John Pilger's religion.

[Fljotsdale]

quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick:

Cannot the stone be beautiful? The shape of many squares creating a rectangle? Simple, timeless. Anyone could have made it.

That is the key. Anyone can go and make a pile of bricks, and look at it with the satisfaction that we have made art.

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Exactly!!!!! No skill involved!

You are a musician - can ANYONE pick up a musical instrument and make good music with it if they have no training (and are possibly tonedeaf)? They would produce NOISE, not music, right?
Same with this modern so-called-art. If there is no skill, no talent involved, how can what they produce be called art? Any more than a non-musical person could produce a sonata the first time they tinkled the keys of a piano?

A lot of your argument doesn't make any sense to me. Some does - there IS beauty in simplicity, there is drama in ugliness. These things CAN be art, and they can also NOT be art.

Let me quote a dictionary definition of art:

"Human creative skill or its application, branch of creative activity concerned with imitative and imaginative designs, e.g. painting; fine arts; thing in which skill can be exercised; certain branches of learning (esp. languages, literature, history, etc) as distinct from sciences."

[Yorick]

quote:

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Originally posted by Fljotsdale:


Exactly!!!!! No skill involved!

You are a musician - can ANYONE pick up a musical instrument and make good music with it if they have no training (and are possibly tonedeaf)? They would produce NOISE, not music, right?

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No training! Try me! Self taught and I play seven or so intruments plus program on VST/Protools etc.

If they couldn't play a standard instrument they could DJ and make art, or be considered experimental.

R.E.M. sung the praises of lesser skill when they picked up mandolins for their groundbreaking album....XXXXXX (can't remember the name, it had "losing my religion" on it).

It makes you look at the melodies differently. Simpler. Things you avoid once proficient.

[Yorick]

quote:

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Originally posted by Fljotsdale:


"Human creative skill or its application, branch of creative activity concerned with imitative and imaginative designs, e.g. painting; fine arts; thing in which skill can be exercised; certain branches of learning (esp. languages, literature, history, etc) as distinct from sciences."

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Exactly, things in which skill CAN be exercised, not necessarily ARE.

"Bricks" is imaginative, and imitative of parts of life.

[Fljotsdale]

quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick:


No training! Try me! Self taught and I play seven or so intruments plus program on VST/Protools etc.

If they couldn't play a standard instrument they could DJ and make art, or be considered experimental.

R.E.M. sung the praises of lesser skill when they picked up mandolins for their groundbreaking album....XXXXXX (can't remember the name, it had "losing my religion" on it).

It makes you look at the melodies differently. Simpler. Things you avoid once proficient.

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Well, I've presented my views, you've presented yours, and we don't agree!
Being self-taught doesn't make you any less 'taught' does it? It just means you have more talent and more persistance than average!

And did you start playing publically before you had attained some degree of proficiency?

Anyway, let's call it a day, shall we? I'd like this thread to have more contributers than just us - it needs to be in Gen Dis with a new title....

I've started a thread in Gen Dis with a link to page 2 of this thread, so maybe don't post in this one any more, ok? At least, not on the art thing. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 11-16-2001: Message edited by: Fljotsdale ]