ONE question to all the atheists out there....

[Yorick]

Originally posted by GokuZool: quote: Originally posted by homer: quote: Originally posted by GokuZool: If God is so powerful and wonderful then why is there war and poverty?

War and poverty are by products of humanity, not religion.[/QUOTE]Yeah, but can't he resurect people [/QUOTE]All in good time.

[The Hunter of Jahanna]

King James version of the bible

This is another pet peev of mine with religion. Why are there 10 diffrent versions of the bible?? What ever happened to this is gods word?? Where is the "Hey this is God,so pay attention" version of the bible? 10 diffrent versions cant all be right,especialy since I have seen discusions on this board about which version is more correct. If there is a more correct version that means that there are versions that are utter shite floating around as well. Same thing goes for the other religions. Any book store has half a dozen versions of every core religous text. How can 6 diffrent versions of the qu'ran all be right?? If the followers cant all agree on what the word of god is or isnt how can the rest of us even consider it. It might not do any harm to believe in god, but what happens if the book you have has the wrong directions in it?

[Yorick]

Originally posted by The Hunter of Jahanna: quote: King James version of the bible

This is another pet peev of mine with religion. Why are there 10 diffrent versions of the bible?? What ever happened to this is gods word?? Where is the "Hey this is God,so pay attention" version of the bible? 10 diffrent versions cant all be right,especialy since I have seen discusions on this board about which version is more correct. If there is a more correct version that means that there are versions that are utter shite floating around as well. Same thing goes for the other religions. Any book store has half a dozen versions of every core religous text. How can 6 diffrent versions of the qu'ran all be right?? If the followers cant all agree on what the word of god is or isnt how can the rest of us even consider it. It might not do any harm to believe in god, but what happens if the book you have has the wrong directions in it?[/QUOTE]They're not versions, they're TRANSLATIONS. "More correct" means "most accurate translation" as regarded by the majority of scholars worldwide. The Bible was written in Hebrew, Koine Greek and Aramaic. What are people supposed to do? Learn those three languages to read Gods word?

As language changes, so new translations become necessary. We don't speak "old English" of King James time, so a new translation is necessary. Various translations are attempted by different groups, which is why there are so many. Ultimately, the original languages convey the truest word, and so many Christian ministers do actually learn those languages - my father being one such person.

Islam's Qu'ran (written in Arabic) has various English translations by individuals rather than groups floating around, but then the Qu'ran is considerably smaller than the Bible.

[ 01-22-2003, 01:29 AM: Message edited by: Yorick ]

[AzRaeL StoRmBlaDe]

Originally posted by Cloudbringer: Vaskie, you really astound me some days! [img]graemlins/kiss.gif[/img] What a fascinating post. And you bring forth a concept my own priest mentions frequently. I am a believer and the way I see it, I'd rather be 'wrong' about that than be an atheist and be 'wrong' that way! Your points are exactly the ones I'd have used. What harm if one lives a life of faith- or tries very hard to do what is right by that belief and leaves that legacy behind- with or without the afterlife? But if one lives as though there is no God, and in the end you find you've been grievously in error- well, that's not the end I'd prefer even if I WASN'T already a believer... but yes, Azrael's point is key here. You cannot force faith and belief on anyone. It's something that each of us finds for ourselves. Our relationships with God are personal and individual. I can no more 'force' my beliefs on someone else than I could force a Camel to shoot water through it's nostrils and make elephant noises.

Well I don't really mean that someone is forcing their beliefs on me, but if I strictly believed in something because of that scenario, I would simply be forcing those beliefs upon myself, because deep down I still wouldn't believe in them. I would just try to logically convince myself that I should because of the alternative. I still wouldn't have real faith, which is after all, important in the end. I don't know if I am making any sense to anyone here, but if I am, and somone can explain it better, please do, my mind has been wandering as of late. . .

Afterthought: Ohh, I've seen a camel do that once, but I had to pay top dollar for the opportunity. Camels that act like elephants don't come cheap you know

[ 01-22-2003, 01:57 AM: Message edited by: AzRaeL StoRmBlaDe ]

[AzRaeL StoRmBlaDe]

As another after thought as well, I think it is unfair to judge it like that in the first place. Basically, because your set of beliefs says that I will go to hell if I don't believe in God, I should believe in it because it is the better of two scenario's? Maybe in my set of beliefs there is one scenario. You die and then that's it. Again there is nothing to prove which theory is right or wrong, but I would already have that belief value in me. Had I already that belief value in me, I would be convinced of it being correct, and therefore, the fact that if believing your religion gave me a 50% chance according to your religion, would have absolutely no bearing on my belief system, because I would to begin with, be convinced that you are completely wrong in your veiw of things, so I would veiw your personal beliefs to that topic as irrelevant, speaking as one that would be an atheist. As an athiest it would be a waste of my time to observe your religion, as I would completely not beleive in it to begin with.

Again I might be losing some people, but if you get me and can explain better please do. basically I am saying that If i was an athiest already, your believes wouldn't hold any value in my culture, thus the initial question would be irrelevant.

[esquire]

Ah, very interesting thread. I'm always interested in seeing different perspectives on how people view their world.

OK, so here is mine...

As an atheist, and thus not believing in the concept of a god, I look forward to being pleasantly surprised when I die and end up in hell. [img]smile.gif[/img] It would be more than what I’m expecting to happen! From all I have seen of the world, I have come to the conclusion that religion does play the important role of keeping people in line to an extent… acting as the ‘glue’ of a society. It provides stability, direction, and instills hope—usually all good things.

IMO the creation of the concept of god by humanity is an act of vanity on our part. As humans living on a tiny planet, orbiting an average star, in a small corner of the milky way galaxy, are we not pushing it a bit to make the assumption that we are even remotely significant or unique among the billions and billions and billions of other planets?

Well perhaps we aren’t and we really are that special, I don’t know. Perhaps a few centuries from now we will have some more concrete answers. IMO, I just think that believing in a god is just jumping to a premature conclusion. The universe is much more complicated than we give it credit for.

[Iron_Ranger]

I hate to jump in the middle of a disscussion like this and kind of derail it a bit, but it would be kind of senceless to create a whole new topic on it, when there is already one so similar to it.

But anyway, here is another question for Athiest. You know how you always hear people finding Jesus or God, well, if they did infact not exsist what are these people talking about finding?

Could millions of people around the world all be finding nothing, but all feel the same way? Seems a bit odd if thats the case doesnt it?

You know what I mean?

[esquire]

Originally posted by Iron_Ranger: Could millions of people around the world all be finding nothing, but all feel the same way? Seems a bit odd if thats the case doesnt it? You know what I mean?

Well.... a lot of people claim to have been abducted by aliens... and many of their descriptions are strikingly similar...so are they really being abducted by aliens?

IMO pretty much everything boils down to chemical interactions in our brain (tunnel of light anyone?), Indeed, quite an unromantic notion.

[Iron_Ranger]

Originally posted by esquire: Well.... a lot of people claim to have been abducted by aliens... and many of their descriptions are strikingly similar...so are they really being abducted by aliens? IMO pretty much everything boils down to chemical interactions in our brain (tunnel of light anyone?), Indeed, quite an unromantic notion.[/QB]

True, I am not claiming to be an expert on the matter, its just something that I thought of. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 01-22-2003, 04:33 AM: Message edited by: Iron_Ranger ]

[esquire]

Originally posted by Iron_Ranger: True, I am not claiming to be an expert on the matter, its just something that I thought of. [img]smile.gif[/img] [/QB]

Heh, I'm just as confused as anyone !