Personal safety issues and my recent experience - Page 8

LennonCook · 01-30-2002, 12:35 AM

Or if your in a big forrest, noone around for miles, no hope of excaping, no real training in self defence (this ofcourse should not happen, but it may) then there is one defense left:
Start singing something like
" HO Tom Bombadil, Tom Bombadillo!!
By water, read and log, by the wind and willow!!
By fire sun and moon, harken now and hear us,
Ho Tom Bombadill, for our need is near us!!"

And then you can hope 1 of 2 things...

The first is that some wierd looking guy will run up singing
"Old Tom Bombadil is a merry fellow,
Bright Blue his jacket is, and his boots are yellow!!
None have caught him yet for, Tom he is the master,
His songs are stronger songs, and his feet are faster!!

and help you...

The second, and more likely, is that your assailent will be scared away from the utter stupidness of it.

Neither ofcourse is very likely, but if it is your only chance, then well... you probably dont stand a chance !!

Nachtrafe · 01-30-2002, 04:58 PM

*Offers Lennon a stiff drink* [img]smile.gif[/img]

LOL...Just felt that this thread needed a *BUMP*

Aelia Jusa · 01-30-2002, 05:24 PM

Cloudy, Epona, LadyZ, the way you handled those situations you were in is really inspirational for me. I think especially that you kept calm and didn't panic and could remember the right things to do is very important.

My personal experience with something like this isn't quite so bad since I wasn't really in any danger, but I think it highlights some things about sexual assault especially. So I was about 14, and in the train with a friend travelling up to another friend's house. We were sitting in one of those seats that has another seat facing you. And this man got on at one of the stops and sat across from us. The carriage had a number of other people in it. And he was wearing really short shorts, and after while I realised he had his hand down his pants. And then we noticed he had maneuvered himself so his penis was showing from under his shorts. And we didn't really know what to do so we didn't do anything since our stop was soon and there were other people around so he couldn't really do anything. And then we got to our stop and we got out and that was that.

So we were safe the whole time, but from that incident I can really understand why people who are sexually assaulted feel responsible, because my very first thought was that it was somehow my fault. Like was it the way I was sitting, or what I was wearing, or how I glanced at him when he first sat down. And also the fact that I immediately denied it as anything I should be upset about.

Cloudbringer · 01-30-2002, 06:10 PM

Nacht... [img]graemlins/kissy2.gif[/img] thanks!

Sook... This is and was always meant to BE a serious thread. While I am sure you meant your post to be funny it really isn't quite what I was hoping to have here. I have as much sense of fun and humor as the next person, heaven knows all these people can attest to me off-topicing with the best of them, but in a thread like this, with sensitive issues and important information and exchanges, I'd rather not do that.

Aelia! Wow.. I can sure sympathize! Without a lot of long stories or details, I can say I've encountered a fair number of perverts and sickos in my day and it is NOT unusual by any means.. it's why I felt that this was a good topic to introduce. I think many people (especially women) think it is just them that experience these things or like you did, think it is somehow their own fault! And many never realize that it isn't. So I hope that learning about other people's experiences, seeing options to avoid or reduce harm.. will be a positive influence.

Cloudy

[ 01-30-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]

01-30-2002, 08:53 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Cloudbringer:

I'm most glad I didn't have to find out.. I suspect that's when I'd panic.

Cloudy

You'd be surprised how much you remember if the situation becomes one where you must react hand to hand. Martial arts does not just teach you the techniques to disable an attacker, but also concentration and focus...things that stay with you long after the lessons are over.

I'd reccommend the basics of Tae Kwan Do and Jujitsu for every single woman on the planet, whether they are able to scream or not...when it comes to a life or death situation, the instinct to survive rules, not common sense, not rationality...getting yourself out of an attacker's grasp and keeping them from coming at you is plenty enough to get you to a safer place where you can then think, scream or whatever you need to after the fact. Screaming won't help if a hand is over your mouth and if your hands are grabbed to keep you from using them, a screaming device isn't going to be of much help and believe me, a man who is determined enough can disable your hands and hold your mouth closd at the same time...there are ways to get yourself out of those types of holds that a little knowledge of tae kwan do and jujitsu can provide.

Cloudbringer · 01-30-2002, 09:21 PM

Moni,

Thanks for your last post. I think you make a few very good points. I guess it's hard to tell how you'll react til the moment is upon you, but I'd like to think that some training would become instinctive in that situation.

