible would be the agnostics... 'cause they don't care. sets back waiting for the agnostic flashback... __________________ B Save Early, Save Often Save Before, Save After Two-Star General, Spelling Soldiers -+-+-+ Give 'em a hug one more time. It might be the last.

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10-31-2003, 06:39 AM	#3
Skunk Banned User Join Date: September 3, 2001 Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands Age: 62 Posts: 1,463	Oh? I rather thought that the logic went like this: Where did our children get all their ideas??? From us??? A minority of experts state said we should spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem if we didn't. And we said, the minority is always right, so we should spank them.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then someone said teachers and principals better not interfere when the kids use violence to settle scores amongst themselves. And as for bullying, that isn't a problem - it's just kids emulating their parent-child relationship. All healthy stuff. Because a couple of experts say it's so And we accepted their reasoning.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then someone said, let's let our daughters get raped if our sons want to do it, and they won't even have to tell their parents. And we said, that's a grand idea - violence is a quicker way of getting the girl you want.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be boys and they're going to do it anyway, let's give our sons all the guns they want, so they can have all the fun they desire, and we won't have to tell their parents that they're shooting other kids at school. And we said, that's another great idea - violence is the most economical way of getting your point across.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Then some of our top elected officials said it doesn't matter what we do in private as long as we do our jobs. And agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have a job and the economy is good. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And then someone said let's print magazines with pictures of nude women and force women into prostitution and call it wholesome down-to-earth appreciation for the beauty of the female body. And we said we have no problem with that. Using physical force to impose our will is what life is all about. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And someone else took that appreciation a step further and published pictures of children and then stepped further still by making them available on the Internet. And we said that they were entitled to use physical force on kids to make them do what we want. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ And the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows and movies that promote profanity, violence, and illicit sex. And let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes. And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, and we do all that stuff in the home anyway, so go right ahead.. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Therefore, now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves. Afterall, violence starts in the home. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with... "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW." [ 10-31-2003, 06:46 AM: Message edited by: Skunk ]

10-31-2003, 07:04 AM	#5
Skunk Banned User Join Date: September 3, 2001 Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands Age: 62 Posts: 1,463	The truth of the reasons behind delinquency is probably somewhere inbetween the pro-physical punishment and anti-physical punishment camps. Parent's who over-discipline their kids are just as likely as parent's who under-discipline their kids to produce 'monsters'. What works with one kid may not work with another; as parents we need to be flexible and vigilent to this - rather than argue on the merits of corporal punishment. The only right disciplinary method is the one that works for your child. There is no magic 'one-size-fits-all' solution.

10-31-2003, 09:50 AM	#7
cloud ff7 38 User suspended until [Nov26] Join Date: August 7, 2003 Location: Midgar Age: 35 Posts: 533	I disagree with some of that but its all right pretty much. Zuvio most people dont turn out like you after the drugs and what not they just continue to be bad. Hey but its a good thing you turned out good [img]smile.gif[/img]

10-31-2003, 10:21 AM	#9
cloud ff7 38 User suspended until [Nov26] Join Date: August 7, 2003 Location: Midgar Age: 35 Posts: 533	Please do not turn this thread into a bible disscussion.

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