Cloudy

Nachtrafe · 01-31-2002, 01:56 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Cloudbringer:
Moni,

Thanks for your last post. I think you make a few very good points. I guess it's hard to tell how you'll react til the moment is upon you, but I'd like to think that some training would become instinctive in that situation.

Cloudy

That's the whole point of the training love. To make it instinctive. [img]smile.gif[/img]

One thing...I have to respectfully disagree with you Moni on a small point. While jujitsu *is* good, most(not all, but most) Tae Kwan Do training sucks! The American TKD Association has turned a noble, serious, wonderful Art into a 'happy meal'-ized cash cow. I have studied in 3 differnt TKD schools and toured with/sparred with/been in tournaments with many other schools. And the pervasive attitude was NOT one of readiness or preparedness. It was one of COCKYNESS AND ARROGANCE! And I guarantee, both of those things WILL get you hurt in a bad situation.

Now, that's not to say that there aren't good TKD schools out there...there are...but the good ones are harder to find than you think. Anyway...this is just my opinion, but it *is* based on some rather unpleasant personal experiences.

And, just another IMO. For joe/jane average, one of the best options is a good self-defense course at the YMCA. Unless you're up for a multi-year commitment, you wont get much out of the commercial martial arts besides the ability to perform nifty kata's. And the more serious ones are a lifetime commitment. IMO, the more down and dirty self defense classes are the way to go. Its what I taught for a few years, and its served me, and my students, very well.

LennonCook · 01-31-2002, 02:17 AM

EEP... [img]graemlins/hidesbehindsofa.gif[/img] sorry Cloudy... I didnt mean for it to be taken that way... I was actually trying to say (in a very roundabout and different way, as is my style), that if you only have 1 last resort to get out of a situation, USE IT. Dont give up, EVER.

Oh, BTW- one thing im interested in, which im hoping someone will be able to answer...

Is it possible to get any proper training in a Melee weapon, such as a sword ?? I would also prefer if there were a LEGAL manner... it makes it so much easier to stay on the street...

WOLFGIR · 01-31-2002, 04:16 AM

If you like to survive, in an extreme situation, I am not talking about Tae Kwon Do, Karate.. They are competition sports now. You need something more "aggressive" tougher and more up to date with modern society. Krav Maga teaches to defend youself against all possible threats, hold up by knife, gun. Strangulations, kicks, wrestling hig kicks, low kicks, take downs, arm bars. Being pushed from behind/side.

Most important is that in Krav Maga you really do try your outmost and you train as realistic as you can. The strangulation training is to be "aware" how long you can be strangled until you have to act. You learn how to see attacks in time and act on them. And for you who might say that sure, but male are stronger than most females. I have seen big blonde (hehe kidding with ya here) bouncers from famous bars being put down by a girls that I could easily lift and toss away, and I have also been on the receiving end of thoose girls!

It works, but also Krav Maga is extreme and you should really check out the group before you start training. It is important that you find a group (regardless of style) that you like.

You will also be amazed over how much you can do and how much you learn. It´s really hard training and none of the martial arts I have trained so far cancompare to Krav Maga.

Epona · 01-31-2002, 07:24 AM

quote:
Originally posted by LennonCook:

Is it possible to get any proper training in a Melee weapon, such as a sword ?? I would also prefer if there were a LEGAL manner... it makes it so much easier to stay on the street...

That is an interesting question - I know in the UK it is illegal to carry a sword or a knife on the street unless it is a religious item such as might be carried by Druid priests (if priest is the right word?) for ritual purposes. It would be illegal to use a ritual blade in an offensive or defensive way though.

01-30-2002, 04:58 PM	#72
Nachtrafe Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: August 9, 2001 Location: Upstate NY, USA Age: 52 Posts: 889	Offers Lennon a stiff drink [img]smile.gif[/img] LOL...Just felt that this thread needed a BUMP __________________ ~~OFFICIAL BOYTOY OF CLOUDY'S CAFE....WELL...OK...JUST CLOUDY!~~ "May the wings of liberty never lose a feather!"

01-30-2002, 05:24 PM	#73
Aelia Jusa Iron Throne Cult Join Date: August 23, 2001 Location: Brisbane, Australia Age: 43 Posts: 4,867	Cloudy, Epona, LadyZ, the way you handled those situations you were in is really inspirational for me. I think especially that you kept calm and didn't panic and could remember the right things to do is very important. My personal experience with something like this isn't quite so bad since I wasn't really in any danger, but I think it highlights some things about sexual assault especially. So I was about 14, and in the train with a friend travelling up to another friend's house. We were sitting in one of those seats that has another seat facing you. And this man got on at one of the stops and sat across from us. The carriage had a number of other people in it. And he was wearing really short shorts, and after while I realised he had his hand down his pants. And then we noticed he had maneuvered himself so his penis was showing from under his shorts. And we didn't really know what to do so we didn't do anything since our stop was soon and there were other people around so he couldn't really do anything. And then we got to our stop and we got out and that was that. So we were safe the whole time, but from that incident I can really understand why people who are sexually assaulted feel responsible, because my very first thought was that it was somehow my fault. Like was it the way I was sitting, or what I was wearing, or how I glanced at him when he first sat down. And also the fact that I immediately denied it as anything I should be upset about. __________________

01-30-2002, 06:10 PM	#74
Cloudbringer Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Upstate NY USA Posts: 19,737	Nacht... [img]graemlins/kissy2.gif[/img] thanks! Sook... This is and was always meant to BE a serious thread. While I am sure you meant your post to be funny it really isn't quite what I was hoping to have here. I have as much sense of fun and humor as the next person, heaven knows all these people can attest to me off-topicing with the best of them, but in a thread like this, with sensitive issues and important information and exchanges, I'd rather not do that. Aelia! Wow.. I can sure sympathize! Without a lot of long stories or details, I can say I've encountered a fair number of perverts and sickos in my day and it is NOT unusual by any means.. it's why I felt that this was a good topic to introduce. I think many people (especially women) think it is just them that experience these things or like you did, think it is somehow their own fault! And many never realize that it isn't. So I hope that learning about other people's experiences, seeing options to avoid or reduce harm.. will be a positive influence. Cloudy [ 01-30-2002: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ] __________________ "Don't take life for granted." Animal (may he rest in peace)

01-30-2002, 08:53 PM	#75
Moni Guest Posts: n/a	quote: Originally posted by Cloudbringer: I'm most glad I didn't have to find out.. I suspect that's when I'd panic. Cloudy You'd be surprised how much you remember if the situation becomes one where you must react hand to hand. Martial arts does not just teach you the techniques to disable an attacker, but also concentration and focus...things that stay with you long after the lessons are over. I'd reccommend the basics of Tae Kwan Do and Jujitsu for every single woman on the planet, whether they are able to scream or not...when it comes to a life or death situation, the instinct to survive rules, not common sense, not rationality...getting yourself out of an attacker's grasp and keeping them from coming at you is plenty enough to get you to a safer place where you can then think, scream or whatever you need to after the fact. Screaming won't help if a hand is over your mouth and if your hands are grabbed to keep you from using them, a screaming device isn't going to be of much help and believe me, a man who is determined enough can disable your hands and hold your mouth closd at the same time...there are ways to get yourself out of those types of holds that a little knowledge of tae kwan do and jujitsu can provide.

01-30-2002, 09:21 PM	#76
Cloudbringer Ironworks Moderator Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Upstate NY USA Posts: 19,737	Moni, Thanks for your last post. I think you make a few very good points. I guess it's hard to tell how you'll react til the moment is upon you, but I'd like to think that some training would become instinctive in that situation. Cloudy __________________ "Don't take life for granted." Animal (may he rest in peace)

01-30-2002, 12:35 AM	#71
LennonCook Jack Burton Join Date: November 10, 2001 Location: Bathurst & Orange, in constant flux Age: 38 Posts: 5,452	Or if your in a big forrest, noone around for miles, no hope of excaping, no real training in self defence (this ofcourse should not happen, but it may) then there is one defense left: Start singing something like " HO Tom Bombadil, Tom Bombadillo!! By water, read and log, by the wind and willow!! By fire sun and moon, harken now and hear us, Ho Tom Bombadill, for our need is near us!!" And then you can hope 1 of 2 things... The first is that some wierd looking guy will run up singing "Old Tom Bombadil is a merry fellow, Bright Blue his jacket is, and his boots are yellow!! None have caught him yet for, Tom he is the master, His songs are stronger songs, and his feet are faster!! and help you... The second, and more likely, is that your assailent will be scared away from the utter stupidness of it. Neither ofcourse is very likely, but if it is your only chance, then well... you probably dont stand a chance !!

01-31-2002, 01:56 AM	#77
Nachtrafe Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: August 9, 2001 Location: Upstate NY, USA Age: 52 Posts: 889	quote: Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Moni, Thanks for your last post. I think you make a few very good points. I guess it's hard to tell how you'll react til the moment is upon you, but I'd like to think that some training would become instinctive in that situation. Cloudy That's the whole point of the training love. To make it instinctive. [img]smile.gif[/img] One thing...I have to respectfully disagree with you Moni on a small point. While jujitsu is good, most(not all, but most) Tae Kwan Do training sucks! The American TKD Association has turned a noble, serious, wonderful Art into a 'happy meal'-ized cash cow. I have studied in 3 differnt TKD schools and toured with/sparred with/been in tournaments with many other schools. And the pervasive attitude was NOT one of readiness or preparedness. It was one of COCKYNESS AND ARROGANCE! And I guarantee, both of those things WILL get you hurt in a bad situation. Now, that's not to say that there aren't good TKD schools out there...there are...but the good ones are harder to find than you think. Anyway...this is just my opinion, but it is based on some rather unpleasant personal experiences. And, just another IMO. For joe/jane average, one of the best options is a good self-defense course at the YMCA. Unless you're up for a multi-year commitment, you wont get much out of the commercial martial arts besides the ability to perform nifty kata's. And the more serious ones are a lifetime commitment. IMO, the more down and dirty self defense classes are the way to go. Its what I taught for a few years, and its served me, and my students, very well. __________________ ~~OFFICIAL BOYTOY OF CLOUDY'S CAFE....WELL...OK...JUST CLOUDY!~~ "May the wings of liberty never lose a feather!"

01-31-2002, 02:17 AM	#78
LennonCook Jack Burton Join Date: November 10, 2001 Location: Bathurst & Orange, in constant flux Age: 38 Posts: 5,452	EEP... [img]graemlins/hidesbehindsofa.gif[/img] sorry Cloudy... I didnt mean for it to be taken that way... I was actually trying to say (in a very roundabout and different way, as is my style), that if you only have 1 last resort to get out of a situation, USE IT. Dont give up, EVER. Oh, BTW- one thing im interested in, which im hoping someone will be able to answer... Is it possible to get any proper training in a Melee weapon, such as a sword ?? I would also prefer if there were a LEGAL manner... it makes it so much easier to stay on the street...

01-31-2002, 04:16 AM	#79
WOLFGIR Bastet - Egyptian Cat Goddess Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: Sweden Age: 51 Posts: 3,450	If you like to survive, in an extreme situation, I am not talking about Tae Kwon Do, Karate.. They are competition sports now. You need something more "aggressive" tougher and more up to date with modern society. Krav Maga teaches to defend youself against all possible threats, hold up by knife, gun. Strangulations, kicks, wrestling hig kicks, low kicks, take downs, arm bars. Being pushed from behind/side. Most important is that in Krav Maga you really do try your outmost and you train as realistic as you can. The strangulation training is to be "aware" how long you can be strangled until you have to act. You learn how to see attacks in time and act on them. And for you who might say that sure, but male are stronger than most females. I have seen big blonde (hehe kidding with ya here) bouncers from famous bars being put down by a girls that I could easily lift and toss away, and I have also been on the receiving end of thoose girls! It works, but also Krav Maga is extreme and you should really check out the group before you start training. It is important that you find a group (regardless of style) that you like. You will also be amazed over how much you can do and how much you learn. It´s really hard training and none of the martial arts I have trained so far cancompare to Krav Maga. __________________ Don´t eat the yellow snow

01-31-2002, 07:24 AM	#80
Epona Zartan Join Date: March 1, 2001 Location: London, England Age: 54 Posts: 5,164	quote: Originally posted by LennonCook: Is it possible to get any proper training in a Melee weapon, such as a sword ?? I would also prefer if there were a LEGAL manner... it makes it so much easier to stay on the street... That is an interesting question - I know in the UK it is illegal to carry a sword or a knife on the street unless it is a religious item such as might be carried by Druid priests (if priest is the right word?) for ritual purposes. It would be illegal to use a ritual blade in an offensive or defensive way though. __________________ [img]\"http://www.wizardrealm.com/images/epona.gif\" alt=\" - \" />

